My Hyfire II Installed...and a Concern

Now - with the CO Issue - in order to use the coal stove for the reiander of the winter - I think I am going to disconnect the flue pipe for the oil furnace and cap off the T so the flue into the chimney is only being used by the coal stove. With this setup the oil burner would never be in use while the coal stove is working - In essence the oil furnace would not be in use - only its fan motor via a thermostat switch hooked up the coal stove. Unless I am not seeing something I think this shoud work...

AJ,

In essence, that is how we have our AA-260 hooked up here at the house. Ours is hooked up parallel so we can only run one at a time. It works fine that way. I also used metal tape to seal each jount in the pipe and to seal the cap onto the "T."

Where are you located ??? Perhaps a member can loan your their manometer to check your install.

Thew 2 large fans on the back of the Hyfire II are to be removed in an install like yours. It allows better airflow around the jacket to be drawn into your cold air return.

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Rick

rberq wrote:I think I am going to disconnect the flue pipe for the oil furnace and cap off the T so the flue into the chimney is only being used by the coal stove. With this setup the oil burner would never be in use while the coal stove is working - In essence the oil furnace would not be in use - only its fan motor via a thermostat switch hooked up the coal stove. Unless I am not seeing something I think this shoud work...

Yes, it sounds like that should work. You should check what the coal unit draft setting should be -- presumably the baro damper is still set for the oil burner, so you may need to change it.

edit: don't know why the quote is attributing your post to me???? I must have clicked something wrong....

OK..last night I disconnected the oil furnace flue pipe from the T connection and capped off the T connection so only the coal stove was using the flue and chimney. I fired it back up and everything seemed to be fine - I kept checking the CO detector levels and all was at 0 when we went to bed around 10:30pm.

I woke up at 3:00am and decided to check on things...when I checked the Detectors the one in the basement had recorded a peak level of 25 PPM sometime during the night and the one upstairs had recorded a peak level of 20 PPM sometime overnight. Of course I shut it down again and am now wondering what is next.

As I sit here thinking - here is one observation - while the stove was at full / high fire and the air was being blown through the ductwork while we were still awake - all appeared fine with the CO readings of 0 PPM. It appears that maybe the problem occurs when the stove goes into the lowest rate feed overnight just to maintain the burning coal. Could that mean anything? Would that point to some type of drafting issue - where something was going on with the draft / CO when the stove was operating at a lower temp? Could a draft setting / issue be the cause of the CO levels? vs. the flue configuration? I know some of you were talking about the draft in earlier posts - but I am not sure I understand how a draf setting issue would cause this?

(on a side note - regardless of what this turns out to be - I am only going to have 1 appliance hooked up to the flue connection at a time from now on.

In response to Rick - I am located in Central NY - 40 min. north of Syracuse actually...

Well..it's 4:30am - and I guess I am off to disconnect the coal stove and hook the oil furnace back up just to get some heat in the house while I attempt to figure this all out...I felt like I was doing a good thing, trying to go with an alternate heating option....and now I am only hoping it wasn't a complete waste of a significant amount of money and energy...hopefully I can get this figured out...the wife isn't too happy at the moment...she's a bit cold right now

AJtheNewbie wrote:Well..it's 4:30am - and I guess I am off to disconnect the coal stove and hook the oil furnace back up just to get some heat in the house while I attempt to figure this all out...I felt like I was doing a good thing, trying to go with an alternate heating option....and now I am only hoping it wasn't a complete waste of a significant amount of money and energy...hopefully I can get this figured out...the wife isn't too happy at the moment...she's a bit cold right now

Being cold does make things hard but hang in there. The guys from the Forum will help you clear this up in no time and you'll be experiencing the warmest house ever at the cheapest cost. From what I've seen everyone burning coal hits the "I'm only hoping it wasn't a complete waste of significant amount of money and energy" wall before finding the solution to the problem. I know I did. It may take a couple of days but at least you still have heat in the house while you figure it out. Hang in there! Lisa

Maybe someone asked this already but I notice a black stain at the clean out door on your block chimney.
Did you burn wood in this before? Have you cleaned the chimney ?
Do you have a cap or rain cover on the chimney ?
If you want an option to run your oil anytime you like ,consider a Power Vent for the oil only.
Would be fast and cheaper than another flue.

Do you have the Coal Trol hooked up? What are you settings? MIN/MAX, etc...you may have to turn the min up a couple to get a better draft at lower burn rates. It may go into Idle mode and your draft starts to drop off.

What happens in IDLE, if not set high enough, the heat going up the chimney slows down, therefore, not pulling enough exhaust out of the stove.

Which side is the weight on the baro? Can you post a picture of it.

Make sure all the gaskets on the doors are good, chimney has no blockage, the baro is adjusted correctly.

I think it is a good decision to shut it down at the moment. I didn't see it in the previous posts, although I could have missed it, but you need to get a manometer and measure the draft at your different burn rates. Grainger sells them, if you have a store locally you wouldn't have to wait for it to be shipped via web or catalog order.

Hi,
You will get plenty of help here. First make sure your barometric is set at #4. When you restart the stove, just use one burner. Do not lite the second. Do as Dave suggested, turn you min up to 11. If this works then lite the second. If the problem reoccurs then you need help with the draft. A draft inducer would solve the problem.
Thanks,
Jerry

To echo TimV's question, is the chimney clean? And describe the chimney -- roughly how tall is it, from cellar floor to the top of the chimney?

Your stove pipe appears to be made largely of those infinitely-adjustable elbows. That means lots of joints, lots of small potential leaks, though that would probably not cause a problem unless draft is marginal.

Can you use a mirror, and look up the inside of the chimney via the clean out door? Make sure the stove pipe is not stuck way into the chimney and right up to the opposite wall, which would block the end of the pipe. Not likely, but easy to check.

Another repeat question: what's the baro setting, and can you post a picture of the baro?

I'm certainly no expert, having installed my first coal stove just last week. So my opinion may not even be in the right ball park...

In looking at the pictures of your installation, I'm guessing the number of turns in your stove pipe to the chimney may be limiting your draft. I'm seeing three 90 degree turns which may act as 'resistance' to a good air flow. Also, as mentioned above, make sure the thimble (chimney inlet) does not extend more than an inch or so into the vertical part of the chimney. That would also be a draft killer. With high fire, the heat of the gases probably have no problem 'forcing' their way past the turns. But on low fire, there may not be enough heat to really develop enough draft 'force'.

Would a more 'direct' approach be possible...say 2 flexible turns at about 50-60 degrees each? I'm hoping the support column in the picture doesn't prevent that.

You should only have 2 elbows. Try to make your run out the back of the stove at a angle into your chimney.
Jerry

First...thanks for the support, help, and encouragement - I am looking forward to working through it and getting this working right...

In answer to some of your questions....

Yes - at one point in the life of the chimney - I believe the previous owners burned wood - but that was probabaly more than 10 years ago - and I cleaned the chimney prior to the coal stove install.

No - the flue pipe entering the chimney does not stick out into the chimney flue - the inside chimney flue is approx 7"x10" and is free of any blockage. Also - The chimey does not have any type of cap...

The settings for the Coal-trol that the installer set are MIN=6 MAX=40

Also - I believe I can reconfigure the flue pipe so that it angles and only has 2 elbows.

I have also attached some pics of the Baro I just took...
the first 2 pics show it drafting when the oil furnace on...
the 3d pic is a closeup of the weight on the right had side of the "L" braket on the "door" of the Baro...and as far left in that slot as it can go
the 4th pic is just a look inside the Baro with the door wide open - this Baro seems to be a "unit" attached to the pipe - I'm not sure if that is how they all are (vs. what I would consider to be a piece/unit that is inserted between flue pipe.)
the 5th pic show the Baro position after the furnace stopped running - the door continued to open and close a bit even after the furnace shut down...

Ok - I hope this helps...let me know if you need to know anything else...thank you all very much.

AJtheNewbie wrote:chimney flue - the inside chimney flue is approx 7"x10"

That could be the problem right there. The flue may be to big, when you are burning at a higher temp the stove has no trouble keeping the chimney warm and a good draft. BUT when the stove drops down to an idle it can't keep it warm enough and you are losing your draft.

Aj, one thing I did notice in the pics is your baro weight seems to be on the wrong side. It should be on the left if your baro is a type RC and is built the same as mine. If you look at the numbers on the scale you should see an H on the left and V on the right. Your pipe is horizontal so it should be on the H side. I can't see the scale on yours so I could be wrong, but double check to be sure.

Jeff

Yes, check the weight position, most HORIZONTAL mounting, should be on left side, it changes the angle and will open/close easier for the less flow in a horizontal pipe.

You can check the http://www.fieldcontrols.com website for installation manual.

Inside the pipe, looks like the HOLE into the main pipe that the baro is install into the duct work isnt' big enough, it should be as big as the side pipe.

YOu can get either the TEE with the baro or a kit to make your own by cutting the main pipe and attaching the baro, which could be what they did with yours.