Another Obama attack on the 2A

Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: pvolcko On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 4:57 am

The 2 million figure sounds more like a planned budget increase will be nixed, leaving the prior baseline budget in place. The program runs more like $25 million a year, I think. I hate it when people call these kinds of reductions in budget growth "cuts". :mad:

Money aside, have you guys seen the holsters the pilots are mandated to use?

I *censored* you not, there is an actual combination pad lock on them. :shock:

http://www.crimefilenews.com/2008/03/training-of-federal-flight-deck.html

I saw the picture and I figured, "Got to be a photoshop job," right? Then I read the article and watched the video... only could a government bureaucracy come up with such a useless, counter productive, anti-safety design and requirement. Let the certified pilots carry concealed in all secured areas they have access to and be done with it, instead of this locking, unlocking, locking, unlocking, etc. BS.

I still wonder if it is fake photo and video. I just can't believe it.
pvolcko
 

Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: LsFarm On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:25 am

It's true, Obama is pulling out the stops to slip as much anti-gun legislation through while the country is numbed by the economy and unemployment. The approvals for FFDO training have dropped to almost none since the election..

2 million?? That's about the cost of ink lost due to evaporation from all the money the new president is printing.. He just wants to disarm the country, at least the legal citizen.. NONE of the current or new legislation will reduce the number of armed criminals or potential criminals.. a person who lives on the other side of the law doesn't care about laws.. by definition. So all this is about disarming the legal population..not about saving money.

Now think about this.. every day thousands of people are killed or injured in car accidents.. but maybe one or two a week by legal firearms... think about that..

Take a look at this new gem:

More Gun Control Introduced in Congress :


The liberals are at it again. In a new bill introduced the first day of present session of Congress, and with zero coverage from the MSM, H.R. 45 (Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009) targets all gun owners in the U.S.A.

This nefarious bill seeks to strip us all of our Constitutional Rights to possess and bear firearms of any distinction. It requires, within the first two years, that all new guns be registered. The bill goes retroactive after two years. Meaning that two years after the passage of the bill, ALL FIREARMS in a citizen’s possession must be registered, not just those purchased after the bill passes, and this apparently applies to antique firearms as well.

Every five years the firearm owner must go through a complete renewal process for each weapon owned. Failure to comply carries stiff penalties including confiscation of the firearms and jail time (penalties as high as ten years imprisonment in some cases). The bill also authorizes government searches without warrant, the creation of a federal bureaucracy to monitor firearm possession, etc.
The following is a summary of the bill as provided by the Congressional Research Service. If you read the whole bill, you'll find it will effectively preclude the ownership of any firearms by law-abiding people unless directly licensed by the Attorney General :

1/6/2009--Introduced. Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 - Amends the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act to prohibit a person from possessing a firearm unless that person has been issued a firearm license under this Act or a state system certified under this Act and such license has not been invalidated or revoked. Prescribes license application, issuance, and renewal requirements.

Prohibits transferring or receiving a qualifying firearm unless the recipient presents a valid firearms license, the license is verified, and the dealer records a tracking authorization number. Prescribes firearms transfer reporting and record keeping requirements. Directs the Attorney General to establish and maintain a federal record of sale system.

Prohibits: (1) transferring a firearm to any person other than a licensee, unless the transfer is processed through a licensed dealer in accordance with national instant criminal background check system requirements, with exceptions; (2) licensed manufacturer or dealer from failing to comply with reporting and record keeping requirements of this Act;
(3) failing to report the loss or theft of the firearm to the Attorney General within 72 hours; (4) failing to report to the Attorney General an address change within 60 days; (5)
keeping a loaded firearm, or an unloaded firearm and ammunition for the firearm, knowingly or recklessly disregarding the risk that a child is capable of gaining access, if a child uses the firearm and causes death or serious bodily injury.

Prescribes criminal penalties for violations of firearms provisions covered by this Act. Directs the Attorney General to: (1) establish and maintain a firearm injury information clearinghouse; (2) conduct continuing studies and investigations of firearm-related deaths and injuries; and (3) collect and maintain current production and sales figures of each licensed manufacturer. Authorizes the Attorney General to certify state firearm licensing or record of sale systems.

Pretty scary stuff... the constitution... what's that?
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:37 am

LsFarm wrote:The bill also authorizes government searches without warrant, the creation of a federal bureaucracy to monitor firearm possession, etc.


While I admit I haven't read it yet, as I understand it this bill is merely involved with the sale or transfer of firearms & any LEO has always had the right to "pat down" a suspect for firearms, (without a warrant) for safety reasons. Is that the "Search" you are referring to?
Do you carry a firearm while flying Greg? (if there are reasons you'd rather not answer that question I certainly understand)
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:48 am

It seems that this bill (H.R.45) is aimed at closing "Gun Show" loopholes. Whether it's a good bill or not, I don't know at this point but it's hard to get past the blizzard of Fox News/NRA attacks against it. Here is a statement from Sen Jack Reed (a decorated Vietnam vet)



Last edited by Devil505 on Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: cabinover On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:53 am

I don't see how it could be any clearer Devil. Some of you can bury your head in the sand all you want but I'm glad to know about this stuff.

Every five years the firearm owner must go through a complete renewal process for each weapon owned. Failure to comply carries stiff penalties including confiscation of the firearms and jail time (penalties as high as ten years imprisonment in some cases). The bill also authorizes government searches without warrant, the creation of a federal bureaucracy to monitor firearm possession, etc.


The government will come to your house, at any time of night or day, and search for guns without your permission. If you have one that isn't or hasn't been registered in the last 5 years you face jail time.
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:05 am

cabinover wrote:I don't see how it could be any clearer Devil. Some of you can bury your head in the sand all you want but I'm glad to know about this stuff.


I'm not burying anything cabinover. As I said above, I have not read the bill & am trying to find it rather than reading the usual NRA hysteria against ANY gun control bill, If anyone has a link to either the bill itself or a reliable source for opinion, I'd welcome a link.
As a private citizen/multiple gun owner myself, I would not be in favor of any bill that really restricts me or makes me jump through hoops either, but I would be in favor of stopping "gun show" loopholes that don't infringe on my rights or the rights of most lawful gun owners.
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:24 am

Just read this which sounds like no need to get hysterical here & this has nothing to do with the Obama Administration:

OpenCongress Summary:
The Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act would establish a nationwide system for prohibiting unlicensed gun-ownership. If approved, the law would require gun owners to apply for five-year licenses to own firearms, and would give the U.S. Attorney General broad authority over the program. There are no co-sponsors to the bill, and there is very little chance it will be adopted.
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/show
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:27 am

1/6/2009--Introduced.
Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 - Amends the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act to prohibit a person from possessing a firearm unless that person has been issued a firearm license under this Act or a state system certified under this Act and such license has not been invalidated or revoked. Prescribes license application, issuance, and renewal requirements.
Prohibits transferring or receiving a qualifying firearm unless the recipient presents a valid firearms license, the license is verified, and the dealer records a tracking authorization number. Prescribes firearms transfer reporting and record keeping requirements. Directs the Attorney General to establish and maintain a federal record of sale system.
Prohibits:
(1) transferring a firearm to any person other than a licensee, unless the transfer is processed through a licensed dealer in accordance with national instant criminal background check system requirements, with exceptions;
(2) a licensed manufacturer or dealer from failing to comply with reporting and record keeping requirements of this Act;
(3) failing to report the loss or theft of the firearm to the Attorney General within 72 hours;
(4) failing to report to the Attorney General an address change within 60 days; or
(5) keeping a loaded firearm, or an unloaded firearm and ammunition for the firearm, knowingly or recklessly disregarding the risk that a child is capable of gaining access, if a child uses the firearm and causes death or serious bodily injury.
Prescribes criminal penalties for violations of firearms provisions covered by this Act.
Directs the Attorney General to:
(1) establish and maintain a firearm injury information clearinghouse;
(2) conduct continuing studies and investigations of firearm-related deaths and injuries; and
(3) collect and maintain current production and sales figures of each licensed manufacturer.
Authorizes the Attorney General to certify state firearm licensing or record of sale systems.
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/show



I agree that it would be too restrictive & would not be in favor of its passage. Write your Congressman.
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: samhill On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:44 am

I agree that it would be too restrictive & too costly in its present form. I think that if they would inforce the present gun laws already in force that its more than enough & simply close the gun show loop-hole. As the saying goes keep it simple stupid.
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: cabinover On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:45 am

I was just reading that myself and had made it to the part that says I can't sell a gun to you unless we go through a dealer. It's another money grabbing deal if nothing else, $25 to submit an application, pay the gun dealer for his time, crazy.

Still smacks of early gun restriction to me so I'm going to get on the horn to my politicians.
cabinover
 
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: LsFarm On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 1:06 pm

What's to stop our beloved 'officials' from adding an 'administration fee' to the gun license?? In effect a tax to own a perfectly legal firearm?? I can forsee the gun-grabbers being greedy as well and slapping something like a $100 per firearm 'fee' to the license.. a real slick way to generate revenue HUH ?? Then, since it is constitutionally protected, the gun grabbers will just raise the 'fee' on each gun untill a person cannot afford to keep licensening them each 5 years.. the gun-grabbers will then provide a 'legal' way for the legal citizen to give up their constitutionally protected firearms..because the tax is too high.

Really slick Huh?? This the way we lose our rights, and become cattle.. ONLY the criminals will have firearms.. we the legal citizen can use bricks, sticks.. screams and indignation to defend ourselves against criminals.. including those elected to office.

Time to move... the place that freedom created and the bell of freedom rang loud and clear has been crapped upon by the LIbs and Democrats... Nobody wanted to believe that 'the Messiha' could or would do this, but his and his administration's actions and intents are clear.. disarm the citizens and we are cattle and sheep. God help us and our children.


Greg L.
LsFarm
 
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: LsFarm On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 1:12 pm

pvolcko wrote:The 2 million figure sounds more like a planned budget increase will be nixed, leaving the prior baseline budget in place. The program runs more like $25 million a year, I think. I hate it when people call these kinds of reductions in budget growth "cuts". :mad:

Money aside, have you guys seen the holsters the pilots are mandated to use?

I *censored* you not, there is an actual combination pad lock on them. :shock:

http://www.crimefilenews.com/2008/03/training-of-federal-flight-deck.html

I saw the picture and I figured, "Got to be a photoshop job," right? Then I read the article and watched the video... only could a government bureaucracy come up with such a useless, counter productive, anti-safety design and requirement. Let the certified pilots carry concealed in all secured areas they have access to and be done with it, instead of this locking, unlocking, locking, unlocking, etc. BS.

I still wonder if it is fake photo and video. I just can't believe it.



It's true, and this is the reason I haven't applied to the FFDO program yet.. and now it may be too late.. This FFDO training does NOT allow concealed carry of the weapon.. it must be stored in a 'nondescript bag'.. and, it has to be left behind in hotel rooms when on the road. So it is useless except in the cockpit, if even then, due to the burdensome locks, bags, and holsters.


I have to commute to work on other airlines than the one I work for, and hauling around a 'sort of' concealed weapon, that I have to take with me every time I go use the bathroom, or leave my seat... it's like having a 4 pound purse assigned to you.. and you CANNOT use a 'fanny pack' or belt pack.. that makes it a 'concealed weapon'.. but having the 'purse' in hand is OK.... annother brilliant government brainstorm..

Greg L
LsFarm
 
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: SuperBeetle On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:28 pm

Devil505 wrote:1/6/2009--Introduced.
Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 - Amends the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act to prohibit a person from possessing a firearm unless that person has been issued a firearm license under this Act or a state system certified under this Act and such license has not been invalidated or revoked. Prescribes license application, issuance, and renewal requirements.
Prohibits transferring or receiving a qualifying firearm unless the recipient presents a valid firearms license, the license is verified, and the dealer records a tracking authorization number. Prescribes firearms transfer reporting and record keeping requirements. Directs the Attorney General to establish and maintain a federal record of sale system.
Prohibits:
(1) transferring a firearm to any person other than a licensee, unless the transfer is processed through a licensed dealer in accordance with national instant criminal background check system requirements, with exceptions;
(2) a licensed manufacturer or dealer from failing to comply with reporting and record keeping requirements of this Act;
(3) failing to report the loss or theft of the firearm to the Attorney General within 72 hours;
(4) failing to report to the Attorney General an address change within 60 days; or
(5) keeping a loaded firearm, or an unloaded firearm and ammunition for the firearm, knowingly or recklessly disregarding the risk that a child is capable of gaining access, if a child uses the firearm and causes death or serious bodily injury.
Prescribes criminal penalties for violations of firearms provisions covered by this Act.
Directs the Attorney General to:
(1) establish and maintain a firearm injury information clearinghouse;
(2) conduct continuing studies and investigations of firearm-related deaths and injuries; and
(3) collect and maintain current production and sales figures of each licensed manufacturer.
Authorizes the Attorney General to certify state firearm licensing or record of sale systems.
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/show



I agree that it would be too restrictive & would not be in favor of its passage. Write your Congressman.


It seems to me I mentioned this before and you Devil, had no problem with it. <removed link to FSC> So, why the change in attitude now?
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:30 pm

SuperBeetle wrote:It seems to me I mentioned this before and you Devil, had no problem with it. about9304-90.html So, why the change in attitude now?


Don't have time to read through that whole thread right now but it appears that no one was giving me any specific info on it other than the usual NRA hysteria, so I didn't have enough info to give it thumbs up or down.
Devil505
 
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Re: Another Obama attack on the 2A

PostBy: SuperBeetle On: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:58 pm

Devil505 wrote:
SuperBeetle wrote:It seems to me I mentioned this before and you Devil, had no problem with it. about9304-90.html So, why the change in attitude now?


Don't have time to read through that whole thread right now but it appears that no one was giving me any specific info on it other than the usual NRA hysteria, so I didn't have enough info to give it thumbs up or down.


There was no"NRA" hysteria :no1: and you had the same information. I posted specific for you and there were also several specific links posted for you as well, by myself and at least 1 other forum member. :yes: :roll2: Here, I'll post it again.

Congressional Research Service Summary

1/6/2009--Introduced.
Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 - Amends the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act to prohibit a person from possessing a firearm unless that person has been issued a firearm license under this Act or a state system certified under this Act and such license has not been invalidated or revoked. Prescribes license application, issuance, and renewal requirements.
Prohibits transferring or receiving a qualifying firearm unless the recipient presents a valid firearms license, the license is verified, and the dealer records a tracking authorization number. Prescribes firearms transfer reporting and record keeping requirements. Directs the Attorney General to establish and maintain a federal record of sale system.
Prohibits: (1) transferring a firearm to any person other than a licensee, unless the transfer is processed through a licensed dealer in accordance with national instant criminal background check system requirements, with exceptions; (2) a licensed manufacturer or dealer from failing to comply with reporting and record keeping requirements of this Act; (3) failing to report the loss or theft of the firearm to the Attorney General within 72 hours; (4) failing to report to the Attorney General an address change within 60 days; or (5) keeping a loaded firearm, or an unloaded firearm and ammunition for the firearm, knowingly or recklessly disregarding the risk that a child is capable of gaining access, if a child uses the firearm and causes death or serious bodily injury.
Prescribes criminal penalties for violations of firearms provisions covered by this Act.
Directs the Attorney General to: (1) establish and maintain a firearm injury information clearinghouse; (2) conduct continuing studies and investigations of firearm-related deaths and injuries; and (3) collect and maintain current production and sales figures of each licensed manufacturer.
Authorizes the Attorney General to certify state firearm licensing or record of sale systems.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin ... ih.txt.pdf

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.x ... ab=summary

It appears you didn't bother to read before but chose to ignore that facts that were presented.
SuperBeetle
 
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