Devil505 wrote:I trust President Obama's words.
But remember, its only been "TWO MONTHS!!"
Devil505 wrote:I trust President Obama's words.
jpete wrote:Hey Devil, you know what you call a person who graduates LAST in medical school?
jpete wrote:Don't try to impress me with Geithner credentials. I know where he came from. You realize you are putting your faith in a man who worked alongside Henry Paulson. The same man who used to work at Goldman Sachs. One of those big evil companies you hate so much.
jpete wrote:I graduated from the School of Hard Knocks and got my Phd from the College of Getting the $h!t Kicked Out of Me.
jpete wrote:Also, he was brought up by Henry Kissinger. The architect of the Vietnam War.
jpete wrote:This guy associates with the scum of the Earth and you want to trust the future of the country to him?
jpete wrote:You may be deaf. dumb, and blind, but I'm not.
jpete wrote:But back to the issue. Do you, or do you not, know the difference between Austrian and Keynesian economics?
Devil505 wrote:We each have our areas of expertise....& economics is not mine....or yours!
jpete wrote:Sad that a person would purposely go out of their way to be ignorant.
jpete wrote:You wonder why you get disrespected here as you act like a 2 year old.
jpete wrote:But you keep being flippant Devil.
tvb wrote:Jeff, I asked earlier this evening (Horrible News For Anti-Obamaniacs. Economy Is Improving!) what Ron Paul or Bob Barr are suggesting as possible solutions to the economic mess the previous administration left this nation in. You haven't answered - does that mean you are being intentionally ignorant?
I also asked what your solutions are and you didn't answer that either. Are you being intentionally obtuse? Or just flippant?
Bankruptcy is Economic Stimulus
The distraction on Capitol Hill this week has to do with the jackpot bonuses that executives at AIG recently received. The argument is over a relative drop in the bucket. The total amount of bonuses given out was $165 million. The government has put $170 billion into AIG so far. Many now are demanding we get this money back. We ought to be spending our time and effort doing something more worthwhile, like figuring out how the Federal Reserve is handling the trillions of dollars they are creating and pumping into the economy, and how that is affecting the purchasing power of dollars in your pocket.
The big mistake was appropriating the TARP funds in the first place. A Johnny-come-lately bill of attainder won’t stop the spending epidemic. This whole situation is a perfect demonstration of why “doing nothing” and letting failing companies fail would have been much better than sinking valuable money and resources into them.
When a company makes a profit, it is a signal that it is taking resources and increasing their value while controlling costs. When a company operates at a loss, it is a signal that it is decreasing the value of its resources or letting out-of-control costs outstrip any value it has created. A company operating at a loss is therefore an engine of wealth destruction. Bankruptcies are a net positive for the economy because more productive competitors are rewarded by opportunities to buy up remaining assets at bargain prices to strengthen their operations. In an economy that allows this kind of growth and change, any jobs lost by bankruptcy are soon replaced by new ones as the most efficiently managed businesses gain access to more assets and expand.
Bankruptcy was the stimulus that we needed in the case of AIG. More bankruptcies would clean out malinvested resources and enable economic growth again.
AIG, by losing money and maneuvering their operations to the brink of bankruptcy, was telling us that they were inefficient. So what did we do? We forced the taxpayer to assume the losses, and now we are supposed to be shocked that it is not working out. Had AIG gone bankrupt, it would have been impossible to hand out these bonuses. The taxpayer would have been fleeced for $170 billion less last year. Had they gone bankrupt, the world would not have come to an end, it would just continue on with one less engine of wealth destruction.
We should have learned from Japan. The 1990’s is referred to as Japan’s “lost decade” because of the zombie banks kept on life support by the Japanese government. Any productivity was redirected through these engines of wealth destruction, resulting in long term stagnation. We should and can avoid this outcome if we come to our senses.
A recession should be a time of strengthening and regrouping for an economy. But as long as the government insists on maintaining the status quo by propping up failed institutions, we will continue to dig a bigger hole for ourselves.
Devil505 wrote:Seems to me that I am not doing the childish name calling here Jeff, you are. As far as disrespect is concerned, go back a year ago, look at some political treads & see how many times I was called a Traitor to my country & worse!.......I have never tried to win the title of Miss Congeniality here Jeff, but I always call it as I see it in plain English.
I had always thought you & I were kibitzing a bit....but if I misread you & you really have a hair across your butt....Please feel free to speak your mind openly in Flame Central.
jpete wrote:I believe, I've said on more than one occassion, to cut taxes and cut spending.
Devil505 wrote:jpete wrote:I believe, I've said on more than one occassion, to cut taxes and cut spending.
I know this was directed to TVB but I'll just jump in here to say that ...that was the Republican Mantra that was soundly rejected by a majority of U.S. voters in both the Presidential & Congressional elections of last November. We heard you guys THEN.......Rejected your failed message & are rejecting you again!
jpete wrote:Yeah I do have a problem Devil. I can't count how many times I asked you a simple question and you obfuscate. I ask you the time and you tell me how to make a watch.
jpete wrote:I want to know if you know the difference between Austrian and Keynesian economics. If you were an honest and interested person, you'd find out.
jpete wrote:You mean the voters that you spent the last eight years excoriating for being dumb enough to vote for GWB, twice!?!
He lead you down the path off your subject to what he does best. I won you lost and then he'll stick his tongue out at you.
I stopped myself before he got that satisfaction he got me once he won't do it again. Let it go nothing you say will do any good.
You can't teach a closed minded person anything because their like an 18 year old a know it all.
Devil505 wrote:I disagree & think the CHANGE we voted for (from the Bush policies) has already largely occurred from the announcing of GITMO closing to refunding of science & stem cell research, to renouncing state sponsored torture to reintroduction of diplomacy to proper government oversight to...........There has already been a vast CHANGE for the better, imo!
Devil505 wrote:You'll excuse me but I would rather trust someone with credentials like this:
Sec of the Treasury Geithner
Geithner was born in Brooklyn, New York. He spent most of his childhood living outside the United States, including present-day Zimbabwe, India and Thailand, where he completed high school at International School Bangkok. He then attended Dartmouth College, graduating with an B.A. in government and Asian studies in 1983. He earned an M.A. in international economics and East Asian studies from Johns Hopkins University's School of Advanced International Studies in 1985. He has studied Chinese and Japanese.
Geithner's paternal grandfather, Paul Herman Geithner (1902–1972), emigrated with his parents from the German town of Zeulenroda to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania in 1908. His father, Peter F. Geithner, is the director of the Asia program at the Ford Foundation in New York. During the early 1980s, Peter Geithner oversaw the Ford Foundation's microfinance programs in Indonesia being developed by Ann Dunham-Soetoro, President Barack Obama's mother, and they met in person at least once. Timothy Geithner's mother, Deborah Moore Geithner, is a pianist and piano teacher in Larchmont, New York where his parents currently reside. Geithner's maternal grandfather, Charles F. Moore, was an adviser to President Dwight D. Eisenhower and served as a vice president of Ford Motor Company.
 Early career
After completing his studies, Geithner worked for Kissinger and Associates in Washington, D.C., for three years and then joined the International Affairs division of the U.S. Treasury Department in 1988. He went on to serve as an attache at the US Embassy in Tokyo. He was deputy assistant secretary for international monetary and financial policy (1995–1996), senior deputy assistant secretary for international affairs (1996-1997), assistant secretary for international affairs (1997–1998).
He was Under Secretary of the Treasury for International Affairs (1998–2001) under Treasury Secretaries Robert Rubin and Lawrence Summers. Summers was his mentor, but other sources call him a Rubin protégé.
Treasury Secretary designee Geithner meets Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus on November 25, 2008
In 2002 he left the Treasury to join the Council on Foreign Relations as a Senior Fellow in the International Economics department. He was director of the Policy Development and Review Department (2001-2003) at the International Monetary Fund.
In October 2003, he was named president of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. His salary in 2007 was $398,200. Once at the New York Fed, he became Vice Chairman of the Federal Open Market Committee component. In 2006, he also became a member of the Washington-based financial advisory body, the Group of Thirty.
In March 2008, he arranged the rescue and sale of Bear Stearns; in the same year, he played a pivotal role in both the decision to bail out AIG as well as the government decision not to save Lehman Brothers from bankruptcy. As a Treasury official, he helped manage multiple international crises of the 1990s in Brazil, Mexico, Indonesia, South Korea and Thailand.
Geithner believes, along with Henry Paulson, that the United States Department of the Treasury needs new authority to experiment with responses to the financial crisis of 2008. Paulson has described Geithner as "[a] very unusually talented young man...[who] understands government and understands markets."
Devil505 wrote:jpete wrote:Yeah I do have a problem Devil. I can't count how many times I asked you a simple question and you obfuscate. I ask you the time and you tell me how to make a watch.
Debate is like a chess game Jeff.......We each have a strategy & tactics which cannot be dictated by our opponents.If you don't like the way you opponent smirks or the color of his shirt....you can choose not to play. I have my own techniques for games (like chess, hearts & debate) & for real life....... I play by the rules of whatever the game is..... but I always play to win.
You are whining that you don't like my tactics, but that means nothing to me. I like my tactics...which is often to anger & unnerve my opponent & force them into making a mistake. (hey.......that;'s why I'm the )jpete wrote:I want to know if you know the difference between Austrian and Keynesian economics. If you were an honest and interested person, you'd find out.
I told you a thousand time I dont & I don't NEED to know. We elect Presidents who we HOPE know more than us in the hopes that THEY will make decisions which are normally beyond our capability to make. I consider myself I fairly intelligent & well informed citizen but I know my limitations......& advanced economics is NOT my strong suit nor do I believe it is yours.
Think of what your are demanding here Jeff.......You are demanding that I accept your opinion over that of some of the best economic minds in the world!....Listen to yourself....Are you really serious?!?!