Buckwheat coal in a LL?

Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: Paulie On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:01 pm

Is there any reason you can not burn buckwheat coal in a LL stove? Found post talking about 30% buckwheat. Can I go
100% buckwheat? If not, why? Noticed that some other stoves can do either or, as long as chimney draft is not too high.
Paulie
 
Stove/Furnace Make: leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: Pioneer

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: tsb On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 7:00 pm

I bought a LL Pioneer in Feb. I bought about two tons of
coal from a neighbor that used to run an Alaska stoker.
From the looks of the coal I would say it is mostly buckwheat.
I burns OK, but there are a lot of unburned pieces in the ash.
It doesn't bother me because I didn't pay much for the coal.
The rice coal that I bought with the stove burned completely.

So can you burn buckwheat ? Sure, but not very efficiently.

Tom
tsb
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Binford 2000
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Pioneer top vent
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Saey Hanover II

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: Richard S. On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:30 pm

I believe the reason is because you're creating a greater chance of a hopper fire, the larger the coal is the easier it is to burn because it needs less air and since you have larger pieces it more easily flows through it. The fire will be higher up on the bed and closer to the hopper. In the event of a power outage and all the other stars align you have greater chance of that fire creeping into the hopper.

Since it's priced similar to the buck if not the same there is really no reason to use it unless of course you come across some free product or a similar situation.

To quote dirty harry "Do you feel luck punk...?" :P

tsb wrote:So can you burn buckwheat ? Sure, but not very efficiently.


Your problem was more likely a difference in the coal itself.
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite

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Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: tsb On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:45 pm

We have had a few power failures. The fire just poops out.
I think the hopper fire talk is a myth. If the lid was off, maybe,
but still unlikely. There is just not enough air getting to the coal.
If someone has a hopper fire, post some pictures.

Tom
tsb
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Binford 2000
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Pioneer top vent
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Saey Hanover II

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: traderfjp On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:06 pm

To say hopper fires are a myth is to call many members on this board a LIAR. Sorry I don't have pictrures for you but not everyone is a liar. Too many of us have experienced a hopper fire so belive what you want. I don't think it's the norm but if the right conditions are met they can occur. I've had 2 to date but have since remedied the situation.
traderfjp
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
Stove/Furnace Model: Channing 3

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: tsb On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:14 pm

Are we a little touchy tonight ?
All I said was that I thought a hopper fire was unlikely.
I've been burning coal for 30 years and I think I know
a little about how it burns. If I wanted to insult someone,
I would just do it.
Just for fun, I'll load my LL with pea coal and let the fire go out.
I'll post pictures if you want. If I'm wrong, then I'll also believe in
hopper fires.
If you have a hopper fire, how do you put it out ? Water or sand ?
tsb
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Binford 2000
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Pioneer top vent
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Saey Hanover II

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: Richard S. On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:18 pm

Happened to plenty of people, don't recall any on LL's. Hopper fire

Like you I was quite surprised to hear this as I never had a customer mention it in my 15 years of business. The lids may help prevent such a situation from occurring but that is not the purpose for having them, they are there to prevent debris getting into the coal. Some even have holes to allow moisture to evaporate.
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: rockwood On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:30 pm

traderfjp wrote: I've had 2 to date but have since remedied the situation.

Without searching through a bunch of posts, what was the problem? Draft/low coal in the hopper?
rockwood
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Stokermatic coal furnace
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Baseburners & Antiques: Malleable/Monarch Range
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Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: tsb On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:33 pm

Richard's link on hopper fires was very informative.
Read them if you get time, and draw your own conclusions.
I think the size of the coal is the least of the causes.

Tom
tsb
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Binford 2000
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Pioneer top vent
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Saey Hanover II

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: traderfjp On: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:54 pm

I let the coal get low in my Alaska stove one night-big mistake. I have a direct vent unit that is always pulling to accomodate the largest fire possible in my 90k btu stove. However, when the fire is idiling and the coal gets very low air gaps open up between hopper and the grate. I guess air then starts being pulled from the hopper and the fire follows the air. The first time it happened I melted my manual feed control. I turned the stove off, scoop some of the hot coals out and let the rest burn itself out. I have since added a rheostat to my direct vent, draft guage and a barometric damper. I have tried to get a hopper fire to start on several occasions with no luck. I attributed this to the mods. Before I made the mods I could get a hopper fire each time I tried.
traderfjp
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
Stove/Furnace Model: Channing 3

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: efo141 On: Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:12 am

tsb wrote:Just for fun, I'll load my LL with pea coal and let the fire go out.
I'll post pictures if you want. If I'm wrong, then I'll also believe in
hopper fires.

Will pea coal even make it to the grate without jamming? I have some pea coal i would like to use up but i am afraid it will jam the feeder on my Keystoker. Has anyone tried it?
efo141
 
Stove/Furnace Make: New Yorker/Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: WC90-----/Kaa-2

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: Paulie On: Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:48 am

The power vent seems to be a factor in hopper fires. The reason I ask about rice vs buckwheat is that all the keystoker
products can burn either. Based on what I have found here, the buckwheat puts out a little more heat quicker, because
of the increased air flow that happens because the larger size. Rice lays down pretty tight, restricting airflow more.
It was interesting that Tom found the buck to burn incomplete vs the rice. From everything I have read here it would seem
that it should be opposite. Who knew? Burning rice, I have found some unburnt coal in the ash. Not a lot, but a measurable
amount. Jerry from LL says 30% buck is O.K.. Maybe he will chime in on whats what.
Paulie
 
Stove/Furnace Make: leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: Pioneer

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: tsb On: Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:58 am

I was sort of joking about burning pea coal in the LL.
I don't think it will stay on the grate long enough to burn
more than the outside shell, if at all. I might just try it
anyway. Blowing like Kansas here today.

Tom
tsb
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Binford 2000
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Pioneer top vent
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Saey Hanover II

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: Paulie On: Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:58 pm

Pea Coal? No, I would not think it would burn well in a stoker. I may pick up a couple of bags of buckwheat to see if it
burns o.k. in my stoker. I am curious to see if it burns hotter than rice.
Paulie
 
Stove/Furnace Make: leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: Pioneer

Re: Buckwheat coal in a LL?

PostBy: WNY On: Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:08 pm

the stoker plates are totally different between the Keystoker and LL, the LL has a carpet type flat plate and is open from the grate up to the hopper, more chance of pulling air and burning back using buckwheat, I don't believe it's recommended to use 100%, "maybe" the 30% mix, but I wouldn't want to take the chance with 100%.

I have burnt buckwheat with my keystoker with no problems even with the direct vent, it has a pusher block stoker, so it actually closes off the hopper depending on the stroke, Therefore, very minimal chance of burn back into the hopper.
WNY
 
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