My current huge project

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: RMA On: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:39 pm

DVC500 at last wrote:
RMA wrote:I don't know much about wiring but I think that in my neck of the woods (NJ) Aluminum House wiring is a Major no-no.
Maybe it's desirable for some applications, as yours....
Bob


Bob, Al in NJ is acceptable as long as all connections are made with Electrical Paste. My #4 for the range and A/C passed inspection, no problem.


I guess it depends on the individual inspector and region. As I said I don't know too much about it. I've read stuff like this:
http://www.enginspectnj.com/aluminum.asp
And I figured in my town you would be shot on site, if you used Al wire...
Another example:
When sanding-off old house finishes prior to repainting, Our town insists on tenting the house (no dust may drift), with trained personnel using (inspected and approved) HEPA vacuum sanding systems, and respirators. Then the collected dust & ya-da-ya-da-ya-da....I guess LS Farm's area is different too!


Bob
RMA
 

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: coalkirk On: Mon Jan 11, 2010 6:10 pm

He's talking about stranded aluminum, not solid aluminum. Nothing wrong with it. Most utilities use stranded aluminum as the service to your home.
coalkirk
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Harman VF3000
Coal Size/Type: antrhcite/rice coal

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: 009to090 On: Mon Jan 11, 2010 6:58 pm

coalkirk wrote:He's talking about stranded aluminum, not solid aluminum. Nothing wrong with it. Most utilities use stranded aluminum as the service to your home.

True... our brand new underground main service is 0x4 stranded al, and meets code.
Bob, I'm not sure I fully understand what that paragragh on your link is referring to.
Due to implications in numerous house fires, the once common practice of using aluminum wiring during the 1970's is no longer permitted in new installations in most jurisdictions. If your house has aluminum wiring you do not necessarily need to panic. Aluminum wiring can be just as safe as copper wire as long as it has been installed correctly.

I guess we are not one of the jurisdictions this paragraph refers to. :D
009to090
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520 HighBoy
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: DVC-500 x 2
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Rice


Re: My current huge project

PostBy: coalkirk On: Mon Jan 11, 2010 7:46 pm

They are referring to solid aluminum conductor wiring used for lighting and general purpose circuits from 1963 through early 1974. Typically #12 or #10 solid wire. It was a very soft compostion aluminum. It worked loose due to thermal properties and extrusion causing arcing and leading to fires. To the best of my knowledge it was never taken out of the National Electrical Code. You can't buy it anymore and no inspector would allow it to be installed but technically it's still "code." Here's a pic of some that had been pretty hot.
alum pics.jpg
(77.2 KiB) Viewed 32 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
[nepathumb]18041[/nepathumb]

The stranded wire that is currently used is a very different compositon aluminum and never had any of those problems.
coalkirk
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Harman VF3000
Coal Size/Type: antrhcite/rice coal

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: LsFarm On: Mon Jan 11, 2010 10:21 pm

Thanks for the comments.. Aluminum is OK for panel supply cables, and house supply cables.. it is all stranded.. and installed with special anticorrosive grease.
Like Coalkirk said, the single strand stuff that was used to replace regular in-wall wiring for outlets, lights and switches had serious problems, especially in damp climates.. where the aluminum fastened to copper outlets created corrosion in the damp air,, caused resistance then heat then fires..

It was one of my sore spots about the Electircal inspector's insistance to replace a perfectly good, but grubbly looking length of copper with what I could afford, which was aluminum.. about $200vs $400 for copper. all because he insisted..

Anyway, it's coming along.. i hope to get a majority if not all the drywall up next week.

Greg L
LsFarm
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: SMITTY On: Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:37 pm

Just 5 years ago I had 200A service upgraded from 100A, & they used 00 stranded aluminum from the roof down. Where it meets the 200A breaker, they didn't skimp on that anti-corrosion grease.

From the pole to the roof is 2awg .... sort of negates the purpose of 200A service. Safer though, than the Federal Pacific box that was rusted from top to bottom .... and inside & out! :o

I still have three 220 lines that are braided cloth over rubber insulated, & are stranded aluminum: one for the dryer, the range, & the barn. No grease on those connections though ... I probably should look into that in light of all my corrosion issues with my stove. :idea:
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: titleist1 On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:53 am

I had to bump this thread just to see if there might be some new progress pics we could enjoy?!?!
titleist1
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Mag Stoker (old style) one in basement, one in workshop
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III on standby for long power outages
Coal Size/Type: Rice/Anthracite; Nut/Anthracite

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: wlape3 On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:50 am

I would still have some reservations about using aluminum over copper though. Granted, copper is, in general, more expensive, but the lower resistance means higher efficiency transfer and less heat issues.
wlape3
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
Stove/Furnace Model: 140 auger, forced hot air

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: coalkirk On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:46 pm

I could be wrong. I was once. Cost aside, I think aluminum is a better conductor than copper.
coalkirk
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Harman VF3000
Coal Size/Type: antrhcite/rice coal

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: europachris On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:51 pm

coalkirk wrote:I could be wrong. I was once. Cost aside, I think aluminum is a better conductor than copper.


Twice now :D - Aluminum is #4 behind Silver, Copper, and Gold in that order. Aluminum is about 60% the conductivity of copper.
europachris
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 350/Iron Fireman
Stove/Furnace Model: Custom bituminous burner

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: wlape3 On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 3:35 pm

europachris wrote:
coalkirk wrote:I could be wrong. I was once. Cost aside, I think aluminum is a better conductor than copper.


Twice now :D - Aluminum is #4 behind Silver, Copper, and Gold in that order. Aluminum is about 60% the conductivity of copper.

That is why thicker gauges are required for aluminum wiring. Otherwise, they get too hot.
wlape3
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
Stove/Furnace Model: 140 auger, forced hot air

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: LsFarm On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:50 pm

Another long day of work on the house.. I can't believe it took 6 hours to frame in the french door to the master bedroom. What a royal pain in the butt.

But it's in, with only a few screws. but it is sort of plumb.. the problem is the rest of the wall isn't.. I had to give up trying to plumb and square the door, and just shim it so that the doors had equal gaps all around and opened and closed correctly..

I'll have some challenges when it comes to trimming the door, but the rest of the bedroom was a challenge too. A building built in 1849 has had a long time to get out of plumb and out of square. I swear it's part pretzel.

Greg L
IMG_2103.JPG
(104.8 KiB) Viewed 30 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
Old door from bedroom into the attic. had a 13" step up to the old attic floor. Small door of several layers of wood.
[nepathumb]18323[/nepathumb]

IMG_2108.JPG
(118.6 KiB) Viewed 26 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
Old plaster lath behind the 3/4" knotty pine paneling
[nepathumb]18324[/nepathumb]

IMG_2115.JPG
(98.11 KiB) Viewed 31 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
Finallly, the new 5' door is in the hole and operational. the door is 6" above the floor, flush with the balcony floor.
[nepathumb]18325[/nepathumb]
LsFarm
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: SMITTY On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:57 pm

WOW! Livin' large! ;) Looks mint!

Don't feel bad -- it took me 13 hours to install a door in my barn ( but I installed a 9'x7' garage door in less than 5 from scratch :lol: ). Most of that time was spent fussing with plumb & squareness. :lol:
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: LsFarm On: Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:00 pm

From the balcony side. The balcony still has the false floor over the stairs and the open center area. Once the drywall is mudded, and the painting is done, then I'll remove the temporary floor. Right now it is very convenient for working on this level of the foyer. The floor was in the way a bit while working on the installation of the door.
There was old wiring above the attic door that had to be rerouted and replace with new wire with grounds. The header over the door was a challenge to creativity..

Greg L

IMG_2105.JPG
(154.49 KiB) Viewed 37 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
[nepathumb]18326[/nepathumb]

IMG_2113.JPG
(135.17 KiB) Viewed 40 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
[nepathumb]18327[/nepathumb]

IMG_2118.JPG
(156.69 KiB) Viewed 33 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
[nepathumb]18328[/nepathumb]
LsFarm
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland

Re: My current huge project

PostBy: SMITTY On: Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:32 am

That header looks very familiar ... :lol:

Love the wood on the walls -- I've been wanting to do that to my TV room for a while now. Whether or not I ever get to it remains to be seen .... don't hold your breath! :D
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler