Taxes, taxes everywhere!

Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: mikeandgerry On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:09 pm

stockingfull wrote:Au contrere, again, my man. Our trust-busting and labor reforms are the only things that kept Marx's predictions from coming true here. They defused the economic bomb.

Credit the GOP a century ago for seeing something you still can't perceive.


I do credit the Democrats and Republicans alike for fighting the extremes of monopoly and labor abuse in this country.

Recall that I am a Republican, not a libertarian or anarchist.

Marx's predictions could only be facilitated by capitalism.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 4:35 pm

mikeandgerry wrote:
stockingfull wrote:Our trust-busting and labor reforms are the only things that kept Marx's predictions from coming true here. They defused the economic bomb.

Credit the GOP a century ago for seeing something you still can't perceive.


I do credit the Democrats and Republicans alike for fighting the extremes of monopoly and labor abuse in this country.

Recall that I am a Republican, not a libertarian or anarchist.

And I, sir, am a Democrat, not a communist or anarchist.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: KLook On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 6:12 pm

How about you defining what exactly is a Democrat? What is a Fascist? What is a Commie? What is a Socialist? Why are you not one of these if you agree with what they try to do in societies past and present?

Kevin
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: KLook On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 6:12 pm

Sorry, that was off topic as the whole thread has become off topic.

Kevin
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: tvb On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 6:30 pm

Why don't you define them for us, Kev. Since it is your party that likes to define things that are democratic as socialistic, I'm interested in your definition. And please define republican too.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: KLook On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 6:54 pm

Oh wow, How nice of you. Turnabout is fair play huh. I will if you will i guess. Gotta look at pics of my granddaughther to be right now but I'll return.

Kevin
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: tvb On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 8:12 pm

KLook wrote:Oh wow, How nice of you. Turnabout is fair play huh. I will if you will i guess. Gotta look at pics of my granddaughther to be right now but I'll return.

Kevin


Maybe start a new thread with your reply. I would start it but am a bit too tired to put together a thoughtful reply (3am wake-ups do that to me at this time of day sometimes).
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: KLook On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 8:15 pm

I will try to start a new thread as this is off the topic.

Kevin
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: jpete On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:25 pm

mikeandgerry wrote:
ErikLaurence wrote:
mikeandgerry wrote:

Ummm.......congress makes the laws, John. Democrats voted in the FRA, not Republicans. Nice try, though.


It's not quite that simple.

While democrats certainly voted for the FRA, republicans did not fight it very hard.

The vote in the house was:
298 yeas
60 nays
76 not voting.

The Senate
43 yeas
25 nays
27 not voting

In both houses there was more abstention than opposition.

But the larger issue, both with this argument, and many historical arguments of a partisan nature is that the core of the types of Democrats who voted for this legislation were southern populists. Most of those southern populists switched parties to the GOP in the 1950s and 60s.



It's never that simple! The Republicans wanted a central bank, they just didn't want what they got. That's why they voted NV!

As far as populism goes, its been a common, recurring and sometimes significant thread throughout our two party system. It's that fractious "third party" that never really comes to be.


The "no votes" WEREN'T "abstentions". The backers of the the Federal Reserve Act knew what they were doing.

Look at the date it was passed.....December 23rd! Most of Congress had gone home for Christmas!

It was 1913. Even if you managed to hear about a vote, it's not like you could jump on a plane and fly to D.C.

And IIRC, the vote was taken near midnight to make it as difficult as possible for as many members as possible.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: mikeandgerry On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:09 pm

Good point. NV's aren't active abstentions.

Those dems are slick operators.

What say you now, Erik and Stockingfull? jpete says it was a ram job.
Last edited by mikeandgerry on Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: SMITTY On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:13 pm

They sure are! This is how everything gets passed in MA ......... that, and the fact that there are 100+ dems to 6 Republicans! :shock:
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: mikeandgerry On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:25 pm

SMITTY wrote:They sure are! This is how everything gets passed in MA ......... that, and the fact that there are 100+ dems to 6 Republicans! :shock:


Yeah, I thought NY was bad, but Mass takes the cake when it comes to "political machines". I would have trouble coping there!
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: mikeandgerry On: Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:36 pm

stockingfull wrote:And I, sir, am a Democrat, not a communist or anarchist.


I believe you, but please tell us about how you view socialism.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: ErikLaurence On: Sat Dec 12, 2009 7:24 am

mikeandgerry wrote:Those dems are slick operators.

What say you now, Erik and Stockingfull? jpete says it was a ram job.



If it's important you are there. if it's not important you're not there.




The other issue is the democrats who voted for this then are all republicans now. The entire south that is now GOP was democratic. Massachusetts and California had two republican senators. So positioning this in current partisan terms is idiotic and specious. In the parties of the day Sarah Palin and Rush Limbaugh would have been Democrats.


Personally I think the federal reserve act is unconstitutional or the same reason I think the Iraq war was unconstitutional. Congress does not have the power to delegate it's responsibilities to other entities.
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Re: Taxes, taxes everywhere!

PostBy: SMITTY On: Sat Dec 12, 2009 7:33 am

ErikLaurence wrote: ..................Massachusetts and California had two republican senators. .........

Must've been before my time??? :confused:
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