What Should the Fire *Look* Like?

As I've been posting about for a couple days, I'm not getting a lot of heat from my Hitzer model 82...(and thank you to everyone who is trying to help me with this).

I'm not surprised that when I add fresh coal on top of the pile, the temp on top of the stove falls (rather dramatically) for awhile. But after 8 or 12 hours, there's still black coals on top, with red peeking through (and some blue flame jumping up occasionally).

I have the dial damper in the back turned to full warm.

So should the coal fire look like the picture at the top of the coalpail.com banner on this site, almost all red? I have the pile up to the top of the firebrick. Maybe if there were more exposed red-hot coals, it will burn better and get more heat. Maybe...it's too deep?

I don't know how to get more air to it aside from opening the ash door, and from what I understand that's a definite no-no for getting it to heat up when not lighting the fire or trying to "stoke" it.

So I'm thinking that maybe instead of just sticking to a time schedule, should I be looking at the coals and if there's still a layer of darker coals on top with some red just peeking around the crevices, leave it alone, don't add more just yet?

Here's what mine looks like a few hours after a fresh load. It will eventually progress to all red.

**Broken Video Link(s) Removed**

You are already on your game!!

Questions: What size coal are you burning?
Draft gauge?
What size and configuration are you heating?
Do you have another form of heat currently?
Chimney setup?
Does your wife hate coal and throw ice cubes on the fire when you are sleeping?

Hitzer's are famous for being able to melt the ice in the refrigerator from 50 feet away, so don't worry, you'll get the problem solved! Many members here with them....
Do you have an ex-wife who shows up mysteriously in the middle of the night and leaves the doors open?
A trick dog that turns door knobs to go out 'huntin', but can't close the door behind himself?
Are you living in a storage container with no insulation? (A joke, no insult intended....but my 40 footer is pretty damned comfortable with an AA 260 rattlin away down near the bathroom........ )
Contact Jpete or Markvii, they have been using them for years.

PS: Careful of melting the vinyl siding off from the inside out....

Good day and welcome to the learning curve. You'll get past this and soon be asking "How do I slow this rig down?" I can't answer your question, but wonder if you're asking the right one. I'm with Whistlenut and have questions, not answers. Do you have a barometric damper? What is your draft? Could be you're making heat but it's taking the Elvis route & left the building!

Not a Hitzer 82 but my new stove is at 275* and nary a flame or red coal to be seen...
Every new stove has a learning curve...
Every installation is unique in how the same stove behaves...
You will soon have the stove purring along...
When you do open the ash door does the fire get hot quick...
If it takes awhile for the fire to get hot even with the ash door boost...
You have a lack of draft...
Get a barometric damper installed...
Check the draft with a manometer...
Get the fire hot before you shake it down...
Add coal in smaller batches while you are still learning about your stove...
A large amount of coal will cool a fire down and make a batch of coal gas...
Get the fire hot then put the damper lever down...

jpete wrote:Here's what mine looks like a few hours after a fresh load. It will eventually progress to all red.

<cut youtube link>

Definitely not all red when I go to refill it...

Freddy wrote:Good day and welcome to the learning curve. You'll get past this and soon be asking "How do I slow this rig down?" I can't answer your question, but wonder if you're asking the right one. I'm with Whistlenut and have questions, not answers. Do you have a barometric damper? What is your draft? Could be you're making heat but it's taking the Elvis route & left the building!

No baro damper

Is there a simple way to measure draft? The CO alarm isn't going off and I've only read, never experienced, the puffback boom effect. There are some pictures in the thread "Hitzer Fire Not Really Hot" with an IR thermometer measuring some of the temps in spots, including the pipe, but of course that's not *in* the pipe.

whistlenut wrote:You are already on your game!!

Questions: What size coal are you burning?
Draft gauge?
What size and configuration are you heating?
Do you have another form of heat currently?
Chimney setup?
Does your wife hate coal and throw ice cubes on the fire when you are sleeping?

Size: Nut, I believe. Chunks from ~1/2 inch to two or three inches.

Draft gauge...? New to working with stoves, don't know if you mean gauge of pipe or a measurement of airflow. I believe the exhaust pipe is 7 inches. Contractor that installed chimney also put in the pipe and hooked up the stove.

Primary heat is propane. $$$. Hoped the coal would help cut down on heating costs.

Chimney is brand new. House is ~5 years old, modular, ranch-style with full basement (where the stove is located). So the chimney is 2 stories high.

Ice...not that I know of. There is a possibility some snow got in while I was working to get it initially lit though...

whistlenut wrote:Hitzer's are famous for being able to melt the ice in the refrigerator from 50 feet away, so don't worry, you'll get the problem solved! Many members here with them....
Do you have an ex-wife who shows up mysteriously in the middle of the night and leaves the doors open?
A trick dog that turns door knobs to go out 'huntin', but can't close the door behind himself?
Are you living in a storage container with no insulation? (A joke, no insult intended....but my 40 footer is pretty damned comfortable with an AA 260 rattlin away down near the bathroom........ )
Contact Jpete or Markvii, they have been using them for years.

PS: Careful of melting the vinyl siding off from the inside out....

The insulation question had come up before, actually. The basement is precast walls with R12 foam insulation, which I believe should be decent enough. One wall is exposed to the outdoors due to being a walk-in basement. The house itself seems to have decent insulation, but it does have lower-end doors and windows. Doubt that's a problem at the moment though since the basement isn't even collecting heat initially. No insulation in basement ceiling, but that should help with getting heat from basement to living space...

markviii wrote:Here is a picture of my Model 82 after an overnight burn.

When I first started using my Model 82 last year I was not impressed with the heat output either. After examining the stove a little closer I discovered a "restrictor plate" installed behind the inlet damper that blocked about 80% of the opening. I called Hitzer to ask about the plate, and they told me that it was added after a safety test determined the stove temperature could ramp up too quickly. Their official "line" was that the plate should be installed, but the guy I spoke with also said the stoves were manufactured for many years without this restrictor plate. I removed the plate from mine and was pleased with the improved performance of the stove.

Hmm...how is the plate installed? Is this the inlet damper the one that is connected to the chain and dial "thermostat" in the back, and how hard is it to access the plate to remove it?

bsilver wrote:No baro damper

If your stovepipe is as hot as your stove, that is where your fire is going, up the chimney. Put a baro in and adjust it with a manometer.

markviii wrote:

bsilver wrote:Hmm...how is the plate installed? Is this the inlet damper the one that is connected to the chain and dial "thermostat" in the back, and how hard is it to access the plate to remove it?

Yes, the inlet damper I am referring to is the plate connected to the chain and automatic draft control. There is a "tab" that the plate pivots on when moved up or down by the chain. The same screw that holds this tab in place also holds the restrictor plate, it is a 5 minute job to remove it.

If it's easy to remove without having the stove shut down, right at the inlet, I'll have to check and see if maybe that is the issue. If you saw a decent performance improvement then maybe that'll help in my case, as it's been suggested there's not enough air getting into the stove and I'm at a loss as to how to increase it (if not, it sounds like the plate is easy to put back in too...) I don't know if one is installed in mine but I'll find out tonight.

coaledsweat wrote:

bsilver wrote:No baro damper

If your stovepipe is as hot as your stove, that is where your fire is going, up the chimney. Put a baro in and adjust it with a manometer.

Don't think it is...the top of the stove is usually hovering around 200 degrees on the cabinet, and I can put my hand on the pipe and just have it uncomfortable, near 120 to 140 degrees. The pictures in the thread about "hitzer fire not really hot" has pictures with some IR temp readings of the pipe for reference. Possible, but I question it primarily because my coals aren't an entire bed of red either, and it was suggested that it's not getting enough airflow...maybe...?

When touching the stove pipe, if your hand is merely "uncomfortable" then I'm going to call that too hot. I can lay my palm on the stove pipe above my baro damper and leave it there for several minutes. Actually, I could probably hold it there all day. My house seems similar to yours minus the insulated basement. My Mark I is heating around 1900 sq ft raised ranch from an unfinished basement. House was built in 1973 and has cheap single pane windows. In fact, there is more than one place where I can see clear to the outside through gaps around them. Without any effort I can be mid 70's to 80* downstairs and 68-74* upstairs. You'll get this figured out with the help of these guys. No problem at all.