Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: Richard S. On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:57 am

samhill wrote:I`m sorry but to the best of my recall I can never remember there ever being a politician at any level that has not been totally truthful.


True however the backbone of the Obama platform was "Change..." remember that? This administration and Congress is no better than any of the rest of them and I'd suggest worse especially considering they were going to "change". This legislation is the biggest bill that has been considered in how many years? 20? 30? 100? The American people deserve better and they want to pass something that is clearly not in the interest of the population nor is it supported by the population.

I'll say it again... this bill is not healthcare reform.... hence the reason they want to negotiate behind closed doors.
Richard S.
 
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:57 am

stockingfull wrote:That statement demonstrates a fundamental misunderstanding of the profession. There's a giant difference between advocacy, which means portraying your client's position in the best possible legal light -- which is the duty of counsel -- and lying, which is illegal.

Sometimes the line between the two can be as narrow as the yellow stripe separating us from oncoming traffic. But it's every bit as significant.

Ask those here who have needed legal advice, some of them recently. Ask if lying was any part of it, whether on their part or that of their counsel.


I guess it all depends on your definition of lying. Failing to tell the truth or a lie of ommission is still a lie in my book. Advocacy is just a fancy way of saying lying by ommission. Word parsing, distraction, deflection, misdirection are all tools in the "advocates" arsenal. Most of us just call it lying.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:40 am

Interesting take, Terry. If your kids are in a fight, it's one thing to say to them, "now, tell the truth." But our legal system has always been, our political system has become, and our debates here surely are "advocacy," at least in the sense that they pursue the truth by presenting the facts on both (or all) sides of the debate. If people with opposing biases present the facts as they see them, a neutral [judge/voter] is in the best position to come to an accurate conclusion.

But the only way it works is if it's all actually factual.

Case in point: Rudy Giuliani and the news he's generated in the last couple days with the Stephanopoulos interview. Apparently, Mary Matalin started some viral GOP talking point on the Fruit-of-the-Boom bomber that we've had an attack under Obama but not under Bush. :wtf: And now it's turned into "The Big Lie."

Apart from the sheer outrageousness of the statement (particularly coming from "Americas [9/11] Mayor"), is it "news" if Mary Matalin, or Rudy, or Sarah even says it? How do you report that "truthfully?"

But then again, Rudy's a lawyer.... :rimshot:
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: RMA On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:58 am

Richard S. wrote:
samhill wrote:I`m sorry but to the best of my recall I can never remember there ever being a politician at any level that has not been totally truthful.


True however the backbone of the Obama platform was "Change..." remember that? This administration and Congress is no better than any of the rest of them and I'd suggest worse especially considering they were going to "change". This legislation is the biggest bill that has been considered in how many years? 20? 30? 100? The American people deserve better and they want to pass something that is clearly not in the interest of the population nor is it supported by the population.

I'll say it again... this bill is not healthcare reform.... hence the reason they want to negotiate behind closed doors.


Richard,

I remember the platform phrase " A CHANGE YOU CAN BELIEVE IN "
I am left with the impression there is no change, and I am more skeptical than ever :sick:

Bob
RMA
 

Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 11:04 am

You guys just have to be patient alittle bit longer. They're coming.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: tvb On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 11:37 am

I'll say it again... this bill is not healthcare reform.... hence the reason they want to negotiate behind closed doors.


Can you cite any examples from previous administrations where the negotiations of merging house and senate bills have been broadcast or generally not behind closed doors?
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 11:52 am

tvb wrote:
I'll say it again... this bill is not healthcare reform.... hence the reason they want to negotiate behind closed doors.


Can you cite any examples from previous administrations where the negotiations of merging house and senate bills have been broadcast or generally not behind closed doors?


PLEASE READ THE TITLE OF THIS THREAD!!!!!

He said dozens of times that the negotiations would be on C-span. This was going to be the most open and honest administration ever. It doesn't matter what previous administrations did. It was what this administration said they were going to do..... "Change we could believe in." Of course I never believed it. there's only one reason why they don't want this televised. They don't want the sheeple to know what's in the bill. If they did, there would be lots more resistance to it than there is already.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: spc On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:15 pm

When a shill for the liberals call you a liar. :o :shock: :? :lol:

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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:18 pm

Jack Cafferty is no "shill for the liberals." He was one of Dubya's biggest cheerleaders ... in the early days.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:25 pm

shill or no shill his words express the TRUTH regarding the subject mater stated....


aka obama liar ..... pelosi....liar with red lips....shes so catty
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:35 pm

NEWS FLASH: POLITICIANS DON'T ALWAYS FULFILL ALL PROMISES MADE IN THEIR CAMPAIGNS!

Stop the presses! :baby:
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: spc On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:38 pm

stockingfull wrote: ... in the early days.


OK a patriotic shill.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:51 pm

Interesting media point here.

In the early days, I couldn't stand Cafferty's ass-worship of Dubya and the boys and girls. Or, believe it or not, MSNBC's, notably at the time by Alison Stewart.

How did they evolve? Call me cynical, but I think MSNBC found a business niche promoting the "un-Fox" viewpoint, starting somewhere around 2004-5 and they've made money at it, and they're going to ride that commercial horse as far as it'll take them.

Cafferty, OTOH, is just a bomb-thrower. He's there to rip anybody who he thinks needs rippin', and he'll switch sides as often as it takes to do a sassy news story. There's no shortage of his anti-Pelosi rants, for example. So, to the extent that he has no conscience, that he's taken no prisoners on either side, he qualifies as a "good old-fashioned newsroom bastard," a charge to which I think he cheerfully would plead guilty.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 1:06 pm

stockingfull wrote:How did they evolve? Call me cynical, but I think MSNBC found a business niche promoting the "un-Fox" viewpoint, starting somewhere around 2004-5 and they've made money at it, and they're going to ride that commercial horse as far as it'll take them.


:lol: :lol: :lol:
How's that working out for them so far ratings wise??? I get a real laugh when I'm channel surfing past PMSNBC and I see Keith Oberman. You can be sure about 90% of the time he's foaming at the mouth with some perceived outrage at fox news and in particular O'Reilly who he is clearly insanely jealous of. If you added all of the cable news ratings together, they don't touch fox. PMSNBC is a real niche alright. Far left wingnuts like yourself and lesbians getting dreamy over Maddow.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: Richard S. On: Sat Jan 09, 2010 1:32 pm

tvb wrote:Can you cite any examples from previous administrations where the negotiations of merging house and senate bills have been broadcast or generally not behind closed doors?


News flash, this is not the previous administration and I don't recall Bush making such a promise.
Richard S.
 
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