Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 8:52 am

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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:32 am

Much as he might have liked to televise it all, we all got to see the President, and Harry Reid, and now Nancy take the course called "Political Reality in the Senate 101."

In the syllabus it says, "Embarrassing even one Democrat into voting against it when all the Republicans are voting no means you can't get cloture and the whole things dies." So every crackpot, from Joe Lieberman to Mary Landrieu to Ben Nelson, became a swing vote in the sausage-making process.

Too bad, but as long as the filibuster is being used on every single piece of legislation, a majority isn't enough; you gotta have 60 votes to pass anything.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:56 am

If Obama said it once, he said it dozens of times at least. The healthcare debate would be on c-span. Obama didn't just fall to earth from heaven as you like to believe. He was very familiar with senate proceedings as he was one for about 3 1/2 days. :lol: Just another lie, campaign promise broken. Just like the fairy tale that all bills would be posted on the internet days before any vote so the American people could see how open/honest his adminsistration is. I'm still waiting for that one too. All those crack pots you mention are either dems or caucaus with the dems. If they can't keep their house in order that's not the repubs fault. Nearly all polls show Americans want healthcare reform. Nearly 70% polled say they don't want THIS bill. But Pelosie, Reid and Obama are hell bent on shoving it down our throats. Well the dems will own this lock stock and barrel. The dems have bribed and bought every straggling vote they needed totaling hundreds on millions of dollars. Another campaign promise broken. He was going to revamp the sausage factory too remember?
Why is it you just can't either admit your guy lied through his teeth or just stay silent about it?
All these are rhetorical questions. No need for you to respond Jonathan....please. I'd like to keep my breakfast down today. :P
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:01 am

obama is one big fat lier and a pathetic excuse for a representive of the American people who really do care about America. thats prob not as big a majority as it used to be. maybe if all the illeagles jump off a short pier at sharkfeeding time the numbers might increase...

all lawyers should start the "feeding" frenzy first.... ;)
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:20 am

coalkirk wrote:If Obama said it once, he said it dozens of times at least. The healthcare debate would be on c-span. Obama didn't just fall to earth from heaven as you like to believe. He was very familiar with senate proceedings as he was one for about 3 1/2 days. :lol: Just another lie, campaign promise broken. Just like the fairy tale that all bills would be posted on the internet days before any vote so the American people could see how open/honest his adminsistration is. I'm still waiting for that one too. All those crack pots you mention are either dems or caucaus with the dems. If they can't keep their house in order that's not the repubs fault. Nearly all polls show Americans want healthcare reform. Nearly 70% polled say they don't want THIS bill. But Pelosie, Reid and Obama are hell bent on shoving it down our throats. Well the dems will own this lock stock and barrel. The dems have bribed and bought every straggling vote they needed totaling hundreds on millions of dollars. Another campaign promise broken. He was going to revamp the sausage factory too remember?
Why is it you just can't either admit your guy lied through his teeth or just stay silent about it?
All these are rhetorical questions. No need for you to respond Jonathan....please. I'd like to keep my breakfast down today. :P

Terry, to paraphrase Harry Truman, if you can't keep your breakfast down, you have a choice: stay out of these threads.

Sure, Obama knew about the filibuster and how it works. But did he know when he made those campaign promises that Republicans would use the filibuster with such unprecedented frequency this year?

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/12/the_right_of_the_filibuster_an.html

Did Obama know back then that Jim DeMint would reveal the GOP's duplicity when he said that healthcare could be Obama's "Waterloo?" Did he know that Grassley would lie about his intent to work on a "bipartisan" bill? Did Obama know that he wouldn't be able to get Collins, or Snowe, or a single other Republican, to break ranks and either work on bipartisan legislation or not participate in a filibuster on every major bill, so he wouldn't have to bargain with the likes of Lieberman, Nelson, Blanche and Mary?

Of course he didn't. He tried, they double-crossed him (particularly Grassley), and he had to go to Plan B. Politics is, after all, the art of the possible.

Don't forget: Obama saw his mother die at the hands of our dysfunctional healthcare system. So too damn bad if your breakfast digestion is adversely affected by your voluntary participation in this thread. :baby:
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: jpete On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:41 am

Stockingful, please din't tell me you are using BHO's inexperience with governance as a defense for breaking promises. He ran his mouth, he just said it himself, the buck stops with him. He needs to take the blame here or fulfill his promises. Other wise he goes from"Change" to "More of the same".
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: RMA On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:47 am

stockingfull wrote:
coalkirk wrote:If Obama said it once, he said it dozens of times at least. The healthcare debate would be on c-span. Obama didn't just fall to earth from heaven as you like to believe. He was very familiar with senate proceedings as he was one for about 3 1/2 days. :lol: Just another lie, campaign promise broken. Just like the fairy tale that all bills would be posted on the internet days before any vote so the American people could see how open/honest his adminsistration is. I'm still waiting for that one too. All those crack pots you mention are either dems or caucaus with the dems. If they can't keep their house in order that's not the repubs fault. Nearly all polls show Americans want healthcare reform. Nearly 70% polled say they don't want THIS bill. But Pelosie, Reid and Obama are hell bent on shoving it down our throats. Well the dems will own this lock stock and barrel. The dems have bribed and bought every straggling vote they needed totaling hundreds on millions of dollars. Another campaign promise broken. He was going to revamp the sausage factory too remember?
Why is it you just can't either admit your guy lied through his teeth or just stay silent about it?
All these are rhetorical questions. No need for you to respond Jonathan....please. I'd like to keep my breakfast down today. :P

Terry, to paraphrase Harry Truman, if you can't keep your breakfast down, you have a choice: stay out of these threads.

Sure, Obama knew about the filibuster and how it works. But did he know when he made those campaign promises that Republicans would use the filibuster with such unprecedented frequency this year?

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/12/the_right_of_the_filibuster_an.html

Did Obama know back then that Jim DeMint would reveal the GOP's duplicity when he said that healthcare could be Obama's "Waterloo?" Did he know that Grassley would lie about his intent to work on a "bipartisan" bill? Did Obama know that he wouldn't be able to get Collins, or Snowe, or a single other Republican, to break ranks and either work on bipartisan legislation or not participate in a filibuster on every major bill, so he wouldn't have to bargain with the likes of Lieberman, Nelson, Blanche and Mary?

Of course he didn't. He tried, they double-crossed him (particularly Grassley), and he had to go to Plan B. Politics is, after all, the art of the possible.

Don't forget: Obama saw his mother die at the hands of our dysfunctional healthcare system. So too damn bad if your breakfast digestion is adversely affected by your voluntary participation in this thread. :baby:


According to your post, Obama simply did not know enough to make promises and commitments...
The promises and commitments were, however, made *N U M E R O U S* times.
Can this "Lawyer Obama" claim "Ignorance" and hope for lenience... :yearight:




Bob
RMA
 

Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:03 pm

Don't waste your keystrokes gents. Obama could drop a big turd on his cornflakes and Jonathan would smell roses. He's totally in the tank and has an Obama kool-aid I V in his arm. You'd have an easier time coaxing a diamond out of your coal pile.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:11 pm

See, Terry, that's what's called a personal attack. It's about me, it has not one word about the thread. As a mod, you should know better.

For the rest of you with working brains, I'll clarify: I don't think Obama was unaware of the potential for what happened procedurally.

Let me put it another way. I believe, if somebody had asked him during the campaign, "Senator, if you have to choose between keeping your promise about openness and keeping your promise to reform healthcare in this country, which would you choose?" that he would have said, "Of course, I'd be a fool to let the process kill the purpose. I want a bill -- my Mother died as a result of the broken healthcare system in this country. So I'll do it in as clean and bipartisan way as I can but, by God, it's gotta be done."

Find me the vid where that choice was placed before him and, if he didn't answer as I have supposed he would have, I'll retract.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: jpete On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:21 pm

So stocking, in this fantasy land you live in where candidates give theoretical answers to hypothetical questions, what prevents Obama from asking CSPAN to televise the debates and ordering his staff to publish bills on a website?
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:37 pm

The bills have been put up on the web. OTOH, while they're being written and negotiated, what "bill" is there to put up? That was just one of the many absurdities of the "read the bill" crapola last summer, when there were about 5 different drafts and all were in flux as the process went on.

As to C-Span, I think I said above that, if humiliating a Senator whose vote you need causes you to fall below the 60 votes you have to have to get the bill to the floor, we wouldn't be writing about the C-Span promise, we'd be writing about what a fool he'd been to sacrifice the whole thing just to say he'd kept his promises on process.

Bottom line: just as Republicans are finding right now, in NY-23, in the FL Senate race, and elsewhere, "big tents" can involve uncomfortable compromises. But the alternative is to do nothing, which is far worse.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: RMA On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:41 pm

jpete wrote:So stocking, in this fantasy land you live in where candidates give theoretical answers to hypothetical questions, what prevents Obama from asking CSPAN to televise the debates and ordering his staff to publish bills on a website?


Roger that...

Sfull,
You're creating ***F A N T A S T I C*** conditions and *O D D* rationalizations. [If,If,If]

Let's Keep I Simple
OBAMA did not do as promised.

He is a SENATOR making these promises.
He [according to some] Did not, just, 'fall off the turnip truck']


Bob
RMA
 

Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:43 pm

See, none of you guys can deal with the substance; you all resort to attacks on me.

Which is fine. You just have to realize that you've lost the argument. :P
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: spc On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:49 pm

stockingfull wrote:if humiliating a Senator whose vote you need


As opposed to "retirement"?


http://www.nationalpost.com/news/world/story.html?id=2414500
This link is broken, either the page no longer exists or there is some other issue like a typo.
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Re: Obama promising to televise health care on C-span

PostBy: coalkirk On: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:36 pm

stockingfull wrote:See, Terry, that's what's called a personal attack. It's about me, it has not one word about the thread. As a mod, you should know better.


That's not a personal attack jonathan. It's pointing the absurd way in which you view things that most others can see in simple black and white. Common sense stuff. Obama says ABC, does XYZ and you do nothing but make excuses and BS reasons why. We all know you have been a professional word parser since ah, 1988 was it? I think I saw that somewhere out there on thw www. But some things are just real simple and you don't neeed a degree from Syracuse to understand. A lie is a lie. You can't turn around and say well the opposition party didn't fall in line and kiss my ass so I had to break my promise. Besides, the great ones party has the Senate and the House so he doesn't need Republicans. They showed that during healthcare talks when NO republicans were invited.
By the way, if I were attacking you, there would be any doubt so get over yourself. :P
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