Need Help, Please - Mark II

I have a Harman Mark II stove. I believe it's rated for 2000 square feet, which is the size of our house. The stove is in the "basement" which is above ground, but concrete. We live upstairs. I live in the pocono mountains, so it's fairly cold here, average temps around 30. We currently have the stove heating the house to around 65 as long as the temps don't dip below 20. Overnight, the electric heaters kick in to keep the house at around 60. I want (of course) the house to be warmer, but don't know how to make the stove more efficient. Here's my routine.

At about 6:00 am it is shaken down and ash taken out. It is then filled up to the top of the bricks. Around 11 or noon I go check it and it needs to be shaken, I add more coals. Then again at 5pm. Same thing around 9 or 10 at night. Then it sits all night until 6am when it all starts again. Am I fussing with it too much? I have the draft open between 1.25 and 2 depending on the weather.

Critique my routine, please

Ducting it upstairs is the best way to get the heat where you need it. Either with a blower, fan , etc... and have a good cold air return path back down (Stairway, etc..)

Are you monitoring the stove temps, exhaust temps, etc...? So you know where you are operating the stove and how hot you are actually running it?
Do you have a baro damper? set correctly with a draft gauge?

Well, we have a duct "rigged", we cut a ceiling/floor vent near the stove, and added a fan to blow the air up into the living room. We have stairs leading to downstairs on the other side of the house, so good there, right?

Finished basement or no?

I'm heating a 1900 sq ft "raised ranch" with a Mark I. I have an unfinished basement that is basically wide open so just the heat from the floors heats upstairs. It's maybe 75* downstairs and 72* upstairs right now. It's 34* outside and that's the warmest it's been in a week. If it was single digits overnight, the oil burner might kick on a bit but otherwise it never comes on.

All the walls are insulated upstairs and down and there is about 10" in the attic.

I only tend the stove twice a day. Three times max.

Tough to tell why you can't make enough heat. You running a barometric damper?

There's that baro question. No. um - I have to be honest and say I don't really understand what that is, where to get one, or how to install it. I have read the threads, but just don't "get it". the basement is "finished" in the sense that there are walls up, but the space isn't livable just yet. It needs better flooring (still the concrete), doors, the ceiling isnt finished in parts. I know, too much info.
A few things about me might help to know. I am female (obviously) But I am a girly female. I have been left in charge of this stove through no want of my own. I don't typically do this kind of thing, and am not sure of my capability of doing so. Other than that, I don't know what I am doing wrong other than maybe fussing with it too much?

The barometric damper is an addition that can only enhance efficiency.

The Barometric Damper provides:
+ a relatively constant draft
+ an adjustment to draft
+ the ability to add room temperature air to the exhaust (as compared to stove temperature)

Without the barometric damper you lack these fuel and heat saving measures.

Bob

The Barometric damper will keep the hot gases in the stove longer and let unheated air into the flue.
You stove will give off more heat.

Shellie_wnj wrote:There's that baro question. No. um - I have to be honest and say I don't really understand what that is, where to get one, or how to install it. I have read the threads, but just don't "get it". the basement is "finished" in the sense that there are walls up, but the space isn't livable just yet. It needs better flooring (still the concrete), doors, the ceiling isnt finished in parts. I know, too much info.
A few things about me might help to know. I am female (obviously) But I am a girly female. I have been left in charge of this stove through no want of my own. I don't typically do this kind of thing, and am not sure of my capability of doing so. Other than that, I don't know what I am doing wrong other than maybe fussing with it too much?

Well, your basement doesn't sound much different than mine so don't feel too bad.

Have you had the stove a while? Did it previously work acceptably? That might indicate if something changed or if it's something you're doing.

Hi Shellie, You said that your basement is concrete walled, and above ground, the basement is partially finished. Did you insulate behind the finished walls? If not, you are trying to heat the concrete walls, and you just won't be able to. Is there insulation packed in the floor joist ends, and around the perimeter of the floor, just above the concrete walls? If not, this is one of the greatest heat loss areas in most homes.

You said your house is 1900sqft, is that the upper level or the two levels combined? If it is the size of the upper level, then your stove is trying to heat 3800sqft, not 1900 !!
What is the temperature in your basement? You said 60-65* upstairs, but what is the basement's temp?

Do you have a thermometor on the stove, and on the stove's flue pipe? These two locations help you see how much heat is being made, and you will then be able to 'fine tune' your coal burning to help your situation.

So, when you visit the stove, shake it, and add more coal, is the coal level really low? Are you shaking because the coal appears to be all burnt up?

I'll describe a 'normal' feedling/shakiing cycle.

In the morning, the coal is well burnt down, you open the ash pan door, to let in a lot of air to the fire, the fire gets hotter [brighter red], the flue thermometer shows a rise in temperature., you close the ashpan door [to keep dust inside], and shake untill you see the fire level drop an inch or two [depends on the stove]. [Some people add coal before shaking, especially if the fire is nearly out.] Then you slowly open the ashpan door [letting dust get drawn into the stove, and you look at the ash to see if it is 'reflecting' the red from the grates and fire above, or if it is still dark, or you crouch down and look through the ashpan door opening at the bottom of the grates, to see if you see red, glowing coals through the grates. If you see red, you are done shaking, if you don't, you need to shake some more.. you want to shake the ashes down so they don't block the air flow to the fire, and shake enough that you see red glowing coals above the grates.
Then slowly open the loading door, and add several inches of fresh coal, leaving a corner or side with exposed red hot coals. close the loading door, and either stand there with the ashpan door open, or set a LOUD egg timer to go off in 5 minutes.. or wear an alarm around your neck.. Either way, you don't want to leave the room without either setting an alarm or closing the ashpan door. With the door open, the fresh coal will start quickly, once you see the little blue-white flames coming up through the fresh coal, you can close the ashpan door, open the loading door and FILL the firebox with coal, all the way to the top of the firebrick, and mound it up in the middle. Close the doors, and leave it alone till that night.

Roughly 10-12 hours later, you want to take out the ashpan, it will be cooler now and no dust from a recent shaking. [This is one technique, some people keep two ashpans, to swap back and forth].. Then follow the above proceedure again.

Just before retiring for the night, top off the firebox, filling it to the top of the firebrick again.. Maybe a shake or two, but not a full shake-down.

This the way that many of us tend our stoves, there are many variations. but usually a morning, evening and one more top-off just before bed is all that is needed.

The Barometric damper stablizes the draft, which is the suction in your chimney, that pulls combustion air through your 'spinner' air vents. If the draft is constant, and consistant, then your air settings with the 'spinner knobs' will be consistant. With out a barometric damper, you could have wide variations in the chimney draft, which will show up to you as wild variations in burn temperatures and burn times. The baro gives you a solid baseline to set your stove's combustion air.

Hope this makes sense,, take some time and read some of the many threads on the forum, there is a lot of knowledge and experience available to the reader.

Greg L

a thermometer on the stove top and on the stack can show how much you are defrosting the poconos. there are many baro threads and they are nothing to be afraid of..

they keep constant the air flowing thru the coal and maintain the burning coal bed's air flow so as to allow maximum heat radiation..

where in the poconos?

[quote="jpete]
Have you had the stove a while? Did it previously work acceptably? That might indicate if something changed or if it's something you're doing.[/quote]
This is the third year with the stove. The first year we didn't know what we were doing. Last year I quit - I just couldn't get a fire to last more than a few hours. so far this year the fire has lasted, we haven't had to re-light, but it's just not keeping the place as warm as we need it. 68 would be ideal, but it varies so much.

LsFarm wrote:Hi Shellie, You said that your basement is concrete walled, and above ground, the basement is partially finished. Did you insulate behind the finished walls? Um, I don't know? Remember, girly female here. The house was partially finished when we bought it, so I don't really know. I do know that the finished parts are drywall. If not, you are trying to heat the concrete walls, and you just won't be able to. Is there insulation packed in the floor joist ends, and around the perimeter of the floor, just above the concrete walls? If not, this is one of the greatest heat loss areas in most homes. Again, and unfortunately, I don't know. I am trying to learn more about everything all at once here - trying to become less "flaky" I guess you could say. I do know that only the outside walls and floor are concrete - the rest is drywall.

You said your house is 1900sqft, is that the upper level or the two levels combined? If it is the size of the upper level, then your stove is trying to heat 3800sqft, not 1900 !! No, that's the whole house. 950 downstairs and 950 up.
What is the temperature in your basement? You said 60-65* upstairs, but what is the basement's temp? it's fairly hot in the room with the stove, but as you move into the next room, the temp drops considerably. But, same goes for upstairs. near the vent is warmer than on the other side near the stairwell. That just seemed ok to me, being that's where the stove is, right?

Do you have a thermometor on the stove, and on the stove's flue pipe? These two locations help you see how much heat is being made, and you will then be able to 'fine tune' your coal burning to help your situation. No, but we have a digital thermal thingie You press the button and a laser points on a spot and reads the temp. The temp of the stove is between 300 and 500 degrees depending on when we last loaded it, and the pipes are between 100 and 250 degrees on the way out.

So, when you visit the stove, shake it, and add more coal, is the coal level really low? Are you shaking because the coal appears to be all burnt up? In the morning it's lower, but I notice it doesn't lower significantly until I shake it. I do the same thing as you when I shake, just wait for the level to go down and see red underneath. however when I load it, I don't leave the ash door open. Could that have something to do with it?

Greg L

Thank you so much for your help, I am really trying to get a handle on all of this!

Hey, PoconoEagle! I am in near Mt Pocono. Where are you?

........

Shellie_wnj wrote:Hey, PoconoEagle! I am in near Mt Pocono. Where are you?

5 minutes away. Up 611 past the airport

Your temps sound like they are in the ballpark (300 - 500 on the stove and 100 - 250 on the flue pipe). I would guess that it is a heat distribution issue more than anything which is a typical hurdle for a stove. The other question that comes to mind is how well insulated the upstairs is and how good your windows are at keeping out the cold. You are probably "overtending" the stove a little, I would expect that you should only need to tend the stove 2 or 3 times per day.