Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: sterling40man On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 1:22 pm

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- A new proposal to curb global warming could jump start stalled Senate greenhouse gas discussions and put an average of $1,100 a year back into the pockets of American consumers.

Known as cap-and-dividend, the recently introduced bill would require oil, coal, and natural gas companies to buy permits each month to sell their fuel. Three quarters of the proceeds would be returned to the public each month in the form of a dividend check, with the remaining money going towards renewable energy, conservation or assistance programs.




http://money.cnn.com/2009/12/23/news/ec ... 2009123014


Well guys, be ready for a gas and coal price hike if this goes through! :mad:
sterling40man
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Richard S. On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 1:37 pm

That's ridiculous and they'll pawn it off as a benefit to the sheep who see the big fat check Uncle Sam sends them and blame the oil and gas companies for rising prices. All the while sticking 1/4 of it in their pocket.....

While consumers will see their gas or electricity prices rise, supporters say cutting out Wall Street will prevent speculators from driving up the cost of carbon credits just to make a buck, and ultimately save consumers money.


You have to love how they spin it, first part of the sentence says you'll pay more then they follow it up with you'll save money.

A staffer for the bill's other sponsor, Sen. Susan Collins, R-Maine, said that after receiving some $1,100 in rebate checks each year and paying higher gas and electric prices, the average Maine consumer would come out $102 ahead.


From the money tree on the WH lawn? How does the government take in $1000, take $250 for itself then return $1100.... :lol:
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: franco b On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:00 pm

Makes "Alice in Wonderland " look logical.
franco b
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Paulie On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 4:59 pm

Cap and Trade of any form is dead, bet on it.
Paulie
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Black_And_Blue On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 5:43 pm

Paulie wrote:Cap and Trade of any form is dead, bet on it.


That's a bad bet.

The EPA is interpreting a court decision and will forward the cause of taxing and regulating "green house" gasses.

http://www.atr.org/userfiles/file/012510lt-GGN_Jackson_CarbonRegulation.pdf

Consider how you or a business could function under a Banana Republic and make preparations.


ETA : Lest we forget that the Zero administration had planned for the revenue from a cap & fraud scheme in the budget....


http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-02-01/obama-drops-646-billion-in-cap-and-trade-revenue-from-budget.html
This link is broken, either the page no longer exists or there is some other issue like a typo.
Last edited by Black_And_Blue on Tue Feb 02, 2010 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Black_And_Blue
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: smokeyCityTeacher On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 5:48 pm

Black_And_Blue wrote:
Paulie wrote:Cap and Trade of any form is dead, bet on it.

That's a bad bet.
The EPA is interpreting a court decision and will forward the cause of taxing and regulating "green house" gasses.
http://www.atr.org/userfiles/file/012510lt-GGN_Jackson_CarbonRegulation.pdf
Consider how you or a business could function under a Banana Republic and make preparations.


Time to stock up on Coal. Like I said in an earlier post - having a ten or twenty ton supply of coal at today's prices would not be such a bad idea.
smokeyCityTeacher
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Black_And_Blue On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 6:06 pm

I'll just leave this quote here :

"If you have a government in place with an inherent antipathy towards the market and capitalism, and I believe this government does, I wish it weren't true, but this is the government of community organizers. They believe in social justice."

Sen Judd Gregg NH.
Monday, February 1, 2010
Black_And_Blue
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Alaska 140

Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Stephen in Soky On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:19 pm

I suspect the big over done cap and trade bill is dead as well. However, I don't think further EPA regulations achieving the same results are in any way dead. What they can't achieve openly with legislation, they'll try to achieve via new regs. I don't recall Congress approving the mandatory catalytic converter on cars? Yet we have them. I could enumerate countless other regs affecting our day to day lives and checking accounts that were simply put in place without much input from the citizens or congress but you see where I'm coming from.
Stephen in Soky
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Richard S. On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:27 pm

Black_And_Blue wrote:The EPA is interpreting a court decision and will forward the cause of taxing and regulating "green house" gasses.


The court ruling allows them to regulate CO2 under the current Clean air Act, Congress can amend the act to exclude them from doing that. Keep in mind they work for us. Actually the current energy bill does that but that is certainly no consolation.
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: djackman On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:30 pm

Richard S. wrote:That's ridiculous and they'll pawn it off as a benefit to the sheep who see the big fat check Uncle Sam sends them and blame the oil and gas companies for rising prices. All the while sticking 1/4 of it in their pocket.....


That scheme is good enough for residents of Alaska. :D
djackman
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: SMITTY On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:41 pm

Until the current administration is fired & flipping burgers, I would be VERY worried about this .... :idea:

Nothing surprises me anymore. This admin is so unreasonable & so out of touch with voters that it could very well pass. :mad:
SMITTY
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: jpete On: Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:29 pm

The thing is, since the 1990 Clean Air Act, we've already got cap and trade. Now they are just trying to make money off them.
jpete
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Richard S. On: Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:04 am

jpete wrote:The thing is, since the 1990 Clean Air Act, we've already got cap and trade.


One of the arguments is that it worked for other pollutants but there's a big difference between capping pollutants and trying to cap CO2, you're going to create CO2 according to the volume you burn no matter what. You either need to reduce output or capture and store it which would require a huge expense. On the other hand one way they lowered sulfur emissions was by simply switching to low sulfur coal from the powder river basin. In the 70's very little of the coal came from there but now it accounts for something like 40% of the US supply. I think it was inevitable that would have happened anyway because it's so easy to get to. Other things they did were increasing efficiency, better burning techniques etc.

Image
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Berlin On: Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:18 am

there's already a legal challenge to fight this in a very creative fashion underway. worry not :)

"However, the E.P.A.’s proposal came under immediate fire from the large emitters that it would regulate. The National Petrochemical Refiners Association said that the E.P.A., if it moves forward with greenhouse gas regulation, would be required by the Clean Air Act to enforce its rules even for the small emitters — those that, like many mom-and-pop operations, emit as few as 250 tons of greenhouse gases a year." http://greeninc.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/ ... -emitters/

this is one place (among many) a fight will be taking place, not just from the industry groups mentioned in the article, but many others - they will try to force the EPA to regulate small emitters like the clean air act says it should (since that's what it's trying to regulate CO2 under) and in the process will 1. not be capable to do so 2. force c02 regulation out of the clean air act due to political/legislative pressure.

(make sure your senators and representatives know where you stand on this global hoax- be sure to make your voice heard)
Berlin
 
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Re: Fight global warming, get $1,100 a year

PostBy: Richard S. On: Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:54 am

Berlin wrote:there's already a legal challenge to fight this in a very creative fashion underway. worry not :)


Well that's another thing, as long as tied up in the courts long enough to get some sane people back into power it can then be amended.. bye, bye EPA.
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
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