Gun question

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Should a loaded assault rifle be allowed on a tour of the White House, Senate, or House?

Poll ended at Tue May 04, 2010 7:09 pm

Yes
6
21%
No
23
79%
 
Total votes : 29

Re: Gun question

PostBy: tvb On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 6:03 pm

pvolcko wrote:
It was a silly thing for the ban to have existed in the first place. I give the President credit for signing the law, particularly since it goes against his prior professed ideology and the impulses of his left wing supporters.


I believe it was Reagan who signed that previous bill into law

jpete wrote:In theory, you should be allowed to carry anything, anywhere. If you believe in the Constitution, then you aren't likely to be a threat. I would deprive another person of their life, liberty, or happiness unless I believed he was trying to do it to me in an immediate manner.



Tim McVeigh fancied himself to be a defender of the Constitution. I'm sure he didn't mean to hurt anyone with his bomb 15 years ago yesterday.

Dann757 wrote:You don't stand for anything.


I could stand to see your head explode in anger but based upon your reaction to me and others who disagree with you, it may already have.
tvb
 
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: lowfog01 On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:07 pm

tvb wrote:My point, LIsa, which had you bothered to read you would know, is that if it weren't for President Obama, you and your friends wouldn't have been able hold your rally at Ft. Hunt which is a national park, and thus federal property.

And the 47% not paying taxes is besides the point because depending on which poll you would like to believe, anywhere between 35% - 53 % of tea partiers earn less than $50,000 a year, putting them squarely in the category of not paying taxes, particularly with the tax cuts this past year that benefited that income group. Dare I say that I suggest your next sign at a strap on party or tea party ask why such a large number of your fellow attendees don't pay taxes?


In the first place, a quick research reveals - by the left leaning CBS news, no less - that the only reason that Obama signed off on this bill was to get a bill changing how credit cards are regulated passed. Obama wanted the Credit Card bill passed more then he didn't want the guns in National Parks and made a deal with the gun lobby, i.e. the Republicans. So Obama gets no credit for "his positive" 2cd Amendment stand. Nothing about Obama has changed.

My question stands. What's your point? Do you think that we would have not been able to find another meeting point along the River. The entire state of VA is open carry as should be every state in the Union. The fact of the matter is you found it funny that the turn out was low although this was due to the event being held on a work day. I asked if you also felt that it was funny that the reason turn out was low was because many of us who would have liked to be there couldn't because of work so we could continue to support the 47% of Americans who don't pay any federal income taxes. That's not beside the point, that's exactly the point. Well, do you think that's funny or even right?

The Obama tax cuts which you espouse may indeed put some tea partiers who earn less the $50,000 in the category of not paying taxes. Despite your claim that this is a "large number" you don't know how many are in that position. Since you didn't provide your source, I"ll assume you are quoting the recent PEW poll and that poll found Tea Partiers tended to earn higher then average incomes. The Link
http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/ocs/liheap/guidance/SMI75FY09.pdf
This link is broken, either the page no longer exists or there is some other issue like a typo.
puts the average US income for 2009 at $70,000 plus. Notice that's a government website. If you have other data, please supply the link. The accumulated data seems to counter your argument. I find it revealing that the folks earning less then $50,000 are still out there protesting the current administration. I know I fit that bill and I'm out there at every opportunity. The fact is we realize that this is not sustainable; it steals our independence and our kid's future.

So I'll ask again, do you think it is funny or even right that 53% of American's can't do what they would like to do while the government takes the results of their labor away so that the other 47% can partake of the services the Federal Government provides without paying a cent. Many would consider that theft by taking and that's not funny no matter which way you try to spin it. Lisa
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: rberq On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:17 pm

jpete wrote:If you believe in the Constitution, then you aren't likely to be a threat.

I understand what you mean, but we could say because priests believe in God they aren't likely to be a threat to children.

jpete wrote:But I see no reason why individual locations can't make rules governing who is allowed to enter and under what conditions.

And that really is the point of the poll, which admittedly poses an extreme question. The majority in this miniature poll believe there are SOME limits to where SOME weapons may be carried. But it's not really clear that a majority agrees with you that "individual locations" can set their own rules.

And we commonly think of "arms" as rifles, pistols, and such. But maybe my weapon of choice is half a dozen hand grenades clipped to my belt. Not very selective weapons, but they certainly fall in the category of "arms". I might need to fling a couple in the shopping mall to deal with a threat. I wonder, does the constitution guarantee my right to carry them?
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: rberq On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:29 pm

lowfog01 wrote:... the only reason that Obama signed off on this bill was to get a bill changing how credit cards are regulated passed

You are correct, Lisa. So do we give credit to those who held the credit card bill hostage, or to the guy that paid the ransom?

lowfog01 wrote:... 47% ... 53% ... $50,000 ... $70,000 ...

Whatever the exact percentages are, it is incongruous that a substantial number of tea partiers protesting taxes do not in fact pay those taxes.
rberq
 
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: rberq On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:32 pm

freetown fred wrote:rberq,you continue to humor Momma & me

Glad to be of service.
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: jpete On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 8:13 pm

rberq wrote:
jpete wrote:If you believe in the Constitution, then you aren't likely to be a threat.

I understand what you mean, but we could say because priests believe in God they aren't likely to be a threat to children.

jpete wrote:But I see no reason why individual locations can't make rules governing who is allowed to enter and under what conditions.

And that really is the point of the poll, which admittedly poses an extreme question. The majority in this miniature poll believe there are SOME limits to where SOME weapons may be carried. But it's not really clear that a majority agrees with you that "individual locations" can set their own rules.

And we commonly think of "arms" as rifles, pistols, and such. But maybe my weapon of choice is half a dozen hand grenades clipped to my belt. Not very selective weapons, but they certainly fall in the category of "arms". I might need to fling a couple in the shopping mall to deal with a threat. I wonder, does the constitution guarantee my right to carry them?


As far as I'm concerned, you can carry a suitcase nuke. Up until the point that you use it, you are no threat to me.

If you use a hand grenade to "defend" yourself, and you cause an innocent bystander to lose his life, liberty or pursuit, then you go to jail for the rest of your life. Period.

If you whip out a hand grenade and a fellow citizen puts a round between your eyes, then I'd say we have a justifiable homicide on our hands. I would not prosecute that person.

I am in favor of fewer laws and harsher punishments. But I stop at capital punishment because I believe the government is often over zealous in it's prosecution and after you put someone to death, you can't fix that. Even if someone is in prison for a number of years and is later proven to be wrongly convicted, then the government owes him compensation.
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: Dann757 On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 8:51 pm

tvb wrote:I could stand to see your head explode in anger but based upon your reaction to me


HAHAHAHHAHAHA what a sweetheart. So thoughtful and intelligent.
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: rberq On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:17 pm

jpete wrote:If you use a hand grenade to "defend" yourself, and you cause an innocent bystander to lose his life, liberty or pursuit, then you go to jail for the rest of your life.

How about if you use a handgun to defend yourself, and a shot goes astray and kills an innocent bystander? Jail for you?
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: tvb On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:18 pm

Sorry, you;re right, I should have included citations:

NYTimes/CBS News poll conducted 4/5/12. http://documents.nytimes.com/new-york-t ... cument/p41 35% claim an income below $50K

Gallup poll from March 26 - 28 has 45% claiming an income below $50K. http://www.gallup.com/poll/127181/Tea-P ... ics.aspx#1

And here is the source of the 47% pay no taxes meme that talk radio has used to inflamed those who can't be bothered to do their own research. http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/



`
tvb
 
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: freetown fred On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:37 pm

Gun Control---being able to hit what you're shooting at!
rberq wrote:
jpete wrote:If you use a hand grenade to "defend" yourself, and you cause an innocent bystander to lose his life, liberty or pursuit, then you go to jail for the rest of your life.

How about if you use a handgun to defend yourself, and a shot goes astray and kills an innocent bystander? Jail for you?
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:30 pm

tvb wrote:
Dann757 wrote:
tvb wrote:Dare I say that I suggest your next sign at a strap on party
Your tasteless statement above clearly reveals your character. Very sad.


You've got a dirty mind. Every picture I've seen has people with their guns strapped to their hips, sides or back. Don't disparage me just because your mind is in the gutter.



he nor most of us do not. you in your usual snarky and very sleezy way with words, purposefully

used the "strap on" wording to another women as a low life way of trying to insult her. imo

all of us REAL americans can and always see thru you as its a blatant stab in your usual passive agressive manner..... :sick:
Poconoeagle
 
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: lowfog01 On: Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:54 am

rberq wrote:
lowfog01 wrote:... the only reason that Obama signed off on this bill was to get a bill changing how credit cards are regulated passed

You are correct, Lisa. So do we give credit to those who held the credit card bill hostage, or to the guy that paid the ransom?

Just making the point the Obama didn't sign this thing because he felt it was a good thing to do for the gun owners of the country. He was playing politics as usual. He didn't do us any favors.

lowfog01 wrote:... 47% ... 53% ... $50,000 ... $70,000 ...

Whatever the exact percentages are, it is incongruous that a substantial number of tea partiers protesting taxes do not in fact pay those taxes.


You and TVB keep saying that large or "substantial number of tea partiers protesting taxes do not in fact pay those taxes." How do you know that? I can't find that statement anywhere in any form of media. I find data that says that the majority of Tea Party people make more then the average salary and that's way over the $50,000. And even if that is true so what, that still doesn't make it right. There are lots of laws that are on the books which are taken advantage of by people who shouldn't take advantage of them but do anyway. An example is that many large cities subsidizes the commute of employees via the Public transportation system. That adds up to millions of dollars every year. Do the top earners there need that subsidy? They probably didn't even ask for it because of they'd expect a backlash but if it's offered they'll take it. It still doesn't make it right. Lisa
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: lowfog01 On: Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:57 am

freetown fred wrote:Gun Control---being able to hit what you're shooting at!
rberq wrote:
jpete wrote:If you use a hand grenade to "defend" yourself, and you cause an innocent bystander to lose his life, liberty or pursuit, then you go to jail for the rest of your life.

How about if you use a handgun to defend yourself, and a shot goes astray and kills an innocent bystander? Jail for you?


Morning Fred,

That's the bumper sticker on my truck that gets the most laughs and also the one that drives the libs the most wild. :D lisa
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: sterling40man On: Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:07 am

3 pages and counting! :lol:
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Re: Gun question

PostBy: SuperBeetle On: Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:49 am

tvb wrote:
Dare I say that I suggest your next sign at a strap on party


Ah yes. More of tvb's words of wisdom.
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