what's this "good luck with that bill" BS?

I hate all of the cookie cutter development houses that are everywhere. Nice house Greg.
It’s too bad most people don't even consider coal.

I burn wood and we stay very warm. Its something we enjoy, and I get my exersize doing it. We heat a 2400 square foot home approx. 150 years old with 10 foot ceilings. The house stays around 76 all winter long and we have used 200 gallons of propane since nov of 2005. We have a LP furnace, dryer and stove. Coal is okay if you can get it cheap enough, and you have the proper unit to burn it. I can get 8 to 10 hours with our indoor wood furnace. I have tried coal but with no heat output and wood being free. I chose to continue with wood. We average 6 cords a year and our whole home stays an even temperature.

laynes69 wrote:I have tried coal but with no heat output and wood being free.

Dang,,,, Burning a coal that produces not heat

I would stick with wood also Just hope I never come across that no heat coal brand.

I forgot the chimney cleaning. Another messy Saturday spent on free wood.

laynes69 wrote: I have tried coal but with no heat output and wood being free. I chose to continue with wood

Ok..please explain how you "burn coal" and get "no heat output".......this I gotta hear.....PS I'm a wood burner too.....

My wood furnace isn't designed to burn anthracite coal. Its not the coal, because its a very high quality anthracite. I don't get enough draft, and the firebox has a large taper. I don't feel like modifying the firebox to burn coal when it does just fine with wood. I don't want to deal with the soot from soft ohio coal. So I tried the anthracite with little to no results. The coal burned a dull orange and would put out some heat but very little. 3 pieces of wood would produce alot more heat. I think its due to the large flame of the wood, rather the little blue flames of the anthracite. Its a US Stove hotblast wood/coal furnace. Its got the shaker grates.

laynes69 wrote:My wood furnace isn't designed to burn anthracite coal. Its not the coal, because its a very high quality anthracite. I don't get enough draft, and the firebox has a large taper. I don't feel like modifying the firebox to burn coal when it does just fine with wood. I don't want to deal with the soot from soft ohio coal. So I tried the anthracite with little to no results. The coal burned a dull orange and would put out some heat but very little. 3 pieces of wood would produce alot more heat. I think its due to the large flame of the wood, rather the little blue flames of the anthracite. Its a US Stove hotblast wood/coal furnace. Its got the shaker grates.

So are you burning mixing both wood and coal at the same time?

I quit burning coal all together. I just burn wood now. Its all I want for free, so its the option I choose. I tried coal many times and not alot of heat output. If the furnace was designed for hard coal it would be a different story.

Charlie Z wrote:I'm 4 long weekend days into bucking, splitting, and stacking about 5 cords of 'free' fruit wood (trunks delivered by the farmer, which saved a ton of time and work). Not finished.

I'll have to move those 11 ton of wood again when they season to the woodshed, then again into the house. Bars, chains, splitter, sharpening. It's good exercise, but there is nothing 'free' about it.

NG is more than 2x the cost of coal. Here's the breakdown per therm (MBTU) for my area. Wood is listed @ $175/cord, coal @ $165/ton:

Wood $13.71
Coal $9.00
Elec $50.69
Oil $21.98
NG $18.75
LP $28.46

With coal only costing ~$560 for our heat a season, I can't afford 'free'.

A therm of natural gas is about 100 cf. Right now I am paying $1.20 per 100 cf or $12.00/ mcf. are you sure that you are paying that much. If I payed $18 a therm I would be paying 3780 a month to heat my house.
I have burned wood and it can be considerably cheaper than any thing else. It took my dad and I 8 hrs to get the wood and another 8 or so to split and stack it. That was ten chords and it lasted all winter for both of us, although I burned most of it. 32 hrs x $5.65 + $50 for fuel = $230. If I take half of that , It cost me less than $150 to heat my house with wood for a whole winter. I did work my tail off for a few days but it was worth it.
The wood we got was already cut down and cut to length. It is not always that easy but never much harder. If it looks like it will be to much work let someone else get the wood. The way I figure it I made better than $30 a hr processing wood. I figured this by takeing what I would pay for gas in a 3 month period minus the cost of wood divded by 16 hrs.
On a final note I don't want to seem like I am bashing coal cuz I like it too, and will burn it if it is cost effective. In order to be worth the effort I would have to save a minimum of $50 a month over gas. Till then I will burn wood.

blue83camaro wrote:

Charlie Z wrote:I'm 4 long weekend days into bucking, splitting, and stacking about 5 cords of 'free' fruit wood (trunks delivered by the farmer, which saved a ton of time and work). Not finished.

I'll have to move those 11 ton of wood again when they season to the woodshed, then again into the house. Bars, chains, splitter, sharpening. It's good exercise, but there is nothing 'free' about it.

NG is more than 2x the cost of coal. Here's the breakdown per therm (MBTU) for my area. Wood is listed @ $175/cord, coal @ $165/ton:

Wood $13.71
Coal $9.00
Elec $50.69
Oil $21.98
NG $18.75
LP $28.46

With coal only costing ~$560 for our heat a season, I can't afford 'free'.

A therm of natural gas is about 100 cf. Right now I am paying $1.20 per 100 cf or $12.00/ mcf. are you sure that you are paying that much. If I payed $18 a therm I would be paying 3780 a month to heat my house.
I have burned wood and it can be considerably cheaper than any thing else. It took my dad and I 8 hrs to get the wood and another 8 or so to split and stack it. That was ten chords and it lasted all winter for both of us, although I burned most of it. 32 hrs x $5.65 + $50 for fuel = $230. If I take half of that , It cost me less than $150 to heat my house with wood for a whole winter. I did work my tail off for a few days but it was worth it.
The wood we got was already cut down and cut to length. It is not always that easy but never much harder. If it looks like it will be to much work let someone else get the wood. The way I figure it I made better than $30 a hr processing wood. I figured this by takeing what I would pay for gas in a 3 month period minus the cost of wood divded by 16 hrs.
On a final note I don't want to seem like I am bashing coal cuz I like it too, and will burn it if it is cost effective. In order to be worth the effort I would have to save a minimum of $50 a month over gas. Till then I will burn wood.

Blue83,

How do you figure that even at $18/Million BTU's that it would cost you $3780/month to heat your house?....No way..............that would mean you use 2,000 CCF (200,000 cubic ft) and unless you have a 27,000 sq ft house, there's no way you'd use almost $4,000/month to heat your house.....are you sure you didn't mean $378/month??? P.S. my 1650 sq ft ranch uses 125 CCF MAX during the coldest month so 2000 CCF means I'd have a 27,000 sq ft house

jjbaer wrote:

blue83camaro wrote:

Charlie Z wrote:I'm 4 long weekend days into bucking, splitting, and stacking about 5 cords of 'free' fruit wood (trunks delivered by the farmer, which saved a ton of time and work). Not finished.

I'll have to move those 11 ton of wood again when they season to the woodshed, then again into the house. Bars, chains, splitter, sharpening. It's good exercise, but there is nothing 'free' about it.

NG is more than 2x the cost of coal. Here's the breakdown per therm (MBTU) for my area. Wood is listed @ $175/cord, coal @ $165/ton:

Wood $13.71
Coal $9.00
Elec $50.69
Oil $21.98
NG $18.75
LP $28.46

With coal only costing ~$560 for our heat a season, I can't afford 'free'.

A therm of natural gas is about 100 cf. Right now I am paying $1.20 per 100 cf or $12.00/ mcf. are you sure that you are paying that much. If I payed $18 a therm I would be paying 3780 a month to heat my house.
I have burned wood and it can be considerably cheaper than any thing else. It took my dad and I 8 hrs to get the wood and another 8 or so to split and stack it. That was ten chords and it lasted all winter for both of us, although I burned most of it. 32 hrs x $5.65 + $50 for fuel = $230. If I take half of that , It cost me less than $150 to heat my house with wood for a whole winter. I did work my tail off for a few days but it was worth it.
The wood we got was already cut down and cut to length. It is not always that easy but never much harder. If it looks like it will be to much work let someone else get the wood. The way I figure it I made better than $30 a hr processing wood. I figured this by takeing what I would pay for gas in a 3 month period minus the cost of wood divded by 16 hrs.
On a final note I don't want to seem like I am bashing coal cuz I like it too, and will burn it if it is cost effective. In order to be worth the effort I would have to save a minimum of $50 a month over gas. Till then I will burn wood.

Blue83,

How do you figure that even at $18/Million BTU's that it would cost you $3780/month to heat your house?....No way..............that would mean you use 2,000 CCF (200,000 cubic ft) and unless you have a 27,000 sq ft house, there's no way you'd use almost $4,000/month to heat your house.....are you sure you didn't mean $378/month??? P.S. my 1650 sq ft ranch uses 125 CCF MAX during the coldest month so 2000 CCF means I'd have a 27,000 sq ft house

I might be confused but I thought his chart said $18.75 for a therm. That is where I got my numbers. I do know that last winter it would have cost me more to heat with coal than natural gas allthough this winter will be different if natural gas continues on its current trend. i am going to buy coal this summer and see what natural gas does. If it goes down I will burn wood if it stays where it is at I will burn coal and wood. Wood is still the cheapest for me but the coal is less work.

blue83camaro wrote:

Charlie Z wrote:I'm 4 long weekend days into bucking, splitting, and stacking about 5 cords of 'free' fruit wood (trunks delivered by the farmer, which saved a ton of time and work). Not finished.

I'll have to move those 11 ton of wood again when they season to the woodshed, then again into the house. Bars, chains, splitter, sharpening. It's good exercise, but there is nothing 'free' about it.

NG is more than 2x the cost of coal. Here's the breakdown per therm (MBTU) for my area. Wood is listed @ $175/cord, coal @ $165/ton:

Wood $13.71
Coal $9.00
Elec $50.69
Oil $21.98
NG $18.75
LP $28.46

With coal only costing ~$560 for our heat a season, I can't afford 'free'.

A therm of natural gas is about 100 cf. Right now I am paying $1.20 per 100 cf or $12.00/ mcf. are you sure that you are paying that much. If I payed $18 a therm I would be paying 3780 a month to heat my house.
I have burned wood and it can be considerably cheaper than any thing else. It took my dad and I 8 hrs to get the wood and another 8 or so to split and stack it. That was ten chords and it lasted all winter for both of us, although I burned most of it. 32 hrs x $5.65 + $50 for fuel = $230. If I take half of that , It cost me less than $150 to heat my house with wood for a whole winter. I did work my tail off for a few days but it was worth it.
The wood we got was already cut down and cut to length. It is not always that easy but never much harder. If it looks like it will be to much work let someone else get the wood. The way I figure it I made better than $30 a hr processing wood. I figured this by takeing what I would pay for gas in a 3 month period minus the cost of wood divded by 16 hrs.
On a final note I don't want to seem like I am bashing coal cuz I like it too, and will burn it if it is cost effective. In order to be worth the effort I would have to save a minimum of $50 a month over gas. Till then I will burn wood.

Blue,

see charlies numbers in the table above....he says $18.75 per MBTU (million BTU's) which is $18.75 for 10 therms or $1.875 per therm.....that would make your heating bill $378/month which is still a lot of money but not the $3,785 you quoted. At your rate of about $1.20 per therm, you'd pay about $250/mo.

castiron wrote:

blue83camaro wrote:

Charlie Z wrote:I'm 4 long weekend days into bucking, splitting, and stacking about 5 cords of 'free' fruit wood (trunks delivered by the farmer, which saved a ton of time and work). Not finished.

I'll have to move those 11 ton of wood again when they season to the woodshed, then again into the house. Bars, chains, splitter, sharpening. It's good exercise, but there is nothing 'free' about it.

NG is more than 2x the cost of coal. Here's the breakdown per therm (MBTU) for my area. Wood is listed @ $175/cord, coal @ $165/ton:

Wood $13.71
Coal $9.00
Elec $50.69
Oil $21.98
NG $18.75
LP $28.46

With coal only costing ~$560 for our heat a season, I can't afford 'free'.

A therm of natural gas is about 100 cf. Right now I am paying $1.20 per 100 cf or $12.00/ mcf. are you sure that you are paying that much. If I payed $18 a therm I would be paying 3780 a month to heat my house.
I have burned wood and it can be considerably cheaper than any thing else. It took my dad and I 8 hrs to get the wood and another 8 or so to split and stack it. That was ten chords and it lasted all winter for both of us, although I burned most of it. 32 hrs x $5.65 + $50 for fuel = $230. If I take half of that , It cost me less than $150 to heat my house with wood for a whole winter. I did work my tail off for a few days but it was worth it.
The wood we got was already cut down and cut to length. It is not always that easy but never much harder. If it looks like it will be to much work let someone else get the wood. The way I figure it I made better than $30 a hr processing wood. I figured this by takeing what I would pay for gas in a 3 month period minus the cost of wood divded by 16 hrs.
On a final note I don't want to seem like I am bashing coal cuz I like it too, and will burn it if it is cost effective. In order to be worth the effort I would have to save a minimum of $50 a month over gas. Till then I will burn wood.

Blue,

see charlies numbers in the table above....he says $18.75 per MBTU (million BTU's) which is $18.75 for 10 therms or $1.875 per therm.....that would make your heating bill $378/month which is still a lot of money but not the $3,785 you quoted. At your rate of about $1.20 per therm, you'd pay about $250/mo.

see charlies numbers in the table above....he says $18.75 per MBTU (million BTU's) which is $18.75 for 10 therms or $1.875 per therm.....that would make your heating bill $378/month which is still a lot of money but not the $3,785 you quoted. At your rate of about $1.20 per therm, you'd pay about $250/mo. This all started from conflicting info. It says in his post therm right before MBTU. All I was saying was if gas cost $18.75 a therm I would be paying that much a month for gas. I was not trying to say I would actually pay that much.
Here is a chart for my area last winter the only thing that I know to be accurate is the price of coal and natural gas.

$20.60 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$1,957.00 per year for normal home for Oil
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$7.71 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$732.45 per year for normal home for Hardwood
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$8.86 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$841.70 per year for normal home for Softwood
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$32.23 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$3,061.85 per year for normal home for Electric
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$16.39 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$1,557.05 per year for normal home for Pellets
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$10.32 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$980.40 per year for normal home for Natural Gas
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$27.04 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$2,568.80 per year for normal home for LP (Propane) Gas
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
$10.80 per Million BTU of Heat delivered to home
$1,026.00 per year for normal home for Coal

So according to this chart you can see why I wouldn't pay for coal last year. If I lived farther east I would def burn coal all of the time.

Title changed, Happy? I added Geothermal to this category.

Good chart, I live 150 miles from the nearest coal mine and Anthracite works out to $7.40/million BTU's delivered. I bet the guys in NEPA are around $5/mmbtu's