Thermostat ???

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: McGiever On: Sat Oct 08, 2011 10:05 pm

Way to go Frytown. :D

Good to hear you had great success on wiring up your thermostat. Also good you were able to use your original stat.

Will be waiting to hear how your "Light up Night" goes on Tuesday.

I'm going to be burning my Homemade F/A Stoker Unit going into this heating season...and plod along at a slow and steady pace installing my '59' Axeman Anderson 130M as my schedule allows. Have had it sitting here for 5 months and wasn't home to do anything w/ it. Sometimes employment gets in the way of home projects. Oh well, make hay when the sunshine's :) .
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: McGiever On: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:18 pm

Frytown wrote:Something else that came about.
I have a L7224U Aquastat controller.
AA calls for a L8124C
Any one see any possible problems with this :shock:


From Honeywell...

The L7224U Oil Electronic Aquastat® Controller provides
electronic temperature sensing in a UL limit-rated
controller with a single sensing probe. The L7224U
controls the circulator, oil burner and boiler temperature.
The L7224U replaces the L8124A, L8124C, L7124U,
L7148A, L7248A,C, L7224A,C, and L8148A Controllers.

The Aquastat Controller is intended for use in
residential-type applications.
The L7224U provides status and diagnostic information
through an LED display combined with LED lights to
enhance the diagnostic process.

Do you have the separate High Limit Aquastat as spec'd by AA?
L4006A I believe.
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Frytown On: Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:31 am

Yes!
Frytown
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1957 Axeman Anderson 130 to FHA
Coal Size/Type: Pea

Visit Lehigh Anthracite

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Frytown On: Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:13 pm

FIRE!! After 5 hrs of modifying. We had air lock in the heat exchanger so had to go to town to get. Sharkbites and two boiler valves. Also moved the flow check after the circulator on the heat supply side.( Did this because. The heating supply company said the flow check balances or helps cut down on turbulence for the motor prolonging life of motor). My problem is still the darn THERMOSTAT!! It won't stay locked in stage 1 very long??? It is in stage one for about twominutes then kicks the propane on?? Any ideas? I like the idea of the backup but not if it is going to kick on each time. I may just put second stage on a single pole switc and leave it off. ;)
Frytown
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1957 Axeman Anderson 130 to FHA
Coal Size/Type: Pea

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Rob R. On: Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:28 pm

Does that theostat have any adjustments to control how and when the second stage is brought online?

A separate thermostat for the propane sounds like a simple fix, but I know you want to avoid fishing wire. You could run the "second stage" power through an aquastat on the AA, or you could go with that single pole switch idea. :D
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: AA130FIREMAN On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:25 am

Run the "second stage" wire threw an aquastat that breaks on rise, connected to the pipe on the fancoil. If the pipe fails to get hot in your 2 minutes, the propane kicks in. And if it does get hot, by by propane, hello coal :D
AA130FIREMAN
 
Stove/Furnace Make: axeman anderson
Stove/Furnace Model: 130 anthratube

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: McGiever On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 2:03 am

I understand your frustration, but my suspicion is that when the stat see more than, say, 1/2 to 1 degree below set-point it wants to call the 2nd stage to help.
That being said, it will run along just fine in 1st stage once it gets to satisfy the stat the first time. Don't panic as the "cold start" is tricky...it will level out when room temp catches up to set-point.

Only if you again ever bump the stat up would it bring on the 2nd stage...but not for long...if your H/X coil is sized big enough it will quickly drop back to only 1st stage.
As mentioned, a strap on aquastat could cure this...but how much propane are we talking about here? A little exercise for the propane keeps it ready for when it may really be needed.
A switch would work too but, if inadvertently left off your back-up will never work.

:idea: Here is a test to my claim above...lift/remove and tape temporarily the W2 wire at the furnace and let the boiler run up and satisfy the stat.
Without changing the stat set-point, re-connect W2 and see if on the next call for heat it is all on the boiler.

Let us know :)

And there is always this option:

Now if you want to flip-flop, make FA Furnace Heat stage1...and boiler Heat stage 2, so if your away for a few days the FA Furnace will truck along on 1st stage only. When you would return home, build another coal fire and just switch off the FA Furnace "W Heat relay" (stage 1) and the boiler will take over on 2nd stage.

Call it a Vacation Switch
Last edited by McGiever on Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: McGiever On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 2:45 am

Frytown, What did you do in Programming?

Special function
Auxiliary heat control (Setup Function 26):
• Comfort Setting: The thermostat will prioritize comfort over economy depending on heat pump performance, load conditions and whether the thermostat is calling for the heat pump. Raising the temperature just a few degrees will often activate the auxiliary heat. You don't want this.
• Economy Setting: The thermostat will attempt to reach the temperature setting without activating the auxiliary heat. The thermostat will wait to activate the auxiliary heat depending on heat pump performance, load conditions and how many degrees the temperature setting is changed. This is what you want.
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Frytown On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:55 am

I thought the same thing about option 26 back when I programmed it , however it would nt let me access 26 in the programming steps. Remember I did the stat as a 2heat 2cool Conventional. I wonder if changing it a bit to a different type would help matters

Baby woke me up at 330 am. Fed him -back to sleep. So I snuck out to check on the fire. It was all black inside a little concerned at first. So I went to the timer and rolled it to the 1 minute contact. Fire was right there.Boiler temp 180. No problems. I also really like the digital read out of the stat. Don't know if I have a deep enough fire yet, Anthrastat is set at 170. Checked the ash bucket. No coal at all strictly ash. I imagine the boiler has just been chugging along on the timer and low limit differential all night. No need for heat tonight. So I'm happy there is still fire.
Frytown
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1957 Axeman Anderson 130 to FHA
Coal Size/Type: Pea

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Rob R. On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:17 am

Frytown wrote: Anthrastat is set at 170.


AA recommends 140. I hope that was a typo.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Frytown On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:16 am

No, by the way , when was the last time someone calibrated one of these thermostats from 157, I do imagine it is off. It got to late last night and it kept fire. However I called for heat first thing this morning and it blew hot air for a bit then cool. Apparently it was chugging along at the Low Limit differential all night then when the call for heat came it couldnt keep up. Temp at unit was 145 durring call for heat. I imagine the circulator shut off until the unit got to temp of 160 but the fan kept blowing. Coal fire was not glowing at all but fire did start back up. I think I just have a low fire.
Frytown
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1957 Axeman Anderson 130 to FHA
Coal Size/Type: Pea

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: McGiever On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:45 am

Frytown wrote:I thought the same thing about option 26 back when I programmed it , however it would nt let me access 26 in the programming steps. Remember I did the stat as a 2heat 2cool Conventional. I wonder if changing it a bit to a different type would help matters

Baby woke me up at 330 am. Fed him -back to sleep. So I snuck out to check on the fire. It was all black inside a little concerned at first. So I went to the timer and rolled it to the 1 minute contact. Fire was right there.Boiler temp 180. No problems. I also really like the digital read out of the stat. Don't know if I have a deep enough fire yet, Anthrastat is set at 170. Checked the ash bucket. No coal at all strictly ash. I imagine the boiler has just been chugging along on the timer and low limit differential all night. No need for heat tonight. So I'm happy there is still fire.


Yeah, I wondered if that might of been the case.
Looks like Aux and/or Emergency is only available w/ Y and O/B option and NOT w/ W and W2 option.

Might try playing w/ lower numbers here in programming... Range is from 1 thru 12...This is your coal boiler...I'd say a 1 or 2???

5 Stage 1 heat cyclerate (CPH: cycles/hour)*

5 For gas or oil furnaces of less than 90% efficiency
1 For steam or gravity systems
3 For hot water systems & furnaces of over 90% efficiency
9 For electric furnaces
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: AA130FIREMAN On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 11:51 am

Frytown wrote: Apparently it was chugging along at the Low Limit differential all night then when the call for heat came it couldnt keep up. Temp at unit was 145 durring call for heat. I imagine the circulator shut off until the unit got to temp of 160 but the fan kept blowing. Coal fire was not glowing at all but fire did start back up. I think I just have a low fire.
Does the stoker start when you turn up the thermostat (as long as the temp is 10 deg below the high limit) or is it just running off the low limit ?
AA130FIREMAN
 
Stove/Furnace Make: axeman anderson
Stove/Furnace Model: 130 anthratube

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Frytown On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:29 pm

Its running according to the OIL Burner Stats manual. If memory serves correctly (currently at work) if there is a call for heat it will continue heating untill the high limit is reached. If there is no call for heat the boiler will maintain the low limit setting. So when it gets cold out and there is high demand for heat, this will not be a problem. Ive thought about changing the low limit differential to 5 degrees from 160, and keeping the high limit at differential of 10 degrees from 180. High limit aquastat is set at 200.

Will need to play around with it to see whats going on.
Frytown
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1957 Axeman Anderson 130 to FHA
Coal Size/Type: Pea

Re: Thermostat ???

PostBy: Rob R. On: Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:36 pm

You need to calibrate the anthrastat, read the following post for guidance: I think I solved my excessive ash problem (aa130)

Frytown wrote:Temp at unit was 145 durring call for heat. I imagine the circulator shut off until the unit got to temp of 160 but the fan kept blowing. Coal fire was not glowing at all but fire did start back up. I think I just have a low fire.


Yes, if you have the low limit set at 160 with a 10 degree differential, the C1/C2 terminals will have no power below 150 degrees.

How many teeth is the ashing arm engaging on each stroke?
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Visit Lehigh Anthracite