leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:48 am

I believe my AnthraKing 110 has the same firing unit. What does LL recommend rice or buck? I have had 4 TT loads of coal so far in my coal burning life and I kept retention samples. All classed as rice and probably all Jeddo. The first two batches in the Pocono were fine as long as I did not push it. If I went above 30 or so on Max (coaltrol controlled), the fire seemed not as bright as there were more fines in the coal and the bed got too thick. Same thing on the AnthraKing. Now on my latest delivery there are much less fines and the overall sizing is definitely bigger and boy does that fire now crank. So as related to your problem, if the coal is too big then these stoves really take off and as they are ultra efficient you may have a problem. So with my old coal (more fines) I use on Poconos and DVCs as in my application they are never going to be stressed and everything is just fine. The AnthraKing 110 has an impossible job in my application (I haven't connected the second one - so far) and during short cold spells this winter I needed BTTW (where TTW is to the wall) - I'm still keeping up, impressive!!!. Now translating this experience to your setup I just wonder if the coal is too big.

Conclusion, stove is just fine and so is the coal (nothing wrong with the Jeddo as I have received it). So it's play time, a mined product will always change a bit - gonna be fun. I'm thinking keep a little buck on hand for the bad times.

Come the spring I am going to do sieve size analyses as I have a commercial unit sitting in the tractor shed from my old days when I was of use to somebody (on a good day).
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: Rob R. On: Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:57 am

coalnewbie wrote:Now translating this experience to your setup I just wonder if the coal is too big.


You bring up an excellent point. Somehow I completely missed the fact that he was burning buck. With a small stoker and a shallow bed, buck is going to make maintaining an idle fire difficult.

Here is a quote from a different thread on burning buck:

steamup wrote:I have a ka-6 that I am burning buck in. The dealer recommends buck for natural draft systems and rice for direct vent systems.

I found my buck to be a little larger than average. Under load conditions it burns fine but after about 2 - 3 days of idle conditions in warm weather, I was having out fires. I am mixing about 20% rice coal in and it prevents the outfires.


I suggest mixing some rice coal in with the buck and starting over with the adjustments.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Tue Jan 10, 2012 5:03 pm

I suggest phoning Dave or Matt and asking them rice or buck. I see no reason to use buck at all.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

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Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: jpd989 On: Tue Jan 10, 2012 6:34 pm

The paper work from Leisure Line states that rice or buck can be used in the 110 boiler. That was one of the deciding factors in my buying it. I should be firing up tomorrow afternoon. I will have to monitor this as I have a ton of buck at this time. I will post back on my progress
jpd989
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hand Fed Coal Stove: D.S. Machine Basement Stove #3
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat and Chestnut
Stove/Furnace Model: LL110k Boiler

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: Siff On: Wed Jan 11, 2012 4:22 pm

When I picked up my unit, I asked Matt what he used, and he said he burnt buck. I hope I am not putting any words into his mouth.

Maybe he will chime in why he prefers Buck.

I burn buck fine and have not had out fires. Something seems fishy about your unit / setup.
Siff
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: 110K

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: kstills On: Wed Jan 11, 2012 4:34 pm

Personally, I've never found the sweet spot for keeping the LL110k from dumping. I finally gave up for this year, as my dump zone is in the house and since the temperatures around hear is below 50F most days, that just means the house stays warmer longer.

I give mine enough head to allow it to dump the heat to the house, because as you've found out those out fires suck. So once an hour or so if there's no call for heat my boiler dumps.

I'd like to hear if any of the other 110k guys have gotten this figured out, because that's the hardest thing to fine tune on this machine. Come spring, the old boiler will get hooked into the new one, and I'll have 50 or so gallons of water to keep heated, which I think will make setting the idle a whole lot easier.

BTW, I burn rice.
kstills
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: WL 110
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: steamup On: Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:29 pm

I have been following this thread loosely. Just a note on my experiences this year. I found that the K-6 works much better on a mix of 20% rice in the buck. I needed more air with the buck to keep the fire burning and a longer timer setting. This was over heating the boiler and activating the dump. Now with the rice mix, I have it dialed in to idle just fine.

The AA130 did not overheat when I tested it this spring. However, after insulating the boiler shell, the water temps shot up on sudden shutdown. I have adjusted the aquastat a little and gotten the dump zone hooked to turn on the boiler circulator on over temp. It is working fine, but the workshop is a little warmer due to increased hot water circulation which partially defeats the savings from the insulation on the boiler. I will be playing with it a little more.

My observation that has been eluded to here. The K-6 has 50 gallons of water in it and takes quite a bit of heat to over heat. The Axeman Anderson 130 has 27 gallons and responds much faster due to the lower mass. The Leisure line only has 12 gallons of water in it, making it an extremely low mass boiler for a solid fuel boiler. Extreme measures may have to be taken with the LL boiler to minimize dumping. This means setting up the system expansion to allow the boiler to go to 240 degress before activating the dump. It will also require the low setting on the aquastat to be at 140 or a little lower.

Part of the problem may lay in the simple system dynamics. Coal boilers and thermostats are controlled as two position devices. They are on or off. This means the thermostat calls for heat, the boiler burner is fired until the thermostat is satisified or the high or operating setting on the aquastat is made. In the mean time, the fire has been fanned and fuel added in attempt to reach the hi limit. The high limit setting is typically what is needed at system design, which is only 2% of the time on average. This fire now must die down. One possible solution is to integrate a indoor-outdoor reset in the system. This would automatically limit the upper boiler water temperature based on outside air. If properly adjusted, this could have a tendancy to cut off the burner before the house thermostat was satisfied, allowing the fire to coast as the themostat was satisifed. Of course this would not be a 100% solution but certainly would help.

Another issue is with larger mass boilers, there is less need to dump because the heat is lost through the jacket. While you can say that the dump zone is not activated as much, you still loose heat to a less desirable area such as the basement. You might better use the house as a dump zone rather than loose heat to a normally non-occupied area.

When I had my wood boiler going, it dumped to the house. This was fine, as the house might be a little warmer than the thermostat setting at times. My wife did not have any complaints about that setup. So, my suggestion is to dump to the house. In a single zone system like my wood boiler was, a high limit aquastat wired in parallel to the house thermostat would activate the boiler pump if the water temperature climbed above it's setting. This would dump heat to the house and let the boiler stay at idle.
steamup
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson AA-130, Keystoker K-6
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: HS Tarm 502 Wood/Coal/Oil
Coal Size/Type: pea, buck, rice

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: jpd989 On: Wed Jan 11, 2012 7:00 pm

I have been burning the 110 for almost 2 hours now. I burning Blaschak buckwheat. So far so good.
jpd989
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hand Fed Coal Stove: D.S. Machine Basement Stove #3
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat and Chestnut
Stove/Furnace Model: LL110k Boiler

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: klim1972 On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:27 am

Jdp989 im right down the road from you with same boiler and I still haven't got mine to idle down to and inch since I got it 4 months ago so far with the help of matt fromLL im slowly getting there with these timer settings. What are your times at so far
klim1972
 
Stove/Furnace Make: leisure line 110 coal
Stove/Furnace Model: 110 combo

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:29 pm

Jdp989 im right down the road from you with same boiler and I still haven't got mine to idle down to and inch since I got it 4 months ago so far with the help of matt fromLL im slowly getting there with these timer settings. What are your times at so far


My Poco 110K, AnthraKing 110K and your boiler are the same firing unit (I presume). Different heat transfer media and coaltrols, however. I just think until it gets really cold I would try an experiment with a few bags of rice. The LL guys burned buck, well it must have been last winter as the stove is new and cold, bitchy weather is great for buck. For the shoulder months/seasons you need to temper it a little.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: jpd989 On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:11 pm

klim1972 wrote:Jdp989 im right down the road from you with same boiler and I still haven't got mine to idle down to and inch since I got it 4 months ago so far with the help of matt fromLL im slowly getting there with these timer settings. What are your times at so far

1min on 5min off
jpd989
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hand Fed Coal Stove: D.S. Machine Basement Stove #3
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat and Chestnut
Stove/Furnace Model: LL110k Boiler

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: klim1972 On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:25 pm

Did you get yours to idle down with 5 off and 1 on without dumping
klim1972
 
Stove/Furnace Make: leisure line 110 coal
Stove/Furnace Model: 110 combo

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: jpd989 On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:35 pm

There is a little more than inch. My boiler is set at 185 high and 165 low. I have my blower at 50% and stoker at about 40% It seems to be running fine at the moment. I am still in the process of cleaning up my install. So i will be monitering the burn .
jpd989
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hand Fed Coal Stove: D.S. Machine Basement Stove #3
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat and Chestnut
Stove/Furnace Model: LL110k Boiler

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: klim1972 On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:23 pm

That's good I haven't come close to that year has your dumped and what is your feed screw set at. I figure he have to have almost the same settings since we both have the same units.
klim1972
 
Stove/Furnace Make: leisure line 110 coal
Stove/Furnace Model: 110 combo

Re: leisure line 110 coal boiler dumping constantly

PostBy: jpd989 On: Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:35 pm

I believe its 4 turns in. But im never marked it.
jpd989
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hand Fed Coal Stove: D.S. Machine Basement Stove #3
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat and Chestnut
Stove/Furnace Model: LL110k Boiler

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