fisher grandpa wood stove

fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: noodles On: Wed Nov 02, 2011 9:57 am

I am new to this board. I am replacing a door gasket on fisher wood stove. I believe it is a fireplace series grandpa bear model. My question is two-fold. Is the gasket set in the groove in the 2 doors or inside the groove seat on the stove itself? Also what size gasket should I use? I bought a round half inch gasket which I have not tried to glue yet. But is does seem to be a tight fit in the door groove and I am concerned this will affect the door closing securely. If I put a gasket on the stove groove itself it appears I would need a flat gasket of about a one-half inch sizing. Any suggestions are appreciated.
noodles
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fisher wood stove
Stove/Furnace Model: grandpa bear

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Wed Nov 02, 2011 5:34 pm

was there a old gasket there? most of the fisher's and like stoves didnt use gaskets just the dual track
Poconoeagle
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Buckwalter & Co. , EFM520
Stove/Furnace Model: No. 28 Glenwood 1880, Alaska

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: noodles On: Wed Nov 02, 2011 6:59 pm

Yes, there was a old gasket in the door frame, but it appeared too large and caused the 2-doors to close poorly. I have just finished cleaning this stove up and have never burned a fire in it yet. Also this stove does not appear to have a baffle plate in the top. Is this a worthwhile endeavor to install one?
Thanks Nels
noodles
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fisher wood stove
Stove/Furnace Model: grandpa bear


Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Wed Nov 02, 2011 7:10 pm

my opinion is that someone glued a gasket in there. mine never had one...

i think yes indeed it is a good idea to weld a baffle in on the outlet...

make the smoke stop for a sec and go around the baffle also makes the heat stop and transfer into the metal and thus increase the efficiency of the stove. although i can say the 500# of boiler plate steel sure can radiate the heat.... 8-)
Poconoeagle
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Buckwalter & Co. , EFM520
Stove/Furnace Model: No. 28 Glenwood 1880, Alaska

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: freetown fred On: Wed Nov 02, 2011 7:29 pm

They were not made airtight. My experience was using the screen that came with them & leaving the doors open. She's a heating monster. Yes--do the baffle but you will have to play with MPD to get your burn/exhaust right--or, with baffle, most used no pipe damper.Make sure your chimney is drawing well.
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:07 pm

Like this one?
Fisher Wood Stoves
No gaskets used in the doors.
Wood'nCoal
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: noodles On: Thu Nov 03, 2011 8:37 am

Thanks for the input. I am not sure what MPD stands for? Any suggestions on baffle fabrication size, distance from outlet, height, shape etc.. as I don't want to have a ineffective draft. Further note of stove is that it has a angle iron fixture underneath the outlet. What is the purpose of this?
noodles
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fisher wood stove
Stove/Furnace Model: grandpa bear

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: freetown fred On: Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:43 pm

Manuel pipe damper--goes in stove pipe --- mine is about 3' above the stove outlet--go to Tractor supply or some place that sells stoves & have a look see on the baffle question---a pix is worth a thousand words ;) Where you from wood burner??? :lol: w'nc, none of them have an exhaust coller??? I forget ???? :lol:
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Thu Nov 03, 2011 8:00 pm

Mine has no collar since it is an insert stove and just exhausts into the fireplace flue. It has a damper that is placed on top of the stove and attached to a handle that extends through the filler plate on the right side. When the flue liner was installed a cast piece was placed on top of the stove which covers the opening in the stove and the liner rests on the adapter. We had to cut slots in the adapter for the rod which the damper plate is welded to, the rod extends out to both sides of the stove and fits in "eyelets" that are welded to the stove.
The stand-alone Fisher stoves have an outlet collar.
Wood'nCoal
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Thu Nov 03, 2011 11:16 pm

the steel baffle is a mere flat plate bough 8" wide x 6" and between 1/4" and 1/2" thick.
for the rear vent stove it hangs from the roof down and angled back.

the main idea is to prevent the burning flame from getting sucked out the exhaust hole, in essence it would hit the steel plate and thus have to go around it thus preventing the flame travel directly out the exhaust.....
Poconoeagle
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Buckwalter & Co. , EFM520
Stove/Furnace Model: No. 28 Glenwood 1880, Alaska

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: noodles On: Fri Nov 04, 2011 8:07 am

Thanks, Poconoeagle your description is accurate of small angled plate below the outlet to prevent fire from sucking out the exhaust is what I felt must be the purpose. I am going to fabricate a steel plate from this plate and take it all the way across the stove and bring it forward I believe 15" to allow a 2" gap towards the front of the stove to allow for the draft and than try it out. If this is not the right size I will vary size until I get the right draft correct. It seems to me this is going to be a little trial and error with the baffle size. Thanks everyone for your input. Its starting to cool down here in North Carolina.
noodles
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fisher wood stove
Stove/Furnace Model: grandpa bear

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:13 pm

trial and error always is best!

welcome. just put new batteries in the smoke/co detector for the heck of it while your at it and happy heating! 8-)
Poconoeagle
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Buckwalter & Co. , EFM520
Stove/Furnace Model: No. 28 Glenwood 1880, Alaska

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Coaly On: Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:10 pm

I'll try to answer and correct all the misinformation here in one not so simple post;
Gasket material can be added, but should not be necessary. Putting a piece of flat material in the channel grove and closing the doors will show if it's too tight. New hinge pins are usually the answer to a correct seal, and the easiest fix. (Actually greasing the original pins yearly is the easiest fix) A dollar bill closed in the doors should pull out evenly all the way around with the same resistance. (cold, or it will cost you a few dollars to test) Doors can also be lapped with course grinding compound by laying stove on it's back, remove hinge pins and work door in circular motion with door weight to create a perfect seal between door and frame. Any cement from previous gasket material should be removed. People only think a gasket is needed due to all other stoves they've seen using them. As per Fisher Stove Works; Doors may be "surfaced at seals" removing no more than .050". Meaning some may be machined smooth for a better seal. The rough cast edge can be lapped as described above removing no more than .050 of material. Normal amount of lapping is only going to remove a few thousandths on both the door and channel to make a perfect match.

All Fisher Stoves ARE airtight in design, patented and tested as the first "airtight" stove made.
Chimney draft creates the negative pressure in the stove, pulling the doors tighter. A backpuff, or rapid combustion creating a positive pressure can push the door outward, leaking around the seal, but normal use is considered air-tight as designed.

The purpose of the "Smoke Shelf Baffle" plate is to roll the smoke back into the flame. EPA testing showed particulate without baffle 60 grams per every kg. wood burned. With baffle (Grandma III) 6 grams per every kg. wood burned. 90% reduction in smoke. This was acceptable for new standards that took effect July 7, 1986, but not for standards set to take effect July 7, 1988. (when they stopped production along with most others) Below is a picture of factory baffle, they sit on 1 1/2" angle iron, they are NOT to be welded in place due to expansion (lengthwise growth) bulging sides.
Second purpose is to direct most intense heat in stove to the stove top. Without baffle, this heat radiates rearward into elbow of rear vented stove. The intense heat at the slot created is the last chance to burn any smoke particles that would go up the stack. (Oxygen introduced here would have created the secondary burn and many companies would still be in business. The fire oxygen depleted this area, so particles went unburned)
The reason you find different baffles and boxes is due to revisions in prints sent to fabricators on the following dates; No baffle was used in the first design in 1976. This stove can be identified by "76 Star" doors that use a 1/2" round rod and round groove cast in the doors. No gasket material can be used in this design. 1977 dropped the Stars and went to a regular square groove in door with 1 inch channel iron 3 contact seal. June 26 1977 a "Draft box Assembly" was added. This is a fabricated box over the outlet, probably what noodles is referring to an "angle iron fixture". The revised print of the parts shows size and part numbers if you need to verify if this is what you have. I do not publish pictures of the prints.
July 22 1977 a "Draft Box Baffle" was added. This changed the model of the GM and GP to a GM II and GP II.
1980 was the big change to round top doors and a "Smoke Shelf Baffle". (GM and GP III) That is what you're referring to by building your own internal baffle across the stove. Pictured below, they are made of the same material as the top, 5/16 HRS.

poconoeagle referred to "boiler plate steel" construction. This is false. Boiler plate is certified, very expensive steel for use in high pressure boilers. All material used in manufacture of a Fisher Stove is designated to be HRS, Hot Rolled Steel. (you may know me by the way, I'm retired now but worked as a steam mechanic at Steamtown when the 2317 was put into service, and rebuilt the Baldwin 26 yard engine)

The size for a homemade baffle should allow the same square inch area that the exhaust vent is. Trial and error is one way, here's the mathematical way; Fireplace Series double door stoves are made in 8 and 10 inch outlet. "Restaurant Model" stoves called the XL are 10 inch, and 6 inch "Bear Series" single door stoves, you need to figure outlet sq. in. by; radius squared X pi (8 inch pipe = r of 4 X 4=16 X 3.14 = 50.24 square inches) This would be the opening above baffle. This should also direct flames toward upper top radius. About a 45* angle. Different stoves call for different angles due to box size changes from 4 piece box pre 1980 to one piece box, post 1980.

The easiest way to install a baffle plate is simply setting on two bricks, set upright along the sides on top of the first course. A-36 mild steel plate does not warp or sag. Depending on steel prices, about $30.00. It's the single best improvment to make to any Fisher that doesn't have a baffle. I would not use one without. Pictures and instructions here, http://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/74710/
I don't like to refrence different websites, but most of my work is published there with the most Fisher information available online. Everything covered above is referenced on the "Everything Fisher" thread I authored almost 2 years ago. (except the dates for revisions on prints above)

Here's the thread detailing the Grandpa Bear. My intention is to detail each model of the Fisher Stove; http://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/69448/
Attachments
Smoke Shelf Baffle 1984.JPG
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IN USE SINCE 1985 STRAIGHT AND TRUE 5/16 PLATE
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Mama Bear Baffle 1.JPG
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HOMEMADE UNDER $25
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Mama Bear Baffle 3.JPG
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OPEN SLOT = NO LESS SQ INCH AREA AS OUTLET
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Last edited by Coaly on Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
Coaly
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hopper Fed Hitzer EZ Flo
Baseburners & Antiques: Many, including most all Fisher models
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut / hard
Other Heating: Kitchen Queen 480

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Poconoeagle On: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:19 pm

but money's no object :D boiler plate for everyone :) err is that boiler makers :P :shots:
none for me tho, ;)
thanks Coaly for straighting the info out !

where in monroe are ya?
Poconoeagle
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Buckwalter & Co. , EFM520
Stove/Furnace Model: No. 28 Glenwood 1880, Alaska

Re: fisher grandpa wood stove

PostBy: Coaly On: Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:33 am

Northern, Price Twp. Wooddale all my life. My GGG grandfather settled along the Brodhead Creek Close to Clark Road that runs over to Henry's Crossing. His son married the daughter of John Price, the first settler in Price Twp. Becoming my GG grandparents. All the generations haven't moved since. Now I'm the oldest one left.
Coaly
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hopper Fed Hitzer EZ Flo
Baseburners & Antiques: Many, including most all Fisher models
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut / hard
Other Heating: Kitchen Queen 480