LL110 Venting Issue

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: plumber On: Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:03 pm

dh1200s wrote:This is interesting I know there are some variables to be nailed down like manometer reading. As we are aware jpen1 has a year of operation under his belt with his 110K. I see a manometer port on his set up and no mention of excessive fly ash build up/frequency of clean out in his 110K review. Maybe he will chime in on what his one year of operation has been related to fly ash build up in the clean out.

I have a deposit with no delivery date yet for my 110K and would like know what to expect with a properly setup 110K related to fly ash deposits in the clean out.

If he dosen't catch the question in this thread I will post in his thread ……….Dick


I don't think there is an issue with the boiler. I think this is from the crappy coal I'm burning, it makes a lot of ash up and down. I just cleaned it this morning and I've already got a film on the top of the boiler. As well I have to empty the ashpan every 100 lbs or so.
plumber
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: plumber On: Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:07 pm

markviii wrote:You need to get your draft checked.


I have 2 permanent manometers, one monitoring the draft the other monitoring the base. My draft is consistent around .04 and the base is about .03, it was just under .02 before I cleaned it today.
plumber
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: dh1200s On: Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:37 pm

plumber wrote:
markviii wrote:You need to get your draft checked.


I have 2 permanent manometers, one monitoring the draft the other monitoring the base. My draft is consistent around .04 and the base is about .03, it was just under .02 before I cleaned it today.


Good deal Plumber..........maintenance sounds like it's not an issue I'm burning good PA anthracite with no issues in the hand fired appliances.

Feeling a bit more comfortable with my purchase.......Dick
dh1200s
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL-110
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: HS-Tarm 202
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman TLC 2000

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Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: plumber On: Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:59 pm

dh1200s wrote:
Good deal Plumber..........maintenance sounds like it's not an issue I'm burning good PA anthracite with no issues in the hand fired appliances.

Feeling a bit more comfortable with my purchase.......Dick


Do yourself a favor and spring for the EZ cleanout option, makes maintenance real easy.
plumber
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: dh1200s On: Sat Nov 12, 2011 8:52 pm

plumber wrote:
dh1200s wrote:
Good deal Plumber..........maintenance sounds like it's not an issue I'm burning good PA anthracite with no issues in the hand fired appliances.

Feeling a bit more comfortable with my purchase.......Dick


Do yourself a favor and spring for the EZ cleanout option, makes maintenance real easy.



Yep got that and the 5GPM tankless coil in the order...... tnx plumber.

John good luck with your issue I'm sure it will get worked out. I think folks got you going in the right direction with the manometer install and see what draft you are pulling..........Dick
dh1200s
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL-110
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: HS-Tarm 202
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman TLC 2000

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: Rob R. On: Sat Nov 12, 2011 8:55 pm

plumber wrote:
markviii wrote:You need to get your draft checked.


I have 2 permanent manometers, one monitoring the draft the other monitoring the base. My draft is consistent around .04 and the base is about .03, it was just under .02 before I cleaned it today.


I was talking about John's boiler.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: kstills On: Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:30 am

plumber wrote:
johnniecuse wrote:
plumber wrote:
My boiler has bees going for about 5 weeks, and after seeing your post I decided to take a look. I had quite a buildup of flyash as well, not as bad as yours but close. So now I plan on getting out the vacuum every 4 weeks.



You are going to shut the boiler down every 4 weeks? It took me all evening to shut it down clean it up and restart. I can't see doing that all winter long.


Shut it down? No! This is my first year with coal and I'm determined to be a member of the one math club!

I shut off the service switch and let it cool for about 5 minutes. Opened the cleanout door and vacuumed the flue and the cleanout box itself. Closed the door and checked the fire ( if the fire was low I would have kicked it back on) Then I pulled out the baffles dropping and turning them a few times along the way, brushed and vacuumed out the tubes. Again checked fire, wiped down and reinstalled baffles then closed cleanout door. Now I pulled off the front cover, cleaned on top of the diverter baffle and the fire box. Put the front cover back on then took off and cleaned up the glass with a damp rag dipped in flyash. Start to finish all of 20 minutes.


Bingo.

I don't have the easy clean out option, so I had to take the sheet metal top off, then the insulation, then the cover for the boiler.

I had mine cleaned in about the time it took the idle to cycle (~7 minutes).
kstills
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: WL 110
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: kstills On: Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:36 am

I'd like to add that burning coal isn't like burning NG or oil.

It is a lot more hands on, at least when you haven't done it before.

My 110k was chugging along just fine with the current temps outside, I wasn't even tripping the HL from Wed to Sat.

Then I cleaned it out, and made a few very minor tweaks to the idle settings.

Last nite, my fire went out (should say this morning, cause I caught it before it had actually pushed any coal into the ash pan).

Personally, I check that thing every day. I read these boards every day. And I figure that after the first year running it, I'll have a pretty good idea on what goes on with it about 90% of the time.

On the plus side, today was 32 deg f outside to start, and I'm walking around with a t shirt on inside. Last year, I'd of had a t shirt, thermal and hooded sweatshirt on.

For me, I 'll spend to time to learn how to run this properly in order to stay comfortable all winter. :)
kstills
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: WL 110
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: WNY On: Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:58 am

Sometimes it takes a while to learn everything, but after a while, it's just routine with a coal appliance. Everyone tweaks or dials-in there boiler/stoves for optimum burning and heat output to be comfortable. Every home and stove heating is unique. What works for one, may not for someone else.

Enjoy!! :)
WNY
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Keystoker 90K, Leisure Line Hyfire I
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Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker, LL & CoalTrol
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Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: dh1200s On: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:00 pm

Kstills said ;“”For me, I 'll spend to time to learn how to run this properly in order to stay comfortable all winter.””

Yep that’s what it’s all about. I know when I first turned up my HS Tarm 202 in 82 there was not a lot of bulletin board support at 300 BAUD. Thank God Al invented the internet what a life saver. Got a great forum like NEPAXroads and the knowledge base that brings…………. and now connected to my cable modem at 135Mbps……. life is sweet.

Ditto on staying comfortable all winter. I hope to spread the heat out a bit better with the 110K. I was just a bit concerned about John’s fly ash but you 110K owners see no issues with the design. I had a bit of concern up front related to maintenance and did order the easy clean-out opt several weeks ago.

John, I made up an extra manometer port from this excellent post; :idea: Draft Test Port Install in Stove Pipe... http://nepacrossroads.com/about21625.html

If you want I’ll send it to you freebe just PM me if interested and I will snail mail. I had a hard time finding 1/8” NPSL lock nut and went with a plain vanilla NPT nut………Dick
dh1200s
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL-110
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: HS-Tarm 202
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman TLC 2000

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: dh1200s On: Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:03 pm

John,
Couple of pics on the manometer adapter I put together and sent to you following the MURDOC1 post. He did solid job with the brake line set up. I had the brass tubing and sleeving it down to fit the silicone tubing was a piece of cake.

Follow MURDOC1 post and you should have no problem and the Manometer Install thread is a great aid.

I have a limited drill index and worked my way up to a 3/8” bit and then slight touch up with the reamer and some hand files, round and flat to clean up the metal burr in the pipe.

Once you get your manometer you should be good to go to start taking readings and provide feedback to forum members in this post related to the draft your system is pulling. You and the other 110K owners are providing great info on the boiler. No word on a delivery date for me but I’m in no rush I have much plumbing prep work in front of me. The TLC 2K and the warmer weather here in SEPA are cutting me some slack.

The stove pipe you see I placed in my TLC 2K this afternoon and with 70 deg at 2:45PM here in Honey Brook I was pulling almost .3“ of WC with a very low coal burn. I have been running the
TLC 2K for six heating seasons as the primary heating appliance for roughly 1900 Sq’s. I have averaged 4 ton of nut thru the past heating seasons. I think once I hit the cold weather I will find that I’m over drafting. Guess I need to quit dragging my feet and put a baro in.

Look how good the dining room table is drafting :roll:
Good luck with your 110K………..Dick
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dh1200s
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL-110
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: HS-Tarm 202
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman TLC 2000

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: dh1200s On: Mon Nov 14, 2011 9:37 pm

""I was pulling almost .3“ of WC with a very low coal burn.""

Sorry meant .03
dh1200s
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL-110
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: HS-Tarm 202
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman TLC 2000

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: jpen1 On: Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:16 pm

I go away for a couple of days and boy am I late to the party. I think you will find that the biggest issue is poor quality coal at work here. When I first started the boiler last year I did have an incident olike John's but it wasn't another week to 10 days that my dad's keystoker stove threw a fit as well. That stove never had to be cleaned mid season before so that was definitely the coal. The ash had the properties of sub anthracite or bitty coal mixed in. With the clean out on I can go 2 months without issue about 6 weeks with out the cleanout before I want to take a look. Every coal is different so mileage will very. If you have the cleanout you can lift off the insulated top cover with the unit running. Then switch off the unit open the top up & vacuum out the top and tubes. I usually will give the turbolators a twist with a pair of pliers quickly which allows ash to fall down into the bottom of the unit at least every other cleaning. Then close the cleanout and flip the boiler back on. This can be done in 3-5 minutes and you don't need to do a complete shut down. Every other cleaning I pull off the front and knock the ash of the lower baffle above the fire but that really only needs to be done probaly 3 times a year. You can tell when the unit is getting dirty as your draft will start to degrade fairly substatially before you get to the point John experienced.
jpen1
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: 110 Boiler

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: johnniecuse On: Tue Nov 15, 2011 10:57 am

Thanks guys! Now that I know it's a little easier to do quick cleanup and not a complete shutdown, I feel a little better. I did a quick draft test, I think I did it correctly, and it was reading between .02 & .03. the reading was taken between the baro and the top of the unit.

jpen1 wrote: ...I think you will find that the biggest issue is poor quality coal at work here.


I am tending to believe this. I'm no expert, but it looks different than other suppliers coal that I have seen. It looks like there are pieces of 'duller' looking coal and a lot of dust in it. I don't know if it makes a difference or not. I will keep an eye on how it's burning. I got the coal from Woodford Bros. in Fabius NY. Is anyone else burning their coal?

Thanks for all the advice... :D
johnniecuse
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line 110K Boiler
Coal Size/Type: Rice

Re: LL110 Venting Issue

PostBy: Uglysquirrel On: Tue Nov 15, 2011 9:25 pm

Get a manometer, these days of warm weather reduce natural draft suggesting a need to boost the idle feed up a bit more to maintain draft. .

A manometer will tell you when your machine needs cleaning since the draft will start going down ever so slowly for a given outside temp, also crack the basement window open to ensure the basement pressure is pretty much the same as outside.

Yes, coal instruments need more frequent cleaning than oil and NG as previously noted. Its pretty much a every 5-6 week ritual with the Pocono, a long flexible dryer vent brush really accelerates the clean process along with a good vac with hepa filter.

Lastly, every time you need to clean it remind yourself of the 7 or so times you would be handling wood to feed a wood boiler not to discuss the creosote.

And if any type of alternate fuel source cleaning bothers you, they have a community called "The Villages" down south. :o
Uglysquirrel
 
Stove/Furnace Model: Pocono

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