Baro damper?

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: gambler On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:04 pm

Your draft is too low. With the higher outside temps your chimney is not drafting and when you increase the output of the stove the chimney gets hotter and starts drafting better. With a proper draft there is no reason for gaskets on the hopper. And again with a proper draft you do not need to dry the coal. Some people use the stove without running the convection fans and when the wet coal gets hot it can give off some odor. That is what I was told from a very good source. All you need to do is fix your draft issue by either waiting until it gets colder outside or you may be able to use a draft inducer.
gambler
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: Pioneer

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: rberq On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:15 pm

coalishot -
Have you checked the basics of the chimney, since it has never been used, that is, making sure it is clear, cleanout door is in place and snug, and there are no uncapped flue openings into it from an upper floor? Seems like with a 33-foot chimney you should have enough draft to suck pieces of coal up the flue, let alone combustion gases. Is it an inside chimney that will naturally stay warm, or is it built outside where it is constantly chilled by the air? It's conceivable that on a warm day, with a low fire and an outside chimney on the cold shady side of a house, the flue gases could be chilled enough to drop your draft to almost nothing as you are seeing. Remember that draft is produced by the difference in temperature between the flue gases and the ambient air temperature.

P.S. I have read that, as a rule, you shouldn't start a coal stove until temperatures will be under 55 degrees all day long. That's obviously not entirely true, because some people run coal boilers all summer long to heat domestic hot water. But again, the point is that your flue gases must exceed ambient temps by some minimum amount in order for the convection effect to make sufficient draft. It sounds like you will be OK when Winter really gets here.
Last edited by rberq on Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
rberq
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300
Coal Size/Type: Nut -- Kimmel/Blaschak/Reading
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators, propane

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:21 pm

Just spoke to Coalishot on the phone, the baro is just above the stove outlet, I recommended moving it farther away from the stove, at least 18". I feel the baro isn't operating properly and that's where the combustion odor is from.

It's a top vent stoker, the piping is as follows: vertical then an elbow with a horizontal going into the thimble. The baro is in the vertical section. He has a tall masonry chimney, so draft ability should not be an issue. Joe is going to move the baro to the horizontal section of pipe, hopefully this will solve the problem.

Any other ideas?
Wood'nCoal
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert


Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: coalishot On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:22 pm

You nailed my chimney right on. outside cold shady side of house. I will look down it tomorrow. I obviously am not burning as it has warmed up again.
coalishot
 
Stove/Furnace Make: ALASKA
Stove/Furnace Model: LIBERTY

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:23 pm

Have you checked the basics of the chimney, since it has never been used, that is, making sure it is clear, cleanout door is in place and snug, and there are no uncapped flue openings into it from an upper floor?


Good advice!
Wood'nCoal
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: rberq On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:26 pm

If he's using the standard Field Controls baro, remind him to move the weight to the other side when switching from vertical to horizontal pipe run.
rberq
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300
Coal Size/Type: Nut -- Kimmel/Blaschak/Reading
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators, propane

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:30 pm

Forgot to mention that on the phone, thanks.

Yes...it's a RC. He has a Dwyer Man-O-Meter.
Wood'nCoal
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: Wood'nCoal On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:33 pm

outside cold shady side of house.


See the photo of my chimney in the link I sent you.

Actually, both the chimneys are external, one on each end of the house. One is block with a liner, the other is thick fieldstone.
Wood'nCoal
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: coldwind On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:44 pm

Try again, first post didn't go. I have top vent with 2' vertical followed by elbow, then baro and 1' horiz. into thimble. chimney is 21' up from thimble. So maybe moving baro to horiz. might be way to go. Had it running with outside temp at 70* with no odor or CO on monitor. Did adjust min up 2 pts. because fire band looked weak.
coldwind
 
Stove/Furnace Make: LL
Stove/Furnace Model: Pioneer LE

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: rberq On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:48 pm

coalishot wrote:You nailed my chimney right on. outside cold shady side of house


Some people will frame and box in such a chimney, up to the roof line, and insulate around it to help keep it warm. Looks better too. My pre-fab fireplace chimney is done like that. Not a big job if you're handy. Wasn't a big job for me because I hired a handy carpenter.
rberq
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300
Coal Size/Type: Nut -- Kimmel/Blaschak/Reading
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators, propane

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: coaledsweat On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:09 pm

coalishot wrote:Ok been running all night very warm outside today. co sensor reads 0 but doesnt start til 30. sulfur smell present. Any suggestions.


Crack open a window, the appliance needs a better draft and the house is closed up. It is warm out and you are burning a very low fire, the fresh air will help you and the appliance.
coaledsweat
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: gambler On: Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:22 pm

coalishot wrote: co reads oo but it doesn't start til 30.


If it is a Nighthawk brand Co detector It will not display a reading until it reaches 30 but if you push the button on the right "Peak Level" it will display the reading of anything 10 or over. So if you had a reading of between 10 and 30 you need to push this button to display it.
gambler
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: Pioneer

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: ripcord On: Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:14 am

:?: This will be my first year burning wood and coal in my Harman TLC 2000. Big learning curve for sure,this coal forum has been a big help. I have to admit I'm a little confused about Baro dampers. I was told were I bought my stove that Harman doesn't recommend any dampers on the TLC 2000. If I want to put on a Baro damper it won't hurt,but I don't need it. I want to burn wood and coal so which way would it go on? I was told if I setup for burning wood I'll get fumes when I burn coal,and if I setup for coal I'll get creosotes on the outside of my pipes unless I use sealer which looks a little messy to me. Any help would be appreicated. Buck
ripcord
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Harman
Stove/Furnace Model: TLC 2000

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: LsFarm On: Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:58 am

I'd read the instruction/instalation manual from cover to cover.. Harman specificly wants a baro damper on several of their products that I've read a manual on.. Th TLC is a hand feed, and will benefit from a baro damper just like all stove do... there are several good long threads on this topic, well worth reading..

I highly recommend a baro damper for 90% + of stove instalations..

Greg L
LsFarm
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland

Re: Baro damper?

PostBy: ripcord On: Mon Oct 06, 2008 6:04 am

Thanks Greg,I agree it would help,but which way would it go on? The instruction for the baro damper states if burning wood position it with crimp end down and for other fuels,coal crimp end up,that is the million dollar question. If someone has the answer in this forum I just missed it. Will continue to read. Buck
ripcord
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Harman
Stove/Furnace Model: TLC 2000