Rick Santorum Suspends Campaign

samhill · By: **samhill** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:40 pm

No problem, bring it on if your putting the blame on me then your leaving someone else alone. It could just be that that someone is the one to blame but don't let a little thing like truth get in your way.

jpete · By: **jpete** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:41 pm

SMITTY wrote:Back to what I said about the Constitution: it's writings do no good without belief in God. Take God out of the equation, and the Constitution is just a piece of paper.

So it's impossible to respect the rights of others without believing in God?

I manage to be fairly successful at it...

rberq · By: **rberq** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:01 pm

jpete wrote:So it's impossible to respect the rights of others without believing in God?
I manage to be fairly successful at it...

I was told on good authority (religious nut who used to be my boss) that it doesn't count if you love your neighbor for his own sake. You have to love him for God's sake. So no credit for you. Sorry. :lol:

EarthWindandFire · By: **EarthWindandFire** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:11 pm

To be honest, I personally don't believe in God. Maybe because my mother passed away when I was just 12 years old, I don't know. But, my kids are not aware of my agnosticism, and never will be. I take them to Church and we talk about God often as a family. I personally WANT them to believe and I really hope they do so for the rest of their lives. For me, I would be more at peace internally if I were spiritual. I hold far too many grudges and grievances against others that I may not hold if I were able to make peace with myself and others with the help of spirituality.

jpete · By: **jpete** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:54 pm

rberq wrote:
jpete wrote:So it's impossible to respect the rights of others without believing in God?
I manage to be fairly successful at it...

I was told on good authority (religious nut who used to be my boss) that it doesn't count if you love your neighbor for his own sake. You have to love him for God's sake. So no credit for you. Sorry.

Good thing I can't stand my neighbor. I'd hate to waste all that good will on something that doesn't count.

But I still attempt to let him live his life as he sees fit, so long as it doesn't intrude on mine. Which it has too often, which is why I don't like him.

It's so much nicer around here when he is off "defending my freedom" and I don't have to deal with him.

tsb · By: **tsb** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:49 pm

Santorum was going to get a beating in Pa. Spector would have
a better chance and nobody likes him. He is probably a good human
being, but has been politically confused during his time in public service.
Shifts too much with the wind. Talks a good game, but votes another.

Richard S. · By: **Richard S.** On: Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:53 pm

samhill wrote:Hey, I'm a liberal & I don't mind a nativity scene anywhere City Hall wants to put it on public property but they also should allow others as well.

......any display that is religious should be banned. If public property has to cater to every religion under the sun, which it should if we're going to allow religious displays, it should cater to none of them. It's far too easy for the Rick Santorum types to back door ban other religious displays which only leads to resentment and sometimes violence. This is exactly why I'm glad Santorum is gone, his ultra religious belifs would have been a focus and I don't see him being able separate those beliefs from his politics.

EarthWindandFire · By: **EarthWindandFire** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:45 am

"There are many lessons to be learned from the campaign run by Rick Santorum. The first one, non-political. If you work hard in life, and don't give up, you are likely to succeed.

Nobody gave Santorum much of a shot last summer. His polling at about three percent but pretty much on his own, he convinced the voters of Iowa to support him. He did it by old-fashioned "meet the folks" campaigning.

Secondly, the Senator walked the walk, what he says he lives. Of all the politicians I know, Rick Santorum is perhaps the most sincere.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/oreilly/2 ... z1rurAytN0

jpete · By: **jpete** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:33 am

And politics is all about being "sincere". Once you can fake that, you have it made.

I guess O'RLY nevery heard of Ron Paul. :roll:

SMITTY · By: **SMITTY** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:46 am

Richard S. wrote:
......any display that is religious should be banned. If public property has to cater to every religion under the sun, which it should if we're going to allow religious displays, it should cater to none of them. ...

But nativity scenes have been used in the public square since the dawn of our country. It's our TRADITION. To hell with everyone else. It's an AMERICAN tradition. Our traditions are all under attack today.

jpete wrote:So it's impossible to respect the rights of others without believing in God?

I manage to be fairly successful at it...

Didn't say that Jpete - read the preamble of the Constitution:

We the People of the United States, In Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

The Blessings of Liberty. Note that They capitalized the word, Blessings. In the Declaration of Independence, it is said that: When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them .....
.......that they are endowed by their Creator with ...

This demonstrates The Founders strong belief in God. If you take God out of the equation, nothing The Founders said or wrote makes any sense. NOTHING.

jpete · By: **jpete** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:02 pm

SMITTY wrote:
jpete wrote:So it's impossible to respect the rights of others without believing in God?

I manage to be fairly successful at it...

Didn't say that Jpete - read the preamble of the Constitution:

We the People of the United States, In Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

The Blessings of Liberty. Note that They capitalized the word, Blessings. In the Declaration of Independence, it is said that: When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them .....
.......that they are endowed by their Creator with ...

This demonstrates The Founders strong belief in God. If you take God out of the equation, nothing The Founders said or wrote makes any sense. NOTHING.

If they meant "God", they would have said "God". But they said "Creator" which allows for all gods, any gods, or none at all.

Have you ever read Washington's correspondence with the synagog in Newport RI?

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Letter_to_Touro_Synagogue

lsayre · By: **lsayre** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:07 pm

Which god? As I understand it most of the Founding Fathers were certified Deists. They believed in and revered a god who created the universe (I.E. a Creator) and then effectively sat back and was (and is forever to remain) totally hands off from that moment forward. Thomas Jefferson did not believe in a Jesus who performed miricles. After his Presidency he wrote and published the "Jefferson Bible", which stripped all of the miracles (including the rising Savior) from the pages of the New Testament. You can find this bible in any library. I've read it. Jefferson carried out many conversations with John Adams by mail discussing such matters, and for which we still have many of their letters. They both did not personally believe in anything near approaching the Christian concepts of God that we hold dear today. Neither did Madison. Perhaps they didn't ever make this openly all to public, but their books and personal/private letters make it clear to see. And Ben Franklin was the world renound playboy of his time so I won't even go there.

samhill · By: **samhill** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:06 pm

If I remember right it was Jefferson that also wanted the Constitution to be rewritten every so often because he felt the dead shouldn't have too much influence over the living & that he & Adams & perhaps others had many conversations about that as well.

EarthWindandFire · By: **EarthWindandFire** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Thomas Jefferson is but one of the founding fathers, and in fact was a Deist.

John Adams and George Washington are much better examples of moral beliefs during the creation of this great Republic.

lsayre · By: **lsayre** On: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:17 pm

One of John Adams preserved letters:

"I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved-- the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!"
-letter to Thomas Jefferson

Plus a few more John Adams tidbits:

"God is an essence that we know nothing of. Until this awful blasphemy is got rid of, there will never be any liberal science in the world."

"This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it."

"The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. Nowhere in the Gospels do we find a precept for Creeds, Confessions, Oaths, Doctrines, and whole cartloads of other foolish trumpery that we find in Christianity."

And James Madison said:

"What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not."
James Madison - "A Memorial and Remonstrance", 1785

Ben Franklin next:

". . . Some books against Deism fell into my hands. . . It happened that they wrought an effect on me quite contrary to what was intended by them; for the arguments of the Deists, which were quoted to be refuted, appeared to me much stronger than the refutations; in short, I soon became a thorough Deist."
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