A few questions...

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: Rob R. On: Sat Oct 06, 2012 4:21 pm

Update to post above: I haven't found a manual for that control yet, but I found some info online that indicated the low limit is actually two sets of contacts. One breaks on rise, the other makes...so you could run the circulator off that if you wanted.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: stoker-man On: Sun Oct 07, 2012 12:18 pm

I use the 6081 on my hand-fired boiler. One of them begins/stops circulation between the hand-fired and my oil boiler, which has all the heating controls and the other forces on a zone valve in case it goes above the high limit. They work very well. They will not, however, maintain a constant boiler water temperature like a triple aquastat would do.
stoker-man
 
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: 1981 efm wcb-24 in use 365 days a year
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite/Chestnut
Other Heating: Hearthstone wood stove

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: Rob R. On: Sun Oct 07, 2012 12:28 pm

stoker-man wrote:They will not, however, maintain a constant boiler water temperature like a triple aquastat would do.


Why not? Seems like the low limit function and different would work the same on either aquastat.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: stoker-man On: Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:28 pm

It only turns on and off something else. Usually a circulator. So, in that case, a circulator would keep going on and off regardless of the thermostat setting, to keep the boiler at a steady temperature.
stoker-man
 
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: 1981 efm wcb-24 in use 365 days a year
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite/Chestnut
Other Heating: Hearthstone wood stove

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: JRDepew On: Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:37 pm

So, with this aquastat, the circulator would operate whenever the stoker is turned on, correct?

If the boiler hit the low limit (no call for heat from tstat):
With the 8124, the stoker would turn on, the circulator would stay off, in order to maintain proper boiler water temperature
With the 6081, the stoker would turn on, the circulator would turn on as well, and the house temperature would raise above the thermostat set point

I think this is not ideal. I see two ways to fix this, the first being a different aquastat. The second would be to wire in a relay for the circulator that the thermostat controls. That way, the relay would interrupt power to the circulator if the boiler hit the low limit. Correct?

Thanks,
Joe
JRDepew
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: Rob R. On: Mon Oct 08, 2012 6:29 am

Do you intend to use the tankless coil?
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: JRDepew On: Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:32 am

No on the tankless coil this year, but hopefully sometime in the spring or summer I will be getting one and running year round. My basement gets much too humid for my liking in the summer, and my HWH is electric. Warmer days is where I see a problem with the circulator running whenever the low limit is hit. Seems like I would be dumping unneeded heat into the house and wasting energy that could be used to heat the DHW.

Thanks,
Joe
JRDepew
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: Rob R. On: Mon Oct 08, 2012 9:08 am

If you want the circulator between the two boilers to run only on a heat call, you will need to run it off a separate relay. I have a R89A Honeywell collecting dust in the basement that will do the job, if you want to pay for shipping it is yours.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: JRDepew On: Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:54 pm

So I think I got the schematic wrung out. See the attached and let me know what you think. The only thing that was odd to me was jumping R (from Hi Limit) to the W Terminal on the L6081. This is the only way I could figure out how to not have the circulator come on if the low-limit was hit. The jumper between the two R terminals is also removed for this.

If I left the R jumper in and didn't jump R to W, the circulator would come on with the low limit, which wouldn't be ideal for DHW in the summer.

The only change I was thinking about making was removing the wire labeled "opt". This would allow the circulator to run independently from the stoker, and only the low limit or timer would turn the stoker on. This may be the ideal way, but I'm open for suggestions.

Thanks all,
Joe
Attachments
L6081a.pdf
Aquastat
(493.78 KiB) Downloaded 13 times
Select:BBcode: [nepafile=37016]L6081a.pdf[/nepafile]
R89a.pdf
Relay
(488.36 KiB) Downloaded 6 times
Select:BBcode: [nepafile=37017]R89a.pdf[/nepafile]
Wiring Schematic 2.pdf
Schematic
(241.2 KiB) Downloaded 16 times
Select:BBcode: [nepafile=37018]Wiring Schematic 2.pdf[/nepafile]
JRDepew
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: Rob R. On: Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:51 am

Looks like it should work fine, but I see no need to run the circulator with the timer.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: JRDepew On: Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:37 am

Rob,

I got that relay in the mail yesterday, thanks again. I put in 3-4 hours last night and got the rest of the conduit ran for the wiring, got all the wires pulled, and am down to my last 4 connections. Then I just need to complete the thermostat wiring, pop a hole in the side of the 55 gallon drum and fit the pipe, find something to set the drum on, put the inspection door on, and I will be ready to go.

Something that confused me when I was first drawing that schematic was that I wasn't used to the idea of the low limit on the aquastat being the only thing to maintain the boiler water temp. Once that clicked it came together nicely.

I think it is going to take me as long to clean up the mess I made of the basement as the wiring did :D

Thanks,
Joe
JRDepew
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: Rob R. On: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:07 am

Glad I could help.

Cinder blocks work good for supporting the drum, or 4" cement blocks if you are using the bin auger. Drill a few 1/4" holes in the drum for a drain...a old dog dish works good for a catch pan.

It sounds like you are on track to have blue flames tomorrow. If you are burning rice, 4 teeth and 4 air is a great place to start.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: JRDepew On: Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:58 pm

Rob,

I wish I was firing up tomorrow!! We have an annual wood cutting party for some of my girlfriends family that burn wood. Get a few guys together and cut and split a full load (sometimes 2) in one day. I'm usually too tired after that to do much. Then the Giants play Sunday!! Maybe I will get it done this weekend, but its gonna be tight.

Good tip on holes in the drum to drain, especially with bagged coal since I heard it can be wet.

I think I am going to have to put some steel square stock along the top of a Chimney block to get the drum to the right height and properly supported (my chimney blocks are smaller from corner to corner than the diameter of the drum), as I am just using the short auger for now. Hopefully it doesn't take me too long to figure that out.

Joe
JRDepew
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: freetown fred On: Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:05 pm

Joe, not only is it going to be tight, it's gonna be cold!!! That's usually a good motivator, here on the hill at least. :clap: toothy
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: A few questions...

PostBy: JRDepew On: Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:13 pm

freetown fred wrote:Joe, not only is it going to be tight, it's gonna be cold!!! That's usually a good motivator, here on the hill at least. :clap: toothy


Fred,

I know all about cold on the hill!! I am in port crane on a hill that goes higher than the airport. According to Google Earth I am 1630ft above sea level. The wind can get mean up here! I will be splitting wood in the Interlaken/Lodi region though, and I've felt the wind there too....not pretty. Better find my winter hat :?

Joe
JRDepew
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 350