What change will this looming reality bring to America?

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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: freetown fred On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:31 am

THANK YOU NM :)
freetown fred
 
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: Northern Maine On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:31 am

freetown fred wrote:A bunch of them actually & to clump them all into one lil slot is just serious proof of total ignorance.


Fred...you support here is undaunting and appreciated! :D
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: KLook On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:37 am

We have had this debate before. It is in the definition of "producer". Northern Maine, you "provide" a service. You do not produce anything. And someone else has to produce and pay the gov. to pay for your service. Don't get your knickers in a knot, Think about where wealth comes from, raw materials and added labor. We had this same debate about lawyers, they are parasites. Most all gov. workers are parasites and that is why it is the death knell when to many people work for the gov. It is the crux of the problem in this country, we don't produce anything. No one is saying you don't provide a valuable "service" and we thank you for that just like veterans. Why is it so hard to see that we have morphed from a country of producers to a country of providers? All our wealth is transfering to the producers, Arabs and oil, China and and others for all our stuff. Simple

Kevin
Last edited by KLook on Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: Northern Maine On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:42 am

All I can say Isayre is "I hope you never collect anything that the govt. has to offer"...if so, or if you have it would be ostensibly hypocrisy on your part....please review your thoughts and rectify your statements of perplexity as it is very unbecoming of any person to portray such nonsense!
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: Northern Maine On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:51 am

KLook wrote:We have had this debate before. It is in the definition of "producer". Northern Maine, you "provide" a service. You do not produce anything. And someone else has to produce and pay the gov. to pay for your service. Don't get your knickers in a knot, Think about where wealth comes from, raw materials and added labor. We had this same debate about lawyers, they are parasites. Most all gov. workers are parasites and that is why it is the death knell when to many people work for the gov. It is the crux of the problem in this country, we don't produce anything. No one is saying you don't provide a valuable "service" and we thank you for that just like veterans. Why is it so hard to see that we have morphed from a country of producers to a country of providers? All our wealth is transfering to the producers, Arabs and oil, China and and others for all out stuff. Simple

Kevin


A farmer produces a product and provides it to us....I produce safety security via the actions I take while on the job and provide it to the public. ;)
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: franco b On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:54 am

What would you call government workers who bankrupt their communities?

Look in the blue pages of your phone book to see the mind blowing proliferation of government agencies both state and Federal. Do they really benefit the community or do they have the opposite effect?

We seem to be approaching the situation of one worker to support both himself and a member of government or welfare recipient. Is this sustainable?

When government goes beyond its proper role of support of the private sector and begins to prey on it, that is parasitism.
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:58 am

A related question is: What socialized services would you be willing to give up so our children do not face a nation that has been brought to its knees Soviet Union collapse style? I believe that unless we radically alter the current norm, we will economically collapse just like the Soviet Union did, though for us it will not come so orderly, since in the end most of the Russians knew they needed to abandon socialism, whereas as time goes forward we are ever more desirous of embracing it. Therefore what was an inevitable awakening for them will come as to totally unbelievable and unanticipated awakening for us.

Apparently Social Security and Medicare and the Military have already been taken off the table. What's left when those 3 represent the vast bulk of our spending for which there is (with looming zero to negative population growth in mind) no possible source of revenue (via taxation or otherwise) that can sustain just those three alone?
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: Northern Maine On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:04 am

franco b wrote:What would you call government workers who bankrupt their communities?

Look in the blue pages of your phone book to see the mind blowing proliferation of government agencies both state and Federal. Do they really benefit the community or do they have the opposite effect?

We seem to be approaching the situation of one worker to support both himself and a member of government or welfare recipient. Is this sustainable?

When government goes beyond its proper role of support of the private sector and begins to prey on it, that is parasitism.


If a terrorist is "stemmed" at the border and not allowed to enter the country...is it worth the one worker's financial support from the private sector?
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: KLook On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:04 am

What's left when those 3 represent the vast bulk of our spending for which there is (with looming zero to negative population growth in mind) no possible source of revenue (via taxation or otherwise) that can sustain just those three alone?


The rich.

Kevin
KLook
 
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: Northern Maine On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:08 am

lsayre wrote:A related question is: What socialized services would you be willing to give up so our children do not face a nation that has been brought to its knees Soviet Union collapse style? I believe that unless we radically alter the current norm, we will economically collapse just like the Soviet Union did, though for us it will not come so orderly, since in the end most of the Russians knew they needed to abandon socialism, whereas as time goes forward we are ever more desirous of embracing it. Therefore what was an inevitable awakening for them will come as to totally unbelievable and unanticipated awakening for us.

Apparently Social Security and Medicare and the Military have already been taken off the table. What's left when those 3 represent the vast bulk of our spending for which there is (with looming zero to negative population growth in mind) no possible source of revenue (via taxation or otherwise) that can sustain just those three alone?


I believe that in each and every one of the socialized services there is entirely to much bureaucracy and within those we could reduce and cut to start...basically "to many chiefs and not enough indians"...
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:08 am

KLook wrote:
What's left when those 3 represent the vast bulk of our spending for which there is (with looming zero to negative population growth in mind) no possible source of revenue (via taxation or otherwise) that can sustain just those three alone?


The rich.

Kevin


Are the rich merely socialized serfs at the sacrificial bid and call of the plebes? Or are the rich free? What is the criteria by which to live free?

I've heard the slogan "Live free or die", but eating the rich puts an entirely new perspective to this old slogan.
lsayre
 
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: freetown fred On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:11 am

OK, then I've got to run with the jerry falwell & all the wanna be preachers that suck money of the weak & confused. I'd bet that could save those unfortunate souls some BIG bucks
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: NoSmoke On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:12 am

Northern Maine wrote:So...ALL government workers are parasites?


In a word...YES! The problem is, the word parasite has a negative aspect to it that is not always accurate.

Yes all government workers are parasites, because a parasite gets its sustenance from another host by definition.

A great example of this is an engine. It has several parasitic loads placed upon it, the primary being the water pump. In order for the engine to work, it must have a water pump to push water through the block and radiator in order to cool it. It gets its power from the engine, but the engine would not run long if it was allowed to get too hot and seize up. The same thing applies with governor controls and alternators...they are needed to keep the engine running, or get it running. But then again, air conditioners, and power steering pumps are not really needed; they are their for the convenience of the operator...to keep the occupant of the car comfortable, and the car easier to control.

It is the exact same way with a governmental employee...they are parasitic loads on society, but that does not mean they are unneeded. There are things I just cannot do for economically for myself, and that is where government comes into play. For instance, it is uneconomical for me, a single commuter, to have a pickup and plow the snow the 87 miles one way from my house to my job so that I can be safe on the roads; it is much more economical for me to have the Maine Dept of Transportation do so for me and all my neighbors. It is economy of scale kind of thing, not a feasibility kind of thing.

So in that example the MDOT Plow Operator is a parasite still...because he feeds off Maine Taxpayers, but it is easy to see that he (or a contracted company) does the work for society to increase the efficiency of scale. The problem is, today there are many more parasitic loads on society then are what is really needed. I believe...a strong conservative...is that many of things a liberal and social society feels are NEEDS are actually wants. I have a 6 year old daughter who has learned to form all her Christmas Present Wish Lists as NEEDS. She is acting like a spoiled child, and compared to much of the world who gets their subsistence on less than $2 per day, we American's are spoiled and we are increasingly calling wants...needs.

An example is the giving of cell phones to welfare recipients calling it a NEED. I am a welder/farmer and while I commute 87 miles one way to work and have all kinds of reasons to justify having a cell phone, I do NOT have one and get by just fine. (big shock I know). As Americans' we need to prioritize in a big way!

As for me; I am a parasite in two ways. The first is that I build US Navy Ships which makes me a parasite on society because all my income is derived from federal taxpayers, just as yours comes from Maine Taxpayers. The real question is: are the services we provide as parasites to society worthwhile or not? That is the true question. As for the other aspect of being a parasite; it is because I am a Christian and almost daily...despite knowing otherwise...I do what I want and not do what God commands me to do, and for that I am a huge parasite, just saved by God's Mercy and Grace. In my opinion, that makes me the biggest parasite of all...clinging to God for rescue.
NoSmoke
 
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: RAYJAY On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:17 am

lsayre wrote:A related question is: What socialized services would you be willing to give up so our children do not face a nation that has been brought to its knees Soviet Union collapse style? I believe that unless we radically alter the current norm, we will economically collapse just like the Soviet Union did, though for us it will not come so orderly, since in the end most of the Russians knew they needed to abandon socialism, whereas as time goes forward we are ever more desirous of embracing it. Therefore what was an inevitable awakening for them will come as to totally unbelievable and unanticipated awakening for us.

Apparently Social Security and Medicare and the Military have already been taken off the table. What's left when those 3 represent the vast bulk of our spending for which there is (with looming zero to negative population growth in mind) no possible source of revenue (via taxation or otherwise) that can sustain just those three alone?



our children .... so sick of hearing this........... worked since i was 16 paying in all the time paid for health care since 18

let "our children" worry about the problems hell they don't even want to work for a living.... they just want a check every week........ what I'm a parasite because i want what is coming to me in retirement ........ :mad:
RAYJAY
 
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Re: What change will this looming reality bring to America?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:17 am

Well stated NoSmoke!

Could much of government service be privatized, and could we thereby (just as with choices for food, clothing, shelter, etc...) opt to either participate in or not participate in such private programs? With private programs there is freedom. With government programs there is compulsion.
lsayre
 
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