Hurry Before Obama Makes Them Illegal

blrman07 · Post by **blrman07** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 7:34 am

I found this while perusing a craigslist ad for a stove....
Excellent way to get your attention and to sell your stove.

$$$PRICE REDUCED$$$ Vogelzang pot belly coal stove. Excellent condition, lots of heat. Apx 1/2 ton coal included. Great for a garage, cabin.

Hurry before obama makes them illegal.

xandrew245x · Post by **xandrew245x** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 3:09 pm

I saw that same craiglist add the other day.

Flyer5 · Post by **Flyer5** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 3:16 pm

It is funny how people think Obama is going to end the coal industry. I don't think he is good for the industry but 1: It would mean he would actually have to do something . 2 : It would be political suicide for democrats. 3 : Would lead to skyrocketing costs on many things. I think even he is smart enough for that. I think.

Post by **Richard S.** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 3:48 pm

Flyer5 wrote:1: It would mean he would actually have to do something .

While this won't effect the anthracite industry:

http://www2.epa.gov/carbon-pollution-standards

The proposal would not apply to:

o New power plant units that have permits and start construction within 12
months of this proposal; or units looking to renew permits that are part of a
Department of Energy demonstration project, provided that these units start
construction within 12 months of this proposal. These units are called
“transitional” units.

The proposal was March of last year. Any new coal plant will have to meet these standards, to put these regulations into perspective some NG plants built in the early part of the last decade couldn't meet these standards. Any plant after March will have to use carbon capture....

NoSmoke · Post by **NoSmoke** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 4:01 pm

Of course...

Here in Maine windmills are going up, but it is NOT because they are a green, efficient way to produce power because their cost is far more then they produce. They are only being installed because of environmental credits.

Adding loads of environmental regulation to coal powered power plants does too things:

1) If the power plant goes online, they must make up for it with credits that often built alternative energy sources
2) It makes traditional powered plants difficult to build and so increases the price of current electricity and makes alternative energy sources doable

It really is a win-win situation for Obama, but as a conservative, I firmly believe in letting the free market system work, and when the time is right unto its own accord, then alternative power can come online for the masses. It is NOT government's role to push through technology before it is economical.

freetown fred · Post by **freetown fred** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 4:23 pm

I was reading that EPA hired 30 or so book scholars to educate, & what ever the hell it is they do, the public on alternative energy/ green resources. Just what we need, some more over educated A-holes chiming in--good news is--our taxes are paying them--I'm thinkin I got the gist of what they were saying--if I need correction, PLEASE do!

Flyer5 · Post by **Flyer5** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 5:30 pm

freetown fred wrote:I was reading that EPA hired 30 or so book scholars to educate, & what ever the hell it is they do, the public on alternative energy/ green resources. Just what we need, some more over educated A-holes chiming in--good news is--our taxes are paying them--I'm thinkin I got the gist of what they were saying--if I need correction, PLEASE do!

Ohhhh !! more red tape. Just what the country needs. I still don't see anything that will effect residential heating,

freetown fred · Post by **freetown fred** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 7:49 pm

Nor do I Dave. I should of clarified that.

Flyer5 · Post by **Flyer5** » Wed. Dec. 05, 2012 11:43 pm

freetown fred wrote:Nor do I Dave. I should of clarified that.

"I still don't see anything that will effect residential heating, " This was a general statement not referring to your post. Sorry

freetown fred · Post by **freetown fred** » Thu. Dec. 06, 2012 6:40 am

Not a problem Dave, I just felt I needed to show that I was in total agreement with your statement. God knows the gloom & doomers don't need any more fuel.

homecomfort · Post by **homecomfort** » Wed. Dec. 19, 2012 5:01 pm

Anthracite coal, the 1% of total coal production, like Richard said, is not even near being regulated like the 99% bituminous coal used for electricity production. If one bothers to read actual facts, then it would be common knowledge that the temporary slump in coal demand by generators, is because natural gas is cheaper than dirt, so it is the "economics"

Post by **Richard S.** » Wed. Dec. 19, 2012 5:59 pm

homecomfort wrote: If one bothers to read actual facts, then it would be common knowledge that the temporary slump in coal demand by generators, is because natural gas is cheaper than dirt, so it is the "economics"

That's only partly the reason. Many of these older plants were closed because of the new mercury regulations which will reduce the mercury deposition rates here in the US anywhere from 1to 10% raising the average IQ 2/1000 of one point.

If the EPA mandated that you put thousands of dollars of pollution control on that old car you're better off just scrapping it even if it runs perfectly. That's what happened with those plants.

Assuming the new CO2 regulations are finalized which should happen in the coming months new coal plants to replace them won't be built for many years to come if ever, kind of hard to argue about what is more economical when regulations over CO2 will need to be addressed with technology that doesn't exist in a production environment.

carlherrnstein · Post by **carlherrnstein** » Sun. Dec. 23, 2012 5:22 pm

Flyer5 wrote:
freetown fred wrote:I was reading that EPA hired 30 or so book scholars to educate, & what ever the hell it is they do, the public on alternative energy/ green resources. Just what we need, some more over educated A-holes chiming in--good news is--our taxes are paying them--I'm thinkin I got the gist of what they were saying--if I need correction, PLEASE do!
Ohhhh !! more red tape. Just what the country needs. I still don't see anything that will effect residential heating,

It probably wont effect you anthracite burners but, us bituminous burners might have a hard time getting coal. The coal I burn comes from a mine that supplys power plants so im guessing when the power plant no longer needs coal I will have to switch to some other fuel.

jpete · Post by **jpete** » Sun. Dec. 23, 2012 5:26 pm

carlherrnstein wrote: It probably wont effect you anthracite burners but, us bituminous burners might have a hard time getting coal. The coal I burn comes from a mine that supplys power plants so im guessing when the power plant no longer needs coal I will have to switch to some other fuel.

Of start using a butt load more coal!