New to Forum and question.

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: europachris On: Thu Dec 13, 2007 5:05 pm

LsFarm wrote:I'll see if I can get Chris to reply to this thread.
Greg L


Ouch, Greg - quit poking me!

Yes indeed, I have an older Keystoker stove similar to yours. Mine doesn't have the adjustment on the direct vent, so I rely on a rheostat to adjust my draft, but it works fine.

Indeed, as Greg states, I pulled TONS of ash out of this stove. It came to my house on it's side in the back of my VW Jetta wagon from Greg's place in MI, by way of Matthaus in PA. With all the handling, moving, tipping, banging, etc. during the cleaning and rebuild process, enormous amounts of ash came down out of the stove, not to mention what was packed under the grate. If you search this forum, you'll see some pics of before and after.

Anyway, if you stick your head (or a mirror) into the firebox and look up, you'll see two tubes, about 3" diameter, leading up into a heat exchanger area that is behind the grill on the front of the stove. This area is about 2-1/2" to 3" high, flat, wide, and deep. The fly ash is carried up into this big area, falls out of the flue gasses, and collects. And collects. And collects. Eventually this entire area probably packs solid, and renders it useless, eliminating 50% of the heat exchange area (maybe more) of the stove.

How hot is the air coming out? How hot is your flue? My flue temps barely get above 150F at max fire rate, while at the same time, the air coming out is so hot I can barely stand it on my skin up close.

My first suggestion would be to find 3 or 4 strong friends and half a dozen moving blankets. Lay them on the floor and yank out the stove and tip it sideways on the floor on both sides. You'll likely have to do it several times each way. Bang on it. Each time you'll get great clods of ash falling down the outside edge of the firebox into the ash pan area.

Second, go find some radiator brushes. http://www.mcmaster-carr.comhas some. You'll want something 30 to 36" long and maybe 1-1/2" in diameter. You can snake that up through those two tubes as well as up the sides of the firebox and into that heat exchanger area. You could also take an air compressor blowgun and attach some flexible tubing on the end of it and snake that up into the stove to blow out the junk, keeping a hefty shop vac handy to suck up the dust.

Either way you slice it, it won't be a fun job. The newer Keystokers have a totally different firebox design, not prone to clog up like the older ones. However, I don't feel they are as efficient in extracting the heat.

You also do need to have a look at the cam, it's $10 from Keystoker. I think it's 1-1/2" diameter when it's new. Also, check the 4 nylon bolts on the sides of the pusher block. If they are worn or missing, the block will just waggle from side to side and not give you a full push of coal. They are also available from McMaster-Carr - 10-24 is the thread, and I bought either cheese or fillister head, 3/4" long.

I plan to make the heat exchanger part of my yearly cleaning ritual, using both compressed air and brushes. The stove is fantastically efficient and built like a friggin' tank, but the flyash collection problem with no good way to clean it was overlooked, and probably why the design was changed.

Otherwise, mine has no problems pumping out enormous quantities of heat. I run the coal feed adjustment about 3 turns out, and 3 sets of 5 pins on my timer box. Combustion blower is 1/2 open, and draft is 0.02 to 0.03. That gives me a nice, slow idle and 2 to 3" of ash at full fire. It's a great stove, and on those really cold nasty days, I almost want to give it a big hug! :inlove:

good luck!
Last edited by europachris on Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
europachris
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 350/Iron Fireman
Stove/Furnace Model: Custom bituminous burner

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: Dennis S On: Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:50 pm

Thanks again for the great suggestions.I will inspect the cam and order the parts. I will also try to clean the combustion area.

about the fire, no I am not getting a full burn like I used to.
Dennis S
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: DV-90

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: Dennis S On: Fri Dec 21, 2007 10:42 am

Mathhaus , Dave , Chris and Greg, Thanks for the info and taking time answering. Well Yesterday was a mild day in Jersey so I shut the stove
off and decided to undertake another cleaning and fine tuning. I came to agreement with you guys that the top of the Keystoker was packed with ash . I always cleaned this area with a brush and vacuum but was probably not getting it all. I noticed that the top of the stove was not as hot as usual. I have a real good furnace vacuum, but of course the hose can not fit into the holes on the top. So I went to" Home Cheapo" and bought a cooragated drain house for a slop sink and it fit perfectly inside the vacuum hose . It had enough flexabilty and just stiff enough that I was able to snake it up the holes into the exchanger and actualy hit the back and the sides of the stove. I did this quite a few time , twisting the hose in at different angles until I was satisfied I cleaned a lot of ash. This method maybe a little cleaner and easier than method #1 the upside the stove and #2 the compressed air method , although maybe not as efficient since your doing it on the blind.
I also pulled my grate off and sanded it with some emery cloth to knock some light pitting down. I was also surprised how much what looked like unburned coal dust more than ash accumalated under the grate in just a month.
I was pleasently surprised when I fired her back up . The stove top is now very hot again and its pumping out air 50 degrees hotter than before the second cleaning. My burn looks a lot better and I will play with the stoker adjustments now once we get back into some solid cold weather. I do feel my stoker mechanism may need an overhaul. I
t seem to have some play but, I ran out of time last night and I wasn't sure how far I had to go to get at it. I will need to look at the manual ( photo copied drawings)again before I dive in.
I must say for a 12 year old Keystoker stove she was pumping out some heat humming along nicely last night
Dennis S
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: DV-90

Visit Lehigh Anthracite

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: europachris On: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:22 am

Congrats on your success! That's good to hear you were able to vacuum out the ash rather than knock or blow it out. That drain hose trick is somthing I'm going to try. I have a industrial grade shop vacuum with tremendous suction and I use the drywall bags in it and it also has a secondary cloth filter. The single wall bags I had didn't cut it for fly ash, it went right through them.

Anyway, that would work excellent to snake the vac hose up in there and just suck it out. If it's done at least once a year, the ash shouldn't build up and pack so solid and be pretty easy to keep clean. I need to head out to our local home improvement store, Menards, tonight, so I'll look for this hose you used and pick one up.

Chris
europachris
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 350/Iron Fireman
Stove/Furnace Model: Custom bituminous burner

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: Dennis S On: Fri Dec 21, 2007 12:01 pm

Chris. I was even thinking a clear rubber hose may work well too, although the corragated type you have less chance of crimping. You would actually see what you were sucking up as you go along. A little advise ,don't put any type of plastic tip on the hose that could come loose . You may loose it on top off the box and than you would have a real problem if you couldn't get it out. It would probably melt up there once fired.

ps. If the hose doesn't fit tightly in your vac hose, just duct tape them together.
Dennis S
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: DV-90

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: oliver power On: Fri Dec 21, 2007 10:47 pm

I was just talking to a man with the same stove you have. He said he had to replace the nylon cam , due to wearing it out. So , I guess they do wear. He also commented about over firing , and said the heat was a factor of the cam wearing out.
oliver power
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: KEYSTOKER Kaa-2
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93 & 30-95, Vigilant (pre-Vigilant-II)
Baseburners & Antiques: MANY (Mostly when burning wood)
Stove/Furnace Make: HITZER / KEYSTOKER
Stove/Furnace Model: 50-93 & 30-95 , Kaa-2

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: Dennis S On: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:50 am

Oliverpower, thanks for the info. Thats my next inspection.



here are some pics of the vacuum hose modification
Attachments
coal hose 4.jpg
(725.9 KiB) Viewed 9 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
vacuum and hose attachment
[nepathumb]2315[/nepathumb]
coal hose 3.jpg
(337.31 KiB) Viewed 7 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
vacuum hose connection
[nepathumb]2317[/nepathumb]
coal hose 1.jpg
(479.56 KiB) Viewed 6 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
hose has room to fit in tube now, twist and redo several times to remove ash
[nepathumb]2318[/nepathumb]
Dennis S
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: DV-90

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: Dennis S On: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:04 am

a littlemore cleaning and some high heat grill paint and fired up
Attachments
coal stove 1.jpg
(467.15 KiB) Viewed 11 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
fired up nicely with a repaint
[nepathumb]2319[/nepathumb]
coal stove 2.jpg
(276.35 KiB) Viewed 7 times
View: New PagePopup • Select:BBCode
pumping some heat again
[nepathumb]2320[/nepathumb]
Dennis S
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: DV-90

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: europachris On: Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:36 am

Looks great, Dennis! I picked up a universal washer drain hose last night at Menards, and that look to be just what you used. Should work well! Thanks for the pictures.

It was wonderful last night - my wife has a bad cold, so about 4:30 she left the bedroom so she wouldn't disturb me. Nate, our 5 yr. old son, couldn't find her when he woke up about 7. Finally, we both got up and went looking for her. Finally found her covered up on the easy chair in the basement, in front of the Keystoker, sleeping. Ahhh, acceptance! :inlove:
europachris
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 350/Iron Fireman
Stove/Furnace Model: Custom bituminous burner

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: Dennis S On: Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:02 am

Chris, The hardest part is getting it past the first bend. Once you get it up there you may have to turn it while your snakining it to keep it from coiling on you. Then I found that running it back and forth several times slowly worked well.
I tried to change the position by twisting, so it would hit a different angle everytime. Your just goining to have to experiment and see what works best.
Dennis S
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: DV-90

Re: New to Forum and question.

PostBy: L-Bow On: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:04 pm

Dennis, Euro, Oliver, can't thank you enough for taking time to respond. I extracted what I could from heat exchanger with shop vac, will get and use extention. Thanks for cam tip . Stove is 12yrs old but previous owner, a man

from Valley View Pa, had friends from the factory and he removed grate, cam, pusher at end of each season.I hate to fix what ain't broke, so think I'll order a cam from Keystoker along with nylon nuts, and be prepared for the next warm weather shutdown. I don't have a shop manuel. Is the blower motor a problem wearout part? Current stacktemp 200+/- with 6" duct for heat transfer too hot to touch.
Wife is complaining , justifiably about dust AKA fly ash. I'm planing to build a box out of fiberglass ductboard , input one side 5" cold air returns, other side connected to stove's 265cfm squirrelcage , with a furnace filter in between. Any imput for a thread we can call "filter box", or has this subject been covered long before my arrival?
Many thanks
Larry Bowen


Last bumped by L-Bow on Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:04 pm.
L-Bow
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Ketstoker 70,000
Stove/Furnace Model: Keystoker 70,000

Visit Lehigh Anthracite

cron