Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: harding_eng On: Fri Dec 21, 2012 12:20 am

Hello
I'm new here so ..... kindly bear w/ me.
A week ago I purchased a stove from the 82 yr old grandson of the stoves original purchaser. Please see the attached photo's.
I'd like to find out all about it, especially a couple of things:
1. is it dual fuel?
2. did it originally have nickel plating?
3. what should the grate (system) look like & with a little bit of prayer, are there any plans or parts out there?
4. it's age, etc?
According to the seller, it's all original except for the fire box grate(system).

Markings: The fineal (sp?) has the word "Stewart" on it; the fire box door, "Champion Oak"; the ash door, "16"; top front of the ash box, "Fuller Warren, Troy, NY".

The reason I say grate system ....
The seller still has 2 screw like objects, approx 10" long x 1.5in diameter. He kept them because he wasn't sure if they were apart of the wood burning kitchen stove he's selling.... but he'd give them to me if I find out they're needed, along w/ a handle or 2. I only thought it might be a duel fuel because of these screws .... as my memory serves me, they look like they could be apart of grate system.

He said they'd used the stove last, as a heater for a "tent cabin" in the Adirondacks, before the state decided not to allow that semi-permanent structures & it's been sitting in his garage since (+ 3 decades).
I plan on using it in my new barn on the main floor, as the primary heat source on those rare occasions when I'll need it. It doesn't need to be pretty, as few will see it, except next January when my lady & I get married in the barn. :D

I plan on dis-assembling it, cleaning it up, fix the grate system (if possible), getting it nickel plated (if $ practical) and using it.
The photos are of the front (obvious), the side, the firebox w/ replacement grate & inside the ash door looking at the bottom of the replacement grate w/ what looks like brackets that hold the "screws", I mentioned earlier.

Thank you in advance, for ANY & ALL clues & info. Good Health & Happy Holidays.
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harding_eng
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fuller & warren
Stove/Furnace Model: champion oak model 16

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: franco b On: Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:45 am

The stove has a cobbled up grate system that might work for awhile with wood before warping.

The expense and hassle of fitting a new grate if you can find something suitable would lead me to not get this stove regardless of price. The grate is so important for ease of use in a coal stove that any makeshift solution will be a constant annoyance. The stove is worth ten cents a pound in my view.

Two to three hundred dollars should buy something in far better condition.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: SteveZee On: Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:37 pm

Richard is right on. It's set up for wood only and actually not all that well for that either. You could not burn coal in it as is without finding a grate set up that can work with with the existing mount tab's and shaker opening.
SteveZee
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Modern Oak 116 & Glenwood 208 C Range


Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: harding_eng On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 2:37 pm

Merry Christmas
Thank you for the feedback......
We'll I guess I spent $175 for junk, for what you're telling me.
Unless I find/make a shaker grate system.
Do you have a photo of a grate system?
I think I can engineer something, if I know what it should look like & I'm open to advice.
Thanks again.
harding_eng
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fuller & warren
Stove/Furnace Model: champion oak model 16

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: wsherrick On: Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:36 pm

Don't lose heart just yet. Fuller & Warren was a top quality stove maker. Your champion oak is a very high quality stove, but; whoever butchered it like this was an idiot, sorry. This stove originally had prismatic, triangular grates. The two holes that have bolts in them down in the ash pit is where the grate shafts come out so they can be shaken with a crank.
Except for the grate system, the rest of the stove seems pretty sound. This stove restored is worth around $1,500 dollars. It is worth most as an efficient heater with coal as fuel.
You may be able to substitute a round, center dump grate in place of the whatever the heck that thing is at the bottom of the fire pot.
Call or email Emery at Antique Stove Hospital to discuss options for the stove.
I will try to put up a few pictures of what the stove originally had.
wsherrick
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Base Heater, Crawford Base Heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford Base Heater, Glenwood, Stanley Argand
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut, Stove Size

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: wsherrick On: Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:53 pm

Here is how your stove was originally. This is a Splendid Oak. This is an earlier made stove, but; the grate set up is still the same.
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Grate set up on a Fuller & Warren stove.
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Top view, Fuller & Warren Oak stove grates.
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wsherrick
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Base Heater, Crawford Base Heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford Base Heater, Glenwood, Stanley Argand
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut, Stove Size

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: rberq On: Wed Dec 26, 2012 7:55 pm

harding_eng wrote:We'll I guess I spent $175 for junk, for what you're telling me.

Junk? Looks pretty to me! The history alone makes it a treasure in my book -- purchased from an 82-year-old grandson of the original owner! My first thought was, what a shame you're going to hide it in the barn and use it only occasionally!
wsherrick is our resident expert in these oldies, he and others often recommend the Antique Stove Hospital. It sounds like you have the know-how and are asking the right questions, so you can restore it. Only, please, no wood burning, we folks here like COAL! :P
rberq
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300
Coal Size/Type: Nut -- Kimmel/Blaschak/Reading
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators, propane

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: harding_eng On: Fri Dec 28, 2012 7:50 am

I've sent an e/m to Emery.
Any clues, what should I expect to pay to "restore" it?
Thank you for the "positive" feedback.
J
harding_eng
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fuller & warren
Stove/Furnace Model: champion oak model 16

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: SteveZee On: Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:17 am

If I were you I would phone Emory if you are serious. He's a really busy guy and it's best to speak with him personally. Also he will be able to tell you if he's got the stuff to replace those missing grate parts you need.
SteveZee
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Modern Oak 116 & Glenwood 208 C Range

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: harding_eng On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:21 am

Happy New Year
Will call Emery after I see what the seller still has at his place.
Thanks so much for the photo's .... now I know what I'm looking for.
Nickel .... did they ever sell 1 w/o nickel. I cant seem to find any evidence of it anywhere?
As for the stove living in a barn ... the plans for the barn are to use the main floor as an Adirondack style guest house for friends & as a bunk house for a duck hunting guide service for wounded warriors & handicapped folks (my friends newly developed condition).
Thank you again, good health.
harding_eng
 
Stove/Furnace Make: fuller & warren
Stove/Furnace Model: champion oak model 16

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: SteveZee On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:04 pm

Looks like someone painted the nickel trim black. Those skirts upper and lower and the finial top.
SteveZee
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Modern Oak 116 & Glenwood 208 C Range

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: thedogscar On: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:41 pm

I just bought the exact same stove off of Craig's List. The only differences ... yours has the S shaped attachments on the finials (mine are missing), and mine has a hood on the back, near the middle (which I assume is to draw colder air from below?). Mine is also all black. The pieces that typically are chrome, weigh much less than the cast iron parts. So, they may have been painted too?

Did you get yours working? Mine has two of the shaker grates, but missing the two in the middle. The replacement grate you show in the pics, seems like it would work fine for wood, but I am wondering if the openings in it are too wide, and let too many embers drop to the ash pan? I assume these work best if the ember stay in the clay bin above the grate? I need to fashion something to sit on my two remaining grates., and thinking of options.

I do not plan on using this as my primary heat source. So, I do not need it to run perfectly, but I thought this would be great, on cool days, to get rid of all the downed hardwood trees on my property.

Also, does anyone know if I can mix a little coal with wood? One of my barns has a stall filled with coal. I would like to use the coal, to get rid of it, but without the proper grate, I'm thinking it will get too hot.
thedogscar
 

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: thedogscar On: Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:51 pm

No reply, but here is what I learned from experience ...

I fashioned a grate, by cutting a rectangular vented chromed broiler pan round, and laying it on top of my two remaining rods. It worked well for holding up the wood, and letting air in, but failed miserably with letting ash drop through. After two days of burning, the ash bed filled the clay bottom, and was up to the metal drum. After day one, I relied more on the upper vents, than the lower, to regulate the burn.

I cleaned it out, and then tried 1/8" steel screening, with 1/4" hole as a grate. This worked much better, but you really need the agitation of the original grate mechanism to get the ash to drop to the pan. Otherwise, I will be cleaning it out every morning.

As for coal mixing with wood ... I waited until just before bed, when the wood had burned down to embers, and then over time, laid a few layers of coal on top (approx. 2 coffee cans full). It would not burn super hot, but did keep it warm and glowing until morning.

BTW ... mine is an 18, not a 16
thedogscar
 

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: wsherrick On: Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:35 am

thedogscar wrote:No reply, but here is what I learned from experience ...

I fashioned a grate, by cutting a rectangular vented chromed broiler pan round, and laying it on top of my two remaining rods. It worked well for holding up the wood, and letting air in, but failed miserably with letting ash drop through. After two days of burning, the ash bed filled the clay bottom, and was up to the metal drum. After day one, I relied more on the upper vents, than the lower, to regulate the burn.

I cleaned it out, and then tried 1/8" steel screening, with 1/4" hole as a grate. This worked much better, but you really need the agitation of the original grate mechanism to get the ash to drop to the pan. Otherwise, I will be cleaning it out every morning.

As for coal mixing with wood ... I waited until just before bed, when the wood had burned down to embers, and then over time, laid a few layers of coal on top (approx. 2 coffee cans full). It would not burn super hot, but did keep it warm and glowing until morning.

BTW ... mine is an 18, not a 16


The stove will work much better with the appropriate grate. I would call Emery at Antique Stove Hospital and inquire. If the existing grate bars you still have are the same size as the missing ones, then you can have copies cast for a reasonable price. If you just want to burn wood then get a register grate for it. This is basically a flat iron plate that rests on top of the coal grates. The plate has slits in it to allow air to come through.
wsherrick
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Base Heater, Crawford Base Heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford Base Heater, Glenwood, Stanley Argand
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut, Stove Size

Re: Fuller & Warren Champion Oak 16

PostBy: thedogscar On: Thu Nov 07, 2013 10:41 am

Thanks fo response!

After I posted this last night, and reviewed the extremely helpful pics of a new grate you posted, I googled 'Antique Stove Hospital', and reviewed his site. I also googled 'Cast Iron Round Grate' and found this heavy duty drain grate on eBay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ROUND-11-1-2-INCH-CAST-IRON-GRATE-DRAIN-GRILL-ORIGINAL-HEAVY-DUTY-NR-13-/251373371625?pt=Architectural_Garden&hash=item3a870540e9

I am not at my house, but I do remember I cut my prototypes to 13", as measured top of bolt to top of bolt. My initial fear was the grate shifting, and the burning wood and embers dropping to the ash pan, A perfectly round, and 'much' thicker, 11 1/2" may be perfect, to fit solely on the grate? If I am assured this grate won't shift and drop, I can then agitate it by moving the front rod, with its nubs, from the open ash bin door below.

I will call Emery. He may already have casts? If not, I doubt sending him mine will help. Since, the front and far back ones do not have the square ends that stick outside, for the crank handle. My working ones are shorter and round on both ends, and I am not sure how the gears would match up (are they straight line or offset?). I do have the halves of the two middle ones (the halves that stick through the side holes for the crank, and have the gears). I am currently using them to fill the side holes, and have them sitting, in the middle, on a fire brick (which I figured would also catch my makeshift grates, if they shifted).

Another problem ... many of my bolts are rusted solid, but loose fitting. I got many to move by using WD40. I am hoping that after burning many loads of wood, the expansion and contraction, will loosen the rest. Any suggestions on how to get the rest to tighten? The placement of many of these, make getting the torque needed to break the rust seal hard.
thedogscar