So I started my hearth area demo

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 5:15 pm

michaelanthony wrote:
Smokeyja wrote:
joeq wrote:I'm thinking the concrete makes a pretty good insulator, wouldn't you? (Not my area of expertise.)


The problem is concrete or brick on the ground transfers ground temps... This is why in a non insulated shop with concrete floors the building will be much colder in the wonder and the floors hold that cold temp and in te summer the floor is much cooler and can sweat. In my sunroom I have a brick floor and the floor is freezing in the winter and cool in the summer.

But I guess it doesn't matter I much on the hearth I was just thinking about it.

Concrete is porous and wicks moisture as well that is why pressure treated wood and steel plates are used when building a deck with peer posts. 2 inch rigid foam( polystyrine ) would be good around he perimeter. When you put down the hardy board put a leveling layer of cement down to fill any voids or the board and whatever is above may crack, it doesn't take much of a gap with that kind of weight on top to cause that.



So you mean put it on the outside edges of the hearth?
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: joeq On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:17 pm

Josh, isn't your hearth suspended / supported through your cellar or crawl space underneath your floor? Not understanding how moisture will come up 4-6' from inside a foundation.
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: michaelanthony On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:17 pm

Concrete is porous and wicks moisture as well that is why pressure treated wood and steel plates are used when building a deck with peer posts. 2 inch rigid foam( polystyrine ) would be good around he perimeter. When you put down the hardy board put a leveling layer of cement down to fill any voids or the board and whatever is above may crack, it doesn't take much of a gap with that kind of weight on top to cause that.[/quote]


So you mean put it on the outside edges of the hearth?[/quote]
If you mean the rigid foam, I retract because it is sitting on the ground and protected from the wind. I jumped the gun on that one. If you mean the hardy board, it needs a level base below it so whatever is above it won't crack i.e. tile,grout, etc.
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:50 pm

joeq wrote:Josh, isn't your hearth suspended / supported through your cellar or crawl space underneath your floor? Not understanding how moisture will come up 4-6' from inside a foundation.


Haha try 15" from the ground to the sub flooring. We are talking a 200 + or - years . Its just a crawl space if you can call it that . A brick foundation looks to be added in 1923. The CMU blocks are sitting a foot below the ground and then built up from there. So ground temperatures will transfer into the concrete.

I'm not going to worry about the moisture or anything . I should be able to seal it with a one way moisture barrier anyways.

I have decided not to use the hardie board . Instead I busted out the old hearth top layer so I will fill the whole thing with concrete now .

I was back at the hearth at 4pm when I got home from work. I need to go get more concrete and I'll be back to pour more tonight! :)

Image
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: echos67 On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 9:08 pm

I think you made the right choice going with concrete over the entire thing like your doing now. Isnt it amazing how a regular project turns into such a job filled with a lot of unexpected work :lol: ?

Will you be laying the stone hearth directly on the last layer of concrete and then mortar the joints so its complete ?
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: michaelanthony On: Wed Jan 02, 2013 9:42 pm

Smokeyja wrote:
Haha try 15" from the ground to the sub flooring. We are talking a 200 + or - years . Its just a crawl space if you can call it that . A brick foundation looks to be added in 1923. The CMU blocks are sitting a foot below the ground and then built up from there. So ground temperatures will transfer into the concrete.

I'm not going to worry about the moisture or anything . I should be able to seal it with a one way moisture barrier anyways.

I have decided not to use the hardie board . Instead I busted out the old hearth top layer so I will fill the whole thing with concrete now .

I was back at the hearth at 4pm when I got home from work. I need to go get more concrete and I'll be back to pour more tonight! :)

Image

Looks like you'll be able to work on your tractors on that base without any worries, keep up the good work. :rockon: Hope you find that baseburner your looking for!
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Other Heating: Very cold FHA oil furnace

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:24 am

Image

Hearth!


And I'm official sick of mixing and carrying buckets of concrete !

Notice the angle change on the photo... Yes I'm finally sitting down
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: joeq On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:34 am

And you "officially" deserve it. Beautiful job Josh. Can't wait to see the finished product. Think noon tomorrow is too much to ask? :lol:
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 1:48 am

joeq wrote:And you "officially" deserve it. Beautiful job Josh. Can't wait to see the finished product. Think noon tomorrow is too much to ask? :lol:



Haha thanks man! Unfortunately I need to go to work again tomorrow :( .

It seems really hard to level the concrete perfectly. Masonry isn't my trade and this is the first time I've ever done this. I used quickcretes pro finish crack resistant concrete.
I guess the fine tune leveling can come into play with the mortar.

now I need to pick out the exact stone and brick and then choose to use the same color mortar as the original or match the masonry up with something different. Here is a photo of the original colors in the house

This is a clean shot of the upper half of the double chimney I'm working on right now.
Image

Here is the other terricotta lined two flue chimney in the house this in the kitchen . This chimney will have the cook stove on it .

Btw the colors are very similar and I have the sample bags of mortar I am just wondering of it will be too beige with the stones or not and I might want to use a darker mortar for the bricks I choose. I'm open to suggestions .
Image
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:05 am

michaelanthony wrote:
Smokeyja wrote:
Haha try 15" from the ground to the sub flooring. We are talking a 200 + or - years . Its just a crawl space if you can call it that . A brick foundation looks to be added in 1923. The CMU blocks are sitting a foot below the ground and then built up from there. So ground temperatures will transfer into the concrete.

I'm not going to worry about the moisture or anything . I should be able to seal it with a one way moisture barrier anyways.

I have decided not to use the hardie board . Instead I busted out the old hearth top layer so I will fill the whole thing with concrete now .

I was back at the hearth at 4pm when I got home from work. I need to go get more concrete and I'll be back to pour more tonight! :)

Image

Looks like you'll be able to work on your tractors on that base without any worries, keep up the good work. :rockon: Hope you find that baseburner your looking for!


Thanks Michael ! I am pretty sure where I'm going to get te base heater (glenwood) exactly which model I haven't decided 100% yet. But I had a really good discussion with Doug at Barnstable Last year. I want to buy one already restored most likely. Unless I can get such an amazing deal.

echos67 wrote:I think you made the right choice going with concrete over the entire thing like your doing now. Isnt it amazing how a regular project turns into such a job filled with a lot of unexpected work :lol: ?

Will you be laying the stone hearth directly on the last layer of concrete and then mortar the joints so its complete ?


Thanks Keith ! I am happier with the results of my work even more so than when I started. I neve really thought it would turn out this well. And yes I will be placing the stone/brick directly on the final layer. I will put a layer of mortar down and place the stones/brick on.

Now I am also thinking of a large stone slab ... It's an idea that just came up. I need to price out a nice worn stone slab. In polished. It might actually be really cool! And easy !!
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:09 am

nortcan wrote:Keep on the good work Smokey, not always easy.....that remind me when I cut the hole for the G.Bride chimney's support. Don't know why electric wires are always at the bad place?


Pierre ! That could have been a bad situation! I was core drilling on a job site and ran into the same thing. I yelled at the gc for not telling me there was live wires where I was drilling ... And core drilling is with water too!
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:15 am

Dann757 wrote:
Smokeyja wrote:I really have bad luck when it comes to my projects.


Nahhhh don't say that! You have ambition! Keep up the good work!

My brother raised 4 kids in an old farmhouse in Chenango Forks, NY. On a hill overlooking a splendid valley view. He is so unbelievably stubborn he would never accept help from anybody, and the place remained in disrepair for many years. I left him a quick sketch on how to fix his rotted bathroom floor when I was up to visit one time many years ago. He went ballistic on me hahahhahahaha. I used to laugh with his kids at his plumbing situation in the old cellar- it looked like a jungle of pvc vines :D We went up one Christmas and all the pipes were frozen and what a foul mood he was in hahahhaa. I went in the old fieldstone basement and stuffed insulation in all the gaping holes to the outside New York State sub-zero winter air. He took it all out!



It sounds like my father inlaw in England. We were there for 3 weeks and I offered to fix all kinds of things and my mother in law wanted me too but when she asked her husband for his basic tools for me to use he got super angry and I could here them arguing and how he didnt want me to do any work on the house. Their house has rotten out windows and the bathroom is falling apart and yadda yadda like you said ;)
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:19 am

Poconoeagle wrote:happy New Years Josh!! ya doin a fine job!!
dont feel bad i did a 8 hour bathroom re-plumbing today 8-) whoda thunk it :D


Hey Gene ! How did the re-plum end up? What did you have to do?
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: wsherrick On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 3:15 am

Smokeyja wrote:
joeq wrote:And you "officially" deserve it. Beautiful job Josh. Can't wait to see the finished product. Think noon tomorrow is too much to ask? :lol:



Haha thanks man! Unfortunately I need to go to work again tomorrow :( .

It seems really hard to level the concrete perfectly. Masonry isn't my trade and this is the first time I've ever done this. I used quickcretes pro finish crack resistant concrete.
I guess the fine tune leveling can come into play with the mortar.

now I need to pick out the exact stone and brick and then choose to use the same color mortar as the original or match the masonry up with something different. Here is a photo of the original colors in the house

This is a clean shot of the upper half of the double chimney I'm working on right now.
Image

Here is the other terricotta lined two flue chimney in the house this in the kitchen . This chimney will have the cook stove on it .

Btw the colors are very similar and I have the sample bags of mortar I am just wondering of it will be too beige with the stones or not and I might want to use a darker mortar for the bricks I choose. I'm open to suggestions .
Image


The original builders of the house would be shocked to see the chimney bricks exposed inside. The picked the rough bricks for the chimney because nobody was supposed to ever see them. Originally the chimney was plastered over smooth along with the rest of the wall. Originally you had a small coal fireplace with a cast iron box and hanging grate in there. I've lived in many houses with them and used them too. In humble houses the hearth was smooth mortar and painted. In better houses the hearth and fireplace surround was always, always, always, the best tile that the home builder could afford. Never did they expose raw bricks. Just a little history lesson to maybe help you figure out something.
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Re: So I started my hearth area demo

PostBy: Smokeyja On: Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:39 am

wsherrick wrote:
Smokeyja wrote:
joeq wrote:And you "officially" deserve it. Beautiful job Josh. Can't wait to see the finished product. Think noon tomorrow is too much to ask? :lol:



Haha thanks man! Unfortunately I need to go to work again tomorrow :( .

It seems really hard to level the concrete perfectly. Masonry isn't my trade and this is the first time I've ever done this. I used quickcretes pro finish crack resistant concrete.
I guess the fine tune leveling can come into play with the mortar.

now I need to pick out the exact stone and brick and then choose to use the same color mortar as the original or match the masonry up with something different. Here is a photo of the original colors in the house

This is a clean shot of the upper half of the double chimney I'm working on right now.
Image

Here is the other terricotta lined two flue chimney in the house this in the kitchen . This chimney will have the cook stove on it .

Btw the colors are very similar and I have the sample bags of mortar I am just wondering of it will be too beige with the stones or not and I might want to use a darker mortar for the bricks I choose. I'm open to suggestions .
Image


The original builders of the house would be shocked to see the chimney bricks exposed inside. The picked the rough bricks for the chimney because nobody was supposed to ever see them. Originally the chimney was plastered over smooth along with the rest of the wall. Originally you had a small coal fireplace with a cast iron box and hanging grate in there. I've lived in many houses with them and used them too. In humble houses the hearth was smooth mortar and painted. In better houses the hearth and fireplace surround was always, always, always, the best tile that the home builder could afford. Never did they expose raw bricks. Just a little history lesson to maybe help you figure out something.


Hey William , I remember you telling me about the history when I first came on this forum :) of course you would know better than me about te different characteristics of period homes but this house confuses me all the time. You think one thing but then it turns out to be wrong and I think it would have been just some local farm hands putting this one together. If I could only get a hold of a few old photos!

I know the main double flue chimney on the oldest part of the house was covered in lime/horse hair plaster because I took it all off , upstairs and downstairs . I don't like the look of plastered over brick. The chimney that was added later in the kitchen looks to have always been exposed. The flue in the original part of the house on the second floor looks to be original as well and there is no evidence of a fireplace ever there. Now on the main floor where I'm doing the hearth I have no idea exactly what they had there but I can tell you that the hearth that was there was not as old as the chimney it looks like maybe they added the open fireplace in 1923 or did something with it at least. The evolution of that chimney is crazy! This was a simple very small farm house on an old chicken farm . I believe it was a farm hand house and that there was only a kitchen outside on the old foundation . There did no evidence of a kitchen inside prior to 1923 at least that I can find. The house was originall about 600sq ft I believe . I can assume some period things were correct but the more I dig into it the more I doubt some things. A lot of the construction looks to have used scrap wood or left overs or reuse. The house was probably built for the farm workers to sleep in . It was a very large worker farm. One of the neighbors was a child and remembers the house when his memory is good... It comes and goes because he is about 90 something . I still have yet to find any old photos. But I will tell you this, I'm getting rid of the sunroom and putting something up that looks and functions better.
I think I am going to try and keep it rustic and farm like as much as I can .


Thanks for all the help guys I still have a lot more to go!

Although thinking about it . If I did a thick plaster job on the bricks Inbetween two pillars and painted it white that might look good... Thoughts thoughts
Last edited by Smokeyja on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Smokeyja
 
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6 baseheater
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut

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