Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

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A generation or two from now the USA will be:

a republic
2
8%
a democracy
7
27%
a socialist state
11
42%
a fascist state
3
12%
a totalitarian state
3
12%
 
Total votes : 26

Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: lsayre On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:01 am

Where are we heading?
lsayre
 
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: freetown fred On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:00 am

I'd like to be able to say--"don't take this personal" BUT---why does it strike me that there are large amounts of subversives that just really enjoy stirring the pot and are helping to keep this Country as divided as some of our illustrious leaders. Card holder, paid employee???? I don't get it nor do I respect it. Yep, there are always those that get sucked into all the nonsense Example--YEAH, the Govt faked the killing of 20 children & 5 teachers for the sake of getting the anti/pro gunners at each others throats :mad3: :mad2: :taz: fkn idiots as this old farmer sees it. Just saying :(
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: jpete On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:08 am

Riiiggghhhttt...like the government would never do anything to advance it's own agenda.

The reason people thinks these outlandish "conspiracy theories" is because of all the ACTUAL outlandish things the government has DONE. Operation Paper Clip, Operation Northwoods, MK-ULTRA. The list is long and evil.

On topic, we're already some weird hybrid social/fascist state and have been for some time.
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: rberq On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:19 am

In a few generaltions everyone will have his own flying car, just a little later than Popular Science predicted in the 1950s. :P

Seriously, the trend has been toward higher and higher productivity, which sounds good, but really means that production is largely automated and there are fewer and fewer jobs for actual people. We face the potential of vast production of goods and services, with the profits going entirely to a very very small group of people who own the machines. For the machines to produce more stuff will cost virtually nothing, so why not give it away to those who can find no jobs because there ARE no jobs? Call it Socialism if you want, or call it fair and just distribution of the fruits of the world. And who will be the losers? Nobody. The rich will still be richer than anybody needs to be, and the poor will be rich enough. One way or the other, if there is not to be a violent revolution, the country will have to move toward that model. When I vote "Socialism" it's not because I WANT Socialism. Rather, I am being optimistic, because we could go the other direction, to complete societal collapse, or to a medieval situation where 99.9 percent live in abject poverty and squalor while modern-day kings and knights control enough power to keep the rest of us confined to our hovels.

I have over-simplified, of course. Only the general outline fits in five or six lines. But think about it -- don't think in terms of today's world, where the trends are just beginning to show themselves, think in terms of several generations from now. It could be a great world. The difficulty is in getting successfully from here to there.
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: lsayre On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:30 am

To assist you in voting, a fascist state is a form of (or subset of) socialism whereby nominal ownership and control of business and enterprise remain fully in private hands, but government pulls the strings of business at all levels so tightly that it ultimately matters little who's hands they are actually purported to be in. This would apply to any industry clear down to farming, whereby you may own it, but the government dictates how it can and must be operated. And the government reserves the right to take full control in any perceived emergency. The NDAA assures that we have achieved this level. Ditto the roughly 100,000 pages of the Federal Register.

This is opposed to the more familiar form of socialism (as we have been taught at least) that over time is theorized to devolve into state ownership and communism.

President Roosevelt was a great admirer of fascism, at least until Hitler went too far. What Hitler did however is not directly related to Germany's fascism, but we collectively blank out as to the real scope and meaning of fascism because we (as a consequence of WWII) wrongly equate it with the evils of Naziism.
Last edited by lsayre on Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:48 am, edited 2 times in total.
lsayre
 
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: freetown fred On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:34 am

Ahhhh, my favorite gloom & doomer ;) All I know is that you don't disrespect a tragedy like the Ct situation. NO, the reason people think on this very sad type of conspiracy theory is because some fool plants the seed to keep us at each others throats. THe conspiracy fanatics being no better then those on the other side of the fanatic fence-- everything in life has limits & in particular the CT situation is as good an example as any. And NO, Jeff, I'm not as brilliant as you I'm sure, but I do know that a humanity line is being crossed there. :( Two wrongs have never made a right! PS--positive projection & action never hurt a thing.
jpete wrote:Riiiggghhhttt...like the government would never do anything to advance it's own agenda.

The reason people thinks these outlandish "conspiracy theories" is because of all the ACTUAL outlandish things the government has DONE. Operation Paper Clip, Operation Northwoods, MK-ULTRA. The list is long and evil.

On topic, we're already some weird hybrid social/fascist state and have been for some time.
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: samhill On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:54 am

I was gonna say what I feel but then remembered that it's the day before Christmas, it will be a sad Christmas for many I am sure of that. It's also Monday, garbage day for me so I got to do important work, note to self(take can down to end of driveway before it snows) got my work cut out for me & it's cold so that will be a plus.
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: jpete On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:59 am

freetown fred wrote:- everything in life has limits


Albert Einstein wrote:“Two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I am not yet completely sure about the universe.”


:lol:
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:15 am

rberq wrote:In a few generaltions everyone will have his own flying car, just a little later than Popular Science predicted in the 1950s. :P

.


Like this http://www.terrafugia.com/
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: lsayre On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:27 am

Flyer5 wrote:Like this http://www.terrafugia.com/


It looks so practical! :roll:

I'd hate to be driving it down the street in a cross wind. Getting above 25-30 mph on the road might be a bit scary also.
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Stockton Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (13.5 KW)

Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:52 am

lsayre wrote:
Flyer5 wrote:Like this http://www.terrafugia.com/


It looks so practical! :roll:

I'd hate to be driving it down the street in a cross wind. Getting above 25-30 mph on the road might be a bit scary also.[/quote
It looks expensive. How can we make it fair so all the poor people can afford one too?
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:56 am

franco b wrote:
lsayre wrote:
Flyer5 wrote:Like this http://www.terrafugia.com/


It looks so practical! :roll:

I'd hate to be driving it down the street in a cross wind. Getting above 25-30 mph on the road might be a bit scary also.[/quote
It looks expensive. How can we make it fair so all the poor people can afford one too?



Oh that will be part of new entitlements programs. If they make it electric they can just use subsidies. LOL It would definitely shorten my daily commute though. :D
Flyer5
 
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:29 am

To return to the original topic:

Right now we have an oligarchy of robber banks and politicians running things. Instead of increasing wealth there is stagnation financed through the backdoor of taxation which is printing money. The unit of labor which money should represent becomes less and less until it eventually is worth nothing. Then we start over. The rate of technological advance will determine how long that will be since technology can make most things, but not all things cheaper and cheaper in step with the deterioration of the money.

The trend toward more and more people doing nothing but demanding more and more is a symptom of a sick society that utilizes human instinct in a destructive way to preserve the oligarchy.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:46 am

I have no clue where we will be in the future. I keep hoping we will get people in office that actually give a crap about something other than themselves. We just keep re-electing the same people to do the same thing over and over. So my vote is either socialists or we will be like the middle east and be at war for generations because of the divisions in this country.
Flyer5
 
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Re: Where do you see the USA a few generations from now?

PostBy: lsayre On: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:51 am

franco b wrote:To return to the original topic:

Right now we have an oligarchy of robber banks and politicians running things. Instead of increasing wealth there is stagnation financed through the backdoor of taxation which is printing money. The unit of labor which money should represent becomes less and less until it eventually is worth nothing. Then we start over. The rate of technological advance will determine how long that will be since technology can make most things, but not all things cheaper and cheaper in step with the deterioration of the money.

The trend toward more and more people doing nothing but demanding more and more is a symptom of a sick society that utilizes human instinct in a destructive way to preserve the oligarchy.


A very good assessment. :clap:

As was noted by Chris Martenson (former VP of Pfizer), literally all of human achievement to date has been accomplished with a very strong, cheep, and seemingly endlessly abundant energy tailwind pushing it in assistance. The trick going forward however will be to advance technologically and simultaneously sustain individual freedom and dignity and living standards in the face of an ever increasing energy headwind.

Martenson is perhaps a bit more cynical than even this however, as he goes on to ask (quoting here from memory): "What if all of human achievement has been merely an artifact of cheap and abundant energy?"
Last edited by lsayre on Mon Dec 24, 2012 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
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