Do you own your home?

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: samhill On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:49 am

Ah, but there were experiments with an income tax early on but because of the times almost impossible to maintain so there were taxes or fees on other things, no matter what name they give it a tax is still a tax, the hard part is making the tax as much of an equal burden on all, hard to get much out of someone that has very little. http://history1900s.about.com/od/1910s/a/incometax.htm
samhill
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: keystoker 160
Hand Fed Coal Stove: hitzer 75 in garage
Stove/Furnace Make: keystoker/hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: koker 160/ hitzer 75

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:07 pm

I don't want tax to be EQUAL. I want to pay as little taxes as humanly possible.

You're still trying to figure out how to fund the government. My objective is to DEfund it.

Maybe now you understand why we don't agree.
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

SteveZee wrote:As far as prior to the income and property tax period, they were first introduced as a way to pay for WW1 costs/repairations.


The permanent income tax started in 1913.

The US didn't get into WW I until 1917.

http://www.loc.gov/rr/business/hottopic ... story.html

The origin of the income tax on individuals is generally cited as the passage of the 16th Amendment, passed by Congress on July 2, 1909, and ratified February 3, 1913


Yes there were some attempts to tax income previously, but they were never permanent.
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice


Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: I'm On Fire On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:26 pm

jpete wrote:
SteveZee wrote:As far as prior to the income and property tax period, they were first introduced as a way to pay for WW1 costs/repairations.


The permanent income tax started in 1913.

The US didn't get into WW I until 1917.

http://www.loc.gov/rr/business/hottopic ... story.html

The origin of the income tax on individuals is generally cited as the passage of the 16th Amendment, passed by Congress on July 2, 1909, and ratified February 3, 1913


Yes there were some attempts to tax income previously, but they were never permanent.


Both of you are correct.

1913 the income tax became permanent it was at 1%. In 1917 when the US entered World War 1 the income tax was raised to held fund the war to 2%. After WWI the taxes went back down to 1.5% and were RAISED during the depression to 4% where they were RAISED again in 1941 to help fund WW II to 10%. The income tax has been raised and raised and raised until 2003 when it went down to 10%. On a side note, taxes went down during Vietnam.
I'm On Fire
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machines DS-1600 Hot Air Circulator

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: samhill On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:31 pm

The original income tax was the Revenue Act of 1861 & different variations went in & out ever since as a stated a tax by any other tax is still a tax, as now then they wanted an income tax rather than import & excise or even sin taxes, they were looking for something more stable. Jpete, you want all the Gov. gives & everything you can take but have zero responsibility since you want to do away with the Gov. by de-funding it what makes your ideal situation that far from being a cheating welfare slug? Since most agree the status of the career welfare slugs that contribute little to nothing but want all that they can get. & I'm not trying to get personal but where does the difference lie & where do you think everything that we all take for granted is going to come from?
samhill
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: keystoker 160
Hand Fed Coal Stove: hitzer 75 in garage
Stove/Furnace Make: keystoker/hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: koker 160/ hitzer 75

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:37 pm

samhill wrote:The original income tax was the Revenue Act of 1861 & different variations went in & out ever since as a stated a tax by any other tax is still a tax, as now then they wanted an income tax rather than import & excise or even sin taxes, they were looking for something more stable. Jpete, you want all the Gov. gives & everything you can take but have zero responsibility since you want to do away with the Gov. by de-funding it what makes your ideal situation that far from being a cheating welfare slug? Since most agree the status of the career welfare slugs that contribute little to nothing but want all that they can get. & I'm not trying to get personal but where does the difference lie & where do you think everything that we all take for granted is going to come from?


One. Because my employer pays the unemployment tax, not you.

Second, I have paid and still am paying income tax.

Third, I don't plan on making this a way of life.

Fourth, you're the one that wants stuff from government. If I had my way, there's still a good chance I'd be at my machine making oil refinery parts for $60k/yr rather than talking to you.

Fifth, you've never ONCE heard me say anything about social programs. It's always monetary and foreign policy.

Aren't you one them that says if I don't like the system I should leave? Well...this is YOUR system. If you don't like me using it. Change it.
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: samhill On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:55 pm

Actually Jpete, I have & will continue to do everything I can to change many things in the system. I complain about the long term UC all I can & I was under the impression that we all paid into it, if your former employer is long gone just how is it paying into a system for your hours worked? That's just it Jpete you don't have your way, nobody gets everything they want, life isn't always a bed of roses & yes I do want the protection, utilities, infrastructure & everything the Gov. provides for us all & I am willing to pay for it. There is a lot of waste & I also try & point that out & stop that & lastly you did take this as a personal thing. If your still paying income tax it's because you are still getting income but I guess you don't want to even do that so where is the difference? To me welfare is welfare, doesn't matter if it's personal or corperate just like a tax, whatever name you give it there it is.
samhill
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: keystoker 160
Hand Fed Coal Stove: hitzer 75 in garage
Stove/Furnace Make: keystoker/hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: koker 160/ hitzer 75

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:08 pm

samhill wrote:Actually Jpete, I have & will continue to do everything I can to change many things in the system. I complain about the long term UC all I can & I was under the impression that we all paid into it, if your former employer is long gone just how is it paying into a system for your hours worked?


Who said my company is gone? They closed my plant, but as far as I know, John Crane Inc is still located in Morton Grove, IL and doing brisk business on most of the continents on the planet.

samhill wrote:That's just it Jpete you don't have your way, nobody gets everything they want, life isn't always a bed of roses & yes I do want the protection, utilities, infrastructure & everything the Gov. provides for us all & I am willing to pay for it. There is a lot of waste & I also try & point that out & stop that & lastly you did take this as a personal thing. If your still paying income tax it's because you are still getting income but I guess you don't want to even do that so where is the difference? To me welfare is welfare, doesn't matter if it's personal or corperate just like a tax, whatever name you give it there it is.


So what forms of welfare are you on?

Take all your tax deductions?

Any farm subsidies?

Let's see if this pot is black....
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: samhill On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:39 pm

Only what you might call a deduction is the Homestead property tax reduction for some of us old folks. I get my Co. pension which was paid by me, SS which I paid into all my working life & a small Vets Disability check that I served my country for & that I would rather not have earned to begin with but that's life. Income taxes are taken right out of everything but the VA which is tax free.
How would I have known which Co. you worked for or where they are maybe if you made their widgets for 40k rather than 60k they might still be here but in any event how did the Gov. (that you hate) cause this?
samhill
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: keystoker 160
Hand Fed Coal Stove: hitzer 75 in garage
Stove/Furnace Make: keystoker/hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: koker 160/ hitzer 75

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:50 pm

samhill wrote:Only what you might call a deduction is the Homestead property tax reduction for some of us old folks. I get my Co. pension which was paid by me, SS which I paid into all my working life & a small Vets Disability check that I served my country for & that I would rather not have earned to begin with but that's life. Income taxes are taken right out of everything but the VA which is tax free.


Didn't write off any mortgage interest? No dependent deductions?

samhill wrote:How would I have known which Co. you worked for or where they are maybe if you made their widgets for 40k rather than 60k they might still be here but in any event how did the Gov. (that you hate) cause this?


You wouldn't so why would you assume they vanished?

The government makes the rules doesn't it? I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong.

Ever hear of NAFTA? China's "Most Favored Nation" trading status? Those are two places my work went. I'm pretty sure I didn't vote for them.

How about tax law? Labor law? Environmental law? Tens of thousands of pages of laws and codes and regulations on a national and local level. I don't blame my employer at all for wanting to get out. As soon as I can leave RI, I'm out too.
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: samhill On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:57 pm

My point from a long time ago Jpete but why stop at RI (which I'm not sure of) if it's the country you hate & blame for everything hopefully you'll find another that you can run to your liking. No , I (IMO own my home so no mortgage & my children are way over 18.
samhill
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: keystoker 160
Hand Fed Coal Stove: hitzer 75 in garage
Stove/Furnace Make: keystoker/hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: koker 160/ hitzer 75

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:07 pm

My view to home ownership is. Every year I pay off more and more of my mortgage but my taxes have risen an average of 300/ yr for the last 8 or so . So I figure by the time the mtg is done I will owe the same payment for my taxes. Cant win anymore sometimes. I still think property taxes should be illegal. You should be able to hold free and clear. There should be another way of getting income.
Flyer5
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Leisure Line Pioneer

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:12 pm

samhill wrote:My point from a long time ago Jpete but why stop at RI (which I'm not sure of) if it's the country you hate & blame for everything hopefully you'll find another that you can run to your liking. No , I (IMO own my home so no mortgage & my children are way over 18.


But did you ever take those deductions? I'm quite certain that since you are so dead set against taking anything from the government and using the system as it is set up, you religiously avoided any tax breaks so you could have more of those roads and stuff that only the government can build.

And RI is only a first step. I may end up someplace like Belize or that neighborhood before I get covered up with dirt.

Like the man said "mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable."

I'm still accepting the suffering right now. But I'm one foot out the door always.
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: samhill On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:25 pm

Jpete, I never said that I never took a deduction but that I never blamed my Gov. for any & everything that ever happened, that's life I learned to roll with it a long time ago & try to do what I think is right when I can & not sweat what I have no control over. How can you ever consider another country? You would need another planet, to my knowledge everything on our planet is owned by at least one evil Gov. or another & they all have some sort of stupid rules so you would have little other choice. Maybe you could get a ship with an long anchor but I'm not even sure you could get away with that but at least you would be your own metal country for a time at least.
samhill
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: keystoker 160
Hand Fed Coal Stove: hitzer 75 in garage
Stove/Furnace Make: keystoker/hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: koker 160/ hitzer 75

Re: Do you own your home?

PostBy: jpete On: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:25 pm

samhill wrote:Jpete, I never said that I never took a deduction but that I never blamed my Gov. for any & everything that ever happened, that's life I learned to roll with it a long time ago & try to do what I think is right when I can & not sweat what I have no control over. How can you ever consider another country? You would need another planet, to my knowledge everything on our planet is owned by at least one evil Gov. or another & they all have some sort of stupid rules so you would have little other choice. Maybe you could get a ship with an long anchor but I'm not even sure you could get away with that but at least you would be your own metal country for a time at least.


So one country ISN'T "better" than another? How does that qualify us as the "best country on earth" then?

And if one isn't better than the next, why do you suggest I leave?

Also, I'm a little shocked to hear you admit that you have no control over your government. Seems like a dangerous place to live.
jpete
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mk II
Coal Size/Type: Stove, Nut, Pea
Other Heating: Dino juice