Single Flue inside house

Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Uglysquirrel On: Fri May 10, 2013 4:15 pm

Looking at a 1 story ranch with a 8" x8" outside dimension rectangular tile single flue chimney that is located entirely inside the house, from basement floor to 3' above the peak . Interior of tile is 7" x7" square. The chimney has a hole in the basement with a cemented off hole on the 1st floor. I know that by code only one solid fuel appliance should be attached at any one time. That is not the issue..

Questions:

1) Given the same coal exhaust temp, does an interior chimney have less natural draft compared to an exterior chimney ?

2) Given the same coal exhaust temp, will there be more natural draft with a basement coal unit compared to a coal unit installed on the 1st floor ?

The chimney was used previously with wood in the basement. Inspection shows an excellent tile condition.

Thanks for the input...

Ug
Uglysquirrel
 
Stove/Furnace Model: Pocono

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Coalfire On: Fri May 10, 2013 4:18 pm

1 No


2 yes





Eric
Coalfire
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 96K btu Circulator
Coal Size/Type: Nut

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Berlin On: Fri May 10, 2013 4:44 pm

let me fix that for you :)

Coalfire wrote:1 No


2 no





Eric



an interior stack will draft better (all else being equal) than an exterior one - every time and is more consistant in varrying weather conditions. Because of the stack effect of the house itself, an appliance tends to draft better on the first floor than the basement.
Berlin
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Will-Burt Combustioneer 77B
Coal Size/Type: Ohio BITUMINOUS pea stoker coal


Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: freetown fred On: Fri May 10, 2013 4:49 pm

Basement or 1st floor would be the same draft. At least in my setting when my interior block chimney was up. I'm doubting a significant difference between interior or exterior chimney. My wood stove chimney (exterior) in the back was the same draw as the interior running through the house
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Coalfire On: Fri May 10, 2013 4:57 pm

Berlin wrote:let me fix that for you :)

Coalfire wrote:1 No


2 no





Eric



an interior stack will draft better (all else being equal) than an exterior one - every time and is more consistant in varrying weather conditions. Because of the stack effect of the house itself, an appliance tends to draft better on the first floor than the basement.



Ok I thought that chimney height was one of the big factors in draft? you are saying the stack effect outweighs height. learn something every day
Coalfire
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 96K btu Circulator
Coal Size/Type: Nut

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Lightning On: Fri May 10, 2013 8:04 pm

I'm no chimney expert but - It makes sense to me that an interior chimney will be kept warmer (since its inside the house) than an exterior chimney. This will keep the flue gases warmer which will keep a stronger and more consistent draft as compared to an external chimney. This is why many old homes have a central internal chimney. The old timers new their dung when it came to chimneys.

As for placement pertaining to basement or first floor of the appliance, It makes sense to me the basement placement would have better draft since the stack is vertically higher than a first floor appliance location. It also makes sense to me that this condition would apply the same whether the chimney is internal or external... BUT there are many variables - If the basement IS NOT well sealed from the living space above AND the basement is airtight from the outside, stack effect of the house could apply from air on the top level migrating up thru the ceiling or thru top story window seals causing low pressure in the basement which cannibalizes draft strength. Many influencing factors occur at these low negative pressures we rely on in the natural drafting strength of the chimney.

The science of Chimneys :lol:
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut Size / White Ash

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: dcrane On: Fri May 10, 2013 8:14 pm

Stack Effect Equation Q= CA> 2gh/ Ti-To = 2x#> 1 the power of 2

Grrr, wheres Larry when ya need him :mad: :lol:

Berlin is right in that the chimney would naturally be warmer inside then outside therby allowing for a better initial draft (maybe you dont need to ball up a piece of paper to burn in the flu or hold a piece up the chimney in the fireplace before lighting the fire) but after the fire is going and the flu is hot the diff. is pretty pointless.

Lightning also confims that old time theory that the first floor drafts better is indeed because of factors lightning mentions " low pressure in the basement which cannibalizes draft strength"
Last edited by dcrane on Fri May 10, 2013 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
dcrane
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: SMITTY On: Fri May 10, 2013 8:17 pm

I've got an unlined decrepit interior chimney, and it drafts great even from the basement ... so you should be good to go Uggs. 8-)

It'll pull a .01 on a 90° day naturally.
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Uglysquirrel On: Sat May 11, 2013 12:05 pm

Thanks Everybody..

Sounds like you guys are singing the same good info that it should be a good install.

Looks like a good place to get out of Mallocup, Connecticut.
Uglysquirrel
 
Stove/Furnace Model: Pocono

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Lightning On: Sat May 11, 2013 2:00 pm

As you are probably aware just be sure to do a thorough inspection of the chimney. Check for blockages birds and squirrels like to make homes in them. It may need swept well if it previously was used for wood burning.
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut Size / White Ash

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Sat May 11, 2013 10:44 pm

You received some great advice. Chimneys work by at least 2 functions. Barometric difference for atmosphere and temperature differential. Simply put normally you have a lower pressure the higher you go and heat rises in a open system. Inside chimneys are normally the best.
Flyer5
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Leisure Line Pioneer

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Uglysquirrel On: Sun May 12, 2013 6:38 am

Flyer5, I'm just plum excited about the future potential of another LL to my current collection.
Uglysquirrel
 
Stove/Furnace Model: Pocono

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Rob R. On: Sun May 12, 2013 8:48 am

freetown fred wrote:My wood stove chimney (exterior) in the back was the same draw as the interior running through the house


Hey Fred, did you ever try running the Hitzer on that other chimney? The reason I ask is that the woodstove would have a lot higher stack temperature, and would be more likely to keep the flue warm. My brother's chimney runs up the side of the home, and with a wood fire in the Hitzer it would suck the feathers off a crowbar...but with a proper coal fire, the draft is adequate at best.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Coal Size/Type: Rice/buck
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: freetown fred On: Sun May 12, 2013 9:12 am

Like stated so many times--each geographic setting is unique in itself--aside from the didactics--yes, I ran the Hitzer in the external block chimney while having the triple wall installed--about two months or so in the dead of my first winter burning coal--$$$$$ was the hold up LOL--I do not have a mano nor a baro, but I didn't notice any difference in either, or. I firmly believe that all these numbers/gadgets look pretty impressive but bottom line---the proof is in the pudding
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: Single Flue inside house

PostBy: Lightning On: Sun May 12, 2013 7:59 pm

Without a mano, its pretty hard to tell how one drafted compared to the other. But as long as the flue gases went up the chimney - yer good hahaha 8-)
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut Size / White Ash