Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: Lightning On: Sun Jul 07, 2013 9:26 pm

McGiever wrote:WOW, you are in a perfect situation for a rapid return on investment for a coal boiler install...and then it's all about BIG savings beyond, year after year. :D


This is still the best advice, in my opinion.

Beyond that, he could install a coal insert or free standing antique base burner for eye candy and supplemental heat :D
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut Size / White Ash

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: Wiz On: Sun Jul 07, 2013 9:31 pm

Lightning wrote:
McGiever wrote:WOW, you are in a perfect situation for a rapid return on investment for a coal boiler install...and then it's all about BIG savings beyond, year after year. :D


This is still the best advice, in my opinion.

Beyond that, he could install a coal insert or free standing antique base burner for eye candy and supplemental heat :D

Excellent point, definitely would look sweet.
Wiz
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker Ka 6
Coal Size/Type: Casey Junk Coal :(

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: orrsmills On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:56 am

coalnewbie wrote:OMG, it's beautiful, congratulations on your wonderful home. I will call dlj and schedule something.

Regards

Simon



Thanks, however, the house looks better in pictures then in real life....lol.
orrsmills
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Quadra-Fire
Stove/Furnace Model: 4100I

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Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: freetown fred On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 8:30 am

Don't they all om! ;)
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: VigIIPeaBurner On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 11:01 am

Wiz wrote:Going to call it like this from looking at the pictures. I would replace wood stove and put coal stove in it's spot if it was me. Yeah there is pros and cons on either way, but room wouldn't be the same if it was in basement. That's my story and sticking with it :P


Indeed! Orrsmills, if you find that you like coal, and we're certain you will ;) , do the boiler later on. That's a beautiful hearth and chimney set you have. I'd suggest that you look into replacing that wood insert with something like the keystoker HF Insert 70/90. The larger unit is rated @ 90,000 BTU and has a huge glass viewing area. There will be an amazing amount of radiant hear emminating from the windows. You could likely burn wood in it but with anthracite the windows will never soot up. You'll be keeping those toes warm in front of something that will look like this after burning for 14 hrs (ok franko b?!):
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VigIIPeaBurner
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Keystoker Koker
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Vermont Casting Vigilant II 2310
Other Heating: #2 Oil Furnace

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 11:58 am

VigIIPeaBurner wrote:(ok franko b?!):


OK. Just keeping you on your toes to get the objective informed posts I am used to reading from you.

The present unit he has looks pretty nice to me. Would like to know a bit more about its performance which would help determine any replacement. Pounds of wood burned in a typical day and what the comfort level was in the room.

I am not a fan of inserts because of problems of getting at the chimney for cleaning and any stove maintenance. There is also fan noise and if run 24/7 possible fan motor failure.

The Hitzer 503 is another possibility and I like that it has a hopper for easier tending but am disappointed that it lacks a thermostat for air intake but does thermostatically control the fans. http://www.hitzer.com/documents/product ... e_2011.pdf

There is quite a bit to read if you enter Hitzer 503 in the search box in this forum also.

Another option is to replace the baseboard radiation in that room with cast iron like the Burnham Baseray baseboard which would have a much higher radiant effect and might possibly have higher Btu per foot. Can't remember the ratings. Also run as Vigll Peaburner suggests to run at lower water temperature to get longer run times. I think logically this would be with a stoker in the basement and keep the present stove in the fireplace.

What I would prefer is a free standing stove but I can't seem to picture it looking better than what is there and I would not jeopardize the present look which is nice. Hauling coal up and ashes down would also be eliminated with the basement boiler, and price does not seem to be an issue.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: nortcan On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:43 pm

And what about a stove having already a place for the toes and feet? :lol:
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nortcan
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Stuart,Peterson/ Grander
Stove/Furnace Model: Sunnyside/ Golden Bride

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:50 pm

Nortcan, I've always favored the Baltimore heaters for that type of app. .... pretty.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: orrsmills On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:35 pm

The Hitzer 503 is another possibility and I like that it has a hopper for easier tending but am disappointed that it lacks a thermostat for air intake but does thermostatically control the fans. http://www.hitzer.com/documents/product ... e_2011.pdf


Hi Franco,

Yeah so far as inserts are concered I like the Hitzer 503 the best. Anyone know how much they cost?
orrsmills
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Quadra-Fire
Stove/Furnace Model: 4100I

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: orrsmills On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:53 pm

Would like to know a bit more about its performance which would help determine any replacement. Pounds of wood burned in a typical day and what the comfort level was in the room.


I put in acouple nice pieces of wood 4 to 5 (not toTally fill) before going to work 6:00Am. Wife will then put acouple more logs in early afternoon, then I will put little more in when I get home 3 to 4 logs(if really cold) at 5:00pm and then fill it up(5 or 6 logs) at bed time 9:00pm and I will have plenty of healty ambers by 6:00am. I guess a good wheel barrel a day, obviously more when REALLY cold. When we redid the kitchen we had to redo the exteror wall (post and bean house with foam type of installation) when the wall was redone they put in the pink installation and I get a bad draft at the electrial plug in. When the wall was redone I should have gotten the spary installtion, one of these day will get it fixed.

When it's really cold single digits and windy (house hates wind) we really have to crank the wood stove to keep up and wife is still not happy. The majority of the winter it very comfy in the living room. It's a 55,600 BTU stove.

I would think a 80,000 BTU coal stove(insert) would be perfect?!?!
orrsmills
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Quadra-Fire
Stove/Furnace Model: 4100I

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:19 pm

I am glad you have found a solution, I hope all goes well.

Simon
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: orrsmills On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:22 pm

I am glad you have found a solution, I hope all goes well.


Still researching......
orrsmills
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Quadra-Fire
Stove/Furnace Model: 4100I

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:59 pm

orrsmills wrote:I would think a 80,000 BTU coal stove(insert) would be perfect?!?!


Those Btu ratings are usually arrived at when the stove undergoes UL testing when they fire the hell out of it. A real world 50,000 would be more realistic, and the same limitations apply to your present stove where you would probably need two wheelbarrows full of wood to achieve it. In both cases efficiency would go way down as stack temp. goes up.

Whatever amount you burn you can figure on carrying a bit less than half the weight to the stove than with wood, but you will have five times the ash. To get an honest output of 50,000 you need to burn 80 to 100 pounds of coal. I doubt you would need to burn that much.

The hopper is a great feature to have as it will make tending faster and easier as well as lessening any chance of puff back from unburned gases which increases efficiency by burning more of those gasses. It will also feed a small amount to the fire between tending but to really feed it needs the ash cleared to make room for new coal. By having pre- heated coal in the hopper, recovery time when new coal is added is very fast and the hopper will automatically set the proper depth of coal bed. Just open the top and pour in the coal to fill the hopper at every tending which should be 12 hours or longer.

Fans are nice because they increase the efficiency of the heat exchange surfaces of the stove but they can also be noisy and can go bad and they also use some electricity. At least Hitzer has access from the side without removing the unit.

It's a hassle to install and thought has to be given about sliding a brush either up or down the chimney to clean it. Even more important with your wood insert as creosote is a problem coal does not have but does make fly ash which clings to the chimney surface. The chimney should have a cap to keep wet out and reacting with that ash. What is your chimney? Tile lined or stainless steel and diameter and height?

Ash pan capacity is very important for easy clean tending. Ideally it should not need emptying more than once a day with moderate burning. Very few stoves have a big enough ash pan.

There are a lot of posts about the 503 in this forum. Put hitzer 503 in the search box to read many pages.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:47 pm

I do not share the optimism that an insert is going to cut it - period. Post and beam and leaky, it can get damned cold and windy up there and you are going to put 150-200# through an insert to keep up - never going to happen. How do you say stove mistress nicely. Shame as the beautiful fireplace would look good with an simple insert installed. When the Hudson freezes over they suffer from Nyack to Chazy. If you are prepared to suck it up in the depth of winter then go for it but it not how I plan my heating systems. As they say, you pays your money and takes your chances. CN's law states - Overkill is good and more overkill is better and that has never let me down yet. I think, zero degrees, 30MPH winds and the power went out - who you gonna call Ghostbusters. Remember Murphy was an optimist.

I'm gonna find a rock to hide behind.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: Newbie looking to install coal stove in basement.

PostBy: orrsmills On: Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:44 pm

coalnewbie wrote:I do not share the optimism that an insert is going to cut it - period. Post and beam and leaky, it can get damned cold and windy up there and you are going to put 150-200# through an insert to keep up - never going to happen. How do you say stove mistress nicely. Shame as the beautiful fireplace would look good with an simple insert installed. When the Hudson freezes over they suffer from Nyack to Chazy. If you are prepared to suck it up in the depth of winter then go for it but it not how I plan my heating systems. As they say, you pays your money and takes your chances. CN's law states - Overkill is good and more overkill is better and that has never let me down yet. I think, zero degrees, 30MPH winds and the power went out - who you gonna call Ghostbusters. Remember Murphy was an optimist.

I'm gonna find a rock to hide behind.


Do you think the coal insert will at least provide me with the same/better heat then current wood stove? Like I said I'm OK how current stove is working in winter.

Mark
orrsmills
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Quadra-Fire
Stove/Furnace Model: 4100I

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