value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: edsimon On: Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:15 pm

I have a 6 year old DF520 I'm getting older and thinking about maybe Geothermal....Less work... If I did that does anyone know what a used DF520 could be sold for? It would help fund the conversion..
edsimon
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: DF520

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:33 pm

Why not keep the 520 and see how much a geothermal system can actually put out in a bad winter. Yanche will tell you any geothermal system can be made to work but can you afford the electric bill. I am not a fan.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 110K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93, Jotul 507
Baseburners & Antiques: Red Cross Invader 2
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: Rob R. On: Mon Jul 22, 2013 9:12 pm

New they are about 9 grand, not including the oil package. Refurbished DF520's range from about 4500 to 6000 depending on age, condition, and accessories. Since your unit is only 6 years old, it should be in very nice condition. With that said, would the buyer have to remove the unit from a basement? If so, that is definitely going to hurt the value.

In short, it is worth whatever someone will give you...and that depends on the condition and difficulty of the extraction.

Now, for some information you didn't ask for...GEO-THERMAL HEATING / COOLING SYSTEMS

One quote from that thread stands out to me:

I've had enough experience with geo to last a lifetime.My experience cost me enough in company loss that I am sure to be burning coal for the next 20 years. While they are touted to be the end all, what I saw was a building built around their supposed energy saving design, totally over engineered, high cost for a local college to teach alternate energy courses. The Water furnaces supplied proved to be a product that only the factory reps could deal with when they could be pursuaded into coming to N.Y. The best part of the whole thing is the fact that it cost more to run that building than any other on the whole campus :P We had to go back and figure other ways to save electrical costs. Overpriced , Bull$hitting, unaccountable dead wood engineers trying to validate their existance. Just like politicians, one and the same. Me,,,,I will take my EFM and ride off into the sunset. I will grow old with it in comfort and peace, knowing that it won't let me down. Can that Geo loop make me feel the same way. NO! I 'm not really sure how it all works but this I do know, it take some serious electricity to pump water from 300' down from 5 wells. It takes serious electricity to run compressors.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:19 am

I have an Artesian well source and looked into this and you can thank your lucky stars you wandered onto this board. Given the choice between a Water Furnace and an EFM I would choose the latter and I don't even have an hydronic heating system. WF recruit their salesman carefully and first have to learn to sell snowballs to eskimos to be hired. I am getting old too and am desperately searching for easy but you have not found nirvana - trust me.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 110K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93, Jotul 507
Baseburners & Antiques: Red Cross Invader 2
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:02 am

Not going to get into attemting to changing peoples perception on Geo. here...

But, I have used wood for 16 years, then went to total geo for another 15 years...most recent 3 years has been coal boiler + geo.
Coal boiler heat delivery is through geo heat pump duct system. I love my air-conditioning in the summer...coal don't cool. ;)

Not to say I was unhappy with geo for winter heat, just is my nature to try different energy sources and "tinker" with them to get more for less.

I would say geo is like a lot of other subjects and it's not too difficult to find the "horror stories" of some bad installs.

In all fairness, when considering geo...listen to both the happy and unhappy experiences.

I am not a contractor or an engineer, but just a tradesman that enjoys knowing a little/lot more. ;)

Would love to have that Artesian well on my property, if it makes around 8 gal/min. :!: :!: :!:
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: nuthcuntrynut On: Tue Jul 23, 2013 7:12 pm

typical residential install about 25k, that's if you've already got ductwork. payback is usually inside 20 yrs, typical heatpump compressor is Good for about ten-fifteen yrs., serpentine heat exchanger is Good for about the same(if its ran with glycol as the medium, if not theystart decreasing in efficiency within two yrs, and root out or plug up in 7/10yrs.
the vertical Wells are the best , but the priciest too, and if they leak you scrap them and drill again. if you can get a federal grant $$ then geothermal is worth it, sort of, if not, well ..... lets just say they are about as good as the installer, and the warrantythey give is normally 7yrs. of course life span is 10-15yrs. the compressor is the most costly to replace and pray it isn't a burnout. the burnouts are extremely expensive to repair, and if the acid isn't cleaned up properly will definitely cause another burnout within one yr.
nuthcuntrynut
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: wl110 leisure line
Coal Size/Type: rice
Other Heating: ussc pellet stove
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: WL 110

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:29 pm

nuthcuntrynut wrote:typical residential install about 25k, that's if you've already got ductwork. payback is usually inside 20 yrs, typical heatpump compressor is Good for about ten-fifteen yrs., serpentine heat exchanger is Good for about the same(if its ran with glycol as the medium, if not theystart decreasing in efficiency within two yrs, and root out or plug up in 7/10yrs.
the vertical Wells are the best , but the priciest too, and if they leak you scrap them and drill again. if you can get a federal grant $$ then geothermal is worth it, sort of, if not, well ..... lets just say they are about as good as the installer, and the warrantythey give is normally 7yrs. of course life span is 10-15yrs. the compressor is the most costly to replace and pray it isn't a burnout. the burnouts are extremely expensive to repair, and if the acid isn't cleaned up properly will definitely cause another burnout within one yr.


Guess mine isn't very typical then, cause I have beat most all those odds already. :)
Oh, and I was the DIY installer too. ;)
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: nuthcuntrynut On: Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:39 am

1/2 install is labor, so yes. however there are vertical and horizontal well fields, even some submerged in ponds. Did u do a vertical 200ft. Wells?
I have installed several of the heat pump units 4 to date, all 4 were residential , all of them are happy with their geothermal units over.lp-oil heating, and they love the a/c too. i only.did equipment and know nothing of the Wells or engineering sector All of them paid a good price too. if you have the realestate horizontal well field is the cheapest, of you don't then vertical Wells are the answer, orso that's how the company exchanged it to this Oleboy.
my ac unit outsideis near twenty yrs old, last yr it received it's first replacement compressor,of course it only runs in the summer and i do live on the Canadien border, so summers being one month typical. i lived for over twenty yrs in Melbourne fl, and seen many ac units come and go from near yr round use, normal life was 10yrs.
nuthcuntrynut
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: wl110 leisure line
Coal Size/Type: rice
Other Heating: ussc pellet stove
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: WL 110

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: McGiever On: Wed Jul 24, 2013 11:43 am

Geo compressors are located indoors and never see any enviroimental elements or adverse temperature extremes. The loop portion works at stable earth temp. in the 50's.
My system is an "open loop" pump and dump...and sort of like any coal appliance...ya got to know when to clean the heat exchanger.

Geo is not perfect...but, let's not give it a "bum rap"
Imagine if the tables were turned......this topic was being discussed with the heat pump forum guys...someone comes on and says "I want to tear out my geo and am thinking of burning coal...What do you all think? " You see, not going to be a real fair dicussion, now is it?
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: nuthcuntrynut On: Wed Jul 24, 2013 7:41 pm

:smoke:
nuthcuntrynut
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: wl110 leisure line
Coal Size/Type: rice
Other Heating: ussc pellet stove
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: WL 110

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: plumb-r On: Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:45 am

How many people drive around everywhere in their cars backward and is it as fast and fuel efficient??? No a car was designed to run forward. A heat pump is a "Air Conditioner" running in reverse. Because water is denser it is a better medium than air. They work great to cool because of the constant temp. but in heat mode they suck. :)
plumb-r
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Hitzer
Stove/Furnace Model: 608 Energy Master I Stoker

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:17 am

You see, not going to be a real fair dicussion, now is it?


I love my Hyundai so much I posted on the BMW forum about how Hyundais are better than BMW. Go figure, I got 954 negative comments on my post..... I just don't think this is going to be a fair discussion is it. :D :D
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 110K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93, Jotul 507
Baseburners & Antiques: Red Cross Invader 2
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: nuthcuntrynut On: Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:23 am

oh they heat, if you can afford running the compressor day and nite constant. supplemental heat is cheaper in real cold climates., they cool great though and aren't affected by ambient temps as the cooling medium is at a constant. and in all fairness they work good in fall , spring and into winter, but coal is cheaper, and quieter. it just requires more work, geothermal only requires you set the tstat, and change the air filter. i don't care for forced air heat of any kind.
nuthcuntrynut
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: wl110 leisure line
Coal Size/Type: rice
Other Heating: ussc pellet stove
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line
Stove/Furnace Model: WL 110

Re: value of used DF520 maybe converting to Geothermal

PostBy: McGiever On: Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:56 am

Some seem to be missing the point here...
This is about the desire to switch units...not about which is the better one.

I came to volunteer and share my experiences with having several years of relevent operation under my belt...not just to add my opinion or debate what is the better. :)

Hope the OP was able to gain some insight from this. :doh:
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek