Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: toolmaker On: Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:15 pm

Hi All,

I'm preparing to hook up a Hitzer 50-93 in front of the fireplace. I took out a Winterwarm wood stove insert that I had there. It had a connector that ran from the eight inch liner to large oval cutout in the Winterwarm. The connector has also been removed.

The fireplace has an 8 inch flexible liner. The Hitzer has a six inch flue. (Hitzer's instructions say that the liner should not have more than 3 times the cross sectional area as the flue. pi*3*3 = 28.27. Times 3 = 84.8. pi*4*4 = 50.2. Since 50 is less than 85, I should be good).

To increase from the six inch pipe to my particular flexible liner, I purchased:

A. HomeSaver Roundflex 316-Alloy Connector/Adaptor for 8 inch Chimney Liner. This is an 8-1/4" female to eight inch male connector.
B. Snap-Lock Black Steel Stovepipe 6-Inch Male to 8-Inch Female Increaser

The Roundflex adapter slides over the liner, and the increaser slides onto the roundflex. The top of the adapter has four holes like the old one on the wood stove I took out, so it looks like I can just screw it to the liner. The increaser has no holes.

What is the procedure for connecting all this stuff? Do I drill holes through the increaser and adapter together and screw them together? Do I need to seal all this with furnace cement or some other adhesive?

These questions show my ignorance. I just want to do it right.


Thanks.
toolmaker
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: nut & rice anthracite
Other Heating: pocono w/powervent

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: freetown fred On: Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:37 pm

WHAT????????? toothy tm, screw everything together & if you feel more comfortable, cement the connectors--ya can't over-do safety. You're the only one standing there looking at your set up, do what you feel should be done!
Last edited by freetown fred on Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: Lightning On: Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:38 pm

I just zip screw my pipes together then wrap the joint with aluminum tape. Stainless steel screws are recommended but not absolutely needed. The tape really isn't that necessary as long as everything fits together good. A chimney normally has negative pressure in it which makes it nearly impossible for flue gases to leak out of a joint that isn't sealed air tight. I personally like to make everything air tight so that on days of low draft conditions (when it's not cold outside) my chimney can't pull in any air from a leaky joint which could help inhibit drafting ability.
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut/Stove Size Mix


Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: toolmaker On: Fri Aug 23, 2013 4:03 pm

freetown fred wrote:WHAT????????? toothy tm, screw everything together & if you feel more comfortable, cement the connectors--ya can't over-do safety. You're the only one standing there looking at your set up, do what you feel should be done!


Me, zoning regs, insurance req's, and who knows who else.

We once had smoke from food burning on the gas range and the alarm system went off. Central station notified the fire department. They went over the house from top to bottom looking for violations. They said they were required to by law. (Maybe, but I think it had more to do with legal issues in case a problem arose later that resulted from something they didn't see it when they responded).

Anyway, I should have been clearer in my question. It seems that when I move to a place with fewer intrusions, regulations follow a few years behind.

I'd much rather not cement the adaptor because I clean the chimney from the bottom up. I would like to unscrew everything from the liner so the eight inch brush will go right in.

Thanks for the replies.

The aluminum tape sounds good for the connection from adaptor to liner. Cement for the reset. Everything screwed together.
toolmaker
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: nut & rice anthracite
Other Heating: pocono w/powervent

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: I'm On Fire On: Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:11 pm

You can use Permatex Red High Temp RTV gasket maker. That's what I use on the joints. The joint at the stove and on the chimney I use stove cement. It just crumbles away if you twist the pipe when removing it. I also screw everything together.
I'm On Fire
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machines DS-1600 Hot Air Circulator

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: mattcoalburner On: Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:14 pm

Main thing is tucking the pipe properly so that the flow of the pipe goes with the smoke...
mattcoalburner
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Reading Juniata

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: toolmaker On: Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:17 pm

"... Permatex Red High Temp RTV gasket maker ... on the joints. The joint at the stove and on the chimney I use stove cement. It just crumbles away if you twist the pipe when removing it. I also screw everything together."


Thanks.

That's great advice.
toolmaker
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: nut & rice anthracite
Other Heating: pocono w/powervent

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: toolmaker On: Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:23 pm

mattcoalburner wrote:Main thing is tucking the pipe properly so that the flow of the pipe goes with the smoke...


It seems a lot of manufacturers say differently when it comes to coal stoves. From what I've read, they want the flow in the opposite direction so that all humidity comes back to the stove instead of corroding the joints.

There seems to be a bit of controversy about this. But it would seem to be supported by the fact that the connectors to the liner go on the outside of the liners.

I'm new to this, so I'm very interested on your opinion on this.
toolmaker
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: nut & rice anthracite
Other Heating: pocono w/powervent

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:56 pm

Wood stoves are piped with the crimp toward the stove to let creosote run back. Coal stoves are usually made so the crimp goes up.

My own opinion is it makes no difference if you burn wood clean, and it is summertime humidity that rots out the pipes, especially if left connected after cleaning. Standing vertically on a cement floor, not connected to stove, I have seen a puddle gather in the summer.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: Lightning On: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:42 pm

For coal use I personally don't think there is any advantage either way when it comes to stove pipe direction. So what ever way it comes off the stove, I'd say it's safe to continue that way. I wouldn't do something extra for the sake of changing the direction of the joints. Some people prefer it a particular way for their own reasons. :D
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut/Stove Size Mix

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: toolmaker On: Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:14 pm

Lightning wrote:For coal use I personally don't think there is any advantage either way when it comes to stove pipe direction. So what ever way it comes off the stove, I'd say it's safe to continue that way. I wouldn't do something extra for the sake of changing the direction of the joints. Some people prefer it a particular way for their own reasons. :D


Thanks.

That makes sense to me.
toolmaker
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: nut & rice anthracite
Other Heating: pocono w/powervent

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: JRLearned On: Wed Aug 28, 2013 10:21 pm

I use Rutland direct vent sealant, good to 800 degrees and doesn't harden like furnace cement. It stays somewhat pliable so you can pull the pipes apart for maintenence. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009YMVGJ4/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
JRLearned
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Chubby Stove
Stove/Furnace Model: FrankenChubby

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: toolmaker On: Wed Aug 28, 2013 10:48 pm

Thanks.

It seems Rutland kind of dominates this market.
toolmaker
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: nut & rice anthracite
Other Heating: pocono w/powervent

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: WNYRob On: Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:09 pm

I would agree, sealing is not needed but if it makes you feel better, go for it. I tape my joints and the two adjustable elbows. With the elbows I just run a couple lengths of tape perpendicular to the ribs. It does nothing for sealing, but it does stiffen the entire assembly up.
WNYRob
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Keystoker Koker controlled with CoalTrol

Re: Do I need to seal pipe connectors with furnace cement?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:12 pm

I used a slip pipe connector at one juncture, and the intentionally undersized slip pipes fit is so loose for it that I used cement along with screws. For all of my other flue pipe connections I used only screws.
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (if I ever get it fixed)