Replace old expansion tank ?

Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: Jeff1491 On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:28 am

I have an old style expansion tank without a bladder. Its pretty big, about 3 feet long mounted on ceiling. Just was wondering if I should replace it with the newer style with the bladder. Would this extend the life of my EFM 520 since i wouldn't be adding new water to the system each time I drain it ? Would it be easy to replace, and could I just hang it from ceiling right where the old one is ? Also what size would I need or would I need multiple tanks? ]Thank in advance
Jeff1491
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 520

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: Sting On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 10:31 am

AS long as the old tank is not leaking and you know ( or learn ) how to maintain it - its fine
Sting
 
Other Heating: BurnHAM=NG-gas

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: freetown fred On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:37 am

DITTO----If it ain't broke---don't fck with it---there'll be plenty of time for all that in your life time ;) I had an old galvanized tank that finally went south & in my opinion, these new fangled fiberglass things w/ bladder are no comparison function wise
freetown fred
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut/Stove mix

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: rberq On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 2:55 pm

Not much can go wrong with the old ones. There was one in our house for about 60 years and the only maintenance was to replace the sight glass once, and that was only because somebody managed to hit it and crack it. The old-timer who took care of our heating system for many years, said he wished ALL his customers had that style and he would see fewer problems.

I REALLY wanted to keep the tank when the old oil boiler was replaced with a new one, but the heating guy was bound and determined that it wouldn't work, though he never could quite explain why. He did say he wanted 15 pounds pressure in the new system, and based on its location I think the old tank only provided 9, so I finally let him do it. :(
rberq
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300
Coal Size/Type: Nut -- Kimmel/Blaschak/Reading
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators, propane

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: franco b On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 3:41 pm

I am under the impression that the tank only provides an air cushion and has nothing to do with the pressure in the system other than to absorb the increased pressure when the water is heated. You could put any pressure you wanted, with a tank or without.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: Mark (PA) On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 5:55 pm

I had to replace my older Exp Tank due to Space limitations after adding in my EFM boiler.

I also redid ALL my piping to hook up my Oil and Coal boiler in parallel so I could run either.

The new Air Scoop I installed fit the newer bladder Tanks / saved more space.

All in what you want to an extend too...
Mark (PA)
 
Stove/Furnace Make: 1953 EFM SF-520 High Boy
Stove/Furnace Model: Fitzgibbon Boiler

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: rberq On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:26 pm

franco b wrote:I am under the impression that the tank only provides an air cushion and has nothing to do with the pressure in the system other than to absorb the increased pressure when the water is heated.

I think you are right, with the currently-used bladder tanks. My old-style tank sat near the ceiling, upstairs, several feet above the top of the highest cast iron radiator. A pipe entered the tank at the bottom and the tank itself was half full of water. A pipe also exited the tank at the top; that was simply an overflow pipe open to the air at its other end (in the cellar). The pressure came from the total height of water in the system, about 20 feet, so I estimated the pressure at the boiler to be about 9 psi. The pressure within the expansion tank itself, of course, would be very low. With the radiators hot, the water level in the expansion tank was higher than with the radiators cold. System pressure did not change when the water was heated, since the whole system was essentially open to the atmosphere -- unlike the modern closed systems.

franco b wrote:You could put any pressure you wanted, with a tank or without.

Without an adequate tank, when you heat the water, something will give either leak-wise or kaboom-wise.
rberq
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300
Coal Size/Type: Nut -- Kimmel/Blaschak/Reading
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators, propane

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: franco b On: Sun Sep 29, 2013 10:17 pm

rberq wrote:franco b wrote:
You could put any pressure you wanted, with a tank or without.

Without an adequate tank, when you heat the water, something will give either leak-wise or kaboom-wise.

Of course. I was just making the point that the tank has nothing to do with pressure. Without the tank the relief valve would open. The fact that the tank was half full at 9 pounds is proof that is all your system needs.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: Jeff1491 On: Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:39 pm

Thanks for the info. So I guess i will just keep the old tank since it seems to be working fine.
Jeff1491
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 520

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:52 pm

Jeff1491 wrote:Thanks for the info. So I guess i will just keep the old tank since it seems to be working fine.

Yours is a closed system so the water feed has to be shut off periodically and the tank partially drained to allow air into the tank to again act as a cushion for the expanding heated water. When you drain it ,it is when its starts chugging that it lets air back in.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: PRengert On: Mon Sep 30, 2013 4:21 pm

I replaced mine with a bladder tank. It seems to eliminate the need to bleed the system periodically.
PRengert
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker K6

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: franco b On: Mon Sep 30, 2013 6:57 pm

That's the reason for it but the old open system did not need draining only check for water level.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: kstills On: Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:28 am

I kept mine and it's been working fine.

Any recommendations for a typical interval between draining the tank? Or does that depend entirely on the system?
kstills
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: WL 110
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: franco b On: Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:53 am

kstills wrote:I kept mine and it's been working fine.

Any recommendations for a typical interval between draining the tank? Or does that depend entirely on the system?

Most realize the tank needs draining when the relief valve starts dripping. Usually once a year is enough. Turn off the water feed and drain the pressure from the tank at which point it will start glugging as air replaces the water. Drain several buckets more at this point.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Replace old expansion tank ?

PostBy: Sting On: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:03 am

Its a shame how such a simple question can be convoluted by what some folks "think" :mad:



http://websupport.completewatersystems. ... s/21710656

http://websupport.completewatersystems. ... ic-Systems
Sting
 
Other Heating: BurnHAM=NG-gas