Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: Lightning On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:23 pm

I agree with you about the draw down. I think the battery bank scenario is doable under the right circumstances. It's the high power appliances that make it complicated. It would take an enormous amount of "head room" for a battery and inverter system to power an electric stove or run a clothes dryer or electric water tank. It would take a combination of replacing these appliances with ones that burn fuel to make it work. As for going off grid, it wouldn't be realistic to run a huge generator either. It would just use too much fuel. Good luck with your research though, I've also wondered what it would take to be independent with electricity. I've considered a micro hydro system That would use the small runoff stream near my house.
Lightning
 
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Clayton 1537G
Coal Size/Type: Nut/Stove Size Mix

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: McGiever On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:34 pm

The key principal here is to control or manage your homes loads...if you don't do this you must build your own little utility...as has plainly been realized here already. It's called Home Electrical Load Management ;)
I run a propane 10kw generator and w/ family of 5 in an all electric home w/ Load Management. [all electric before coal boiler]
Load management used to save me on my electric bill all year long when using the "demand meter" billing...but that is not available here any longer. :mad:
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:36 pm

..... and around and around we go. Never mind all of the above complications, most large generators are noisy, do you have tolerant neighbors? The above reviews remind me yet again why after spending a lot of money I gave up. Off the grid is for the birds but here are exceptional circumstances.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22


Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: tsb On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:45 pm

Off the grid electricity is like a "trophy wife ".
It sounds like good idea, but it take a lot of maintenance and you
don't get as much out of it as you might think.
tsb
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Binford 2000
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Pioneer top vent
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Saey Hanover II

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:06 pm

Such a smart man and like Fukushima it somehow never works when you need it.Pray for LENR.
Last edited by coalnewbie on Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:07 pm

tsb wrote:Off the grid electricity is like a "trophy wife ".
It sounds like good idea, but it take a lot of maintenance and you
don't get as much out of it as you might think.


I agree! I've studied the "real world" winter output characteristics of numerous local solar panel installations (the data for their output is online for all to see), and there is no way (this side of tripling to better yet, quadrupling the number of solar panels required to break even in a grid tied set-up) that the average Joe will size a residential solar system to get you through the winter months off the grid (at least where I live) without having a good generator on standby. The generator will see a lot of winter use if you only have twice the number of solar panels required to break even when grid tied.

And the batteries thing is a killer. Total battery replacement every 5 to 7 years would send most of us to the poor house. Just purchasing the first adequately sized set of batteries would send me to the poor house. And 3 full days worth of battery supply capacity for those long winter spans with near zilch for decent sunlight is actually not enough to alleviate the need for a generator (by a long shot). In the situations I've seen around here 5 to 6 days worth of total need supplying battery capacity would come close to getting you through December on solar panels alone (if 2 times over-sized vs. grid tied) without a generator. Otherwise you need to become a power managing wizard, and be prepared for outages of electricity.
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (if I ever get it fixed)

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: McGiever On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:26 pm

Off the grid...Amish got it all figured out.

joke...What does it take to keep an Amish lady happy? .............................. Two Mennonite. :rimshot:
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: grumpy On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:47 pm

If you want real back up power get a 1800 rpm diesel genset, everything else is junk..
grumpy
 

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: anthony7812 On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:11 pm

McGiever wrote:Off the grid...Amish got it all figured out.

joke...What does it take to keep an Amish lady happy? .............................. Two Mennonite. :rimshot:


AHAHAHA not too shabby toothy :funny:
anthony7812
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: VanWert VA 400
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III
Coal Size/Type: Buck/Nut/Anthracite

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:25 pm

grumpy wrote:If you want real back up power get a 1800 rpm diesel genset, everything else is junk..


The diesels are impressive, and built to last, but at a cost of twice the propane generators.
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (if I ever get it fixed)

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: grumpy On: Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:29 pm

5k for 10KW what do the others cost..
grumpy
 

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:00 am

1800 rpm diesel genset, everything else is junk..


No, get a Lister at 600rpm that is good for 1MM hours, everything else is junk.
coalnewbie
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93,
Baseburners & Antiques: Invader 2 Wings Best, Glenwood #8 + Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:48 am

grumpy wrote:5k for 10KW what do the others cost..


That is a good price, but most well known diesels are higher than that price.
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (if I ever get it fixed)

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: McGiever On: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:24 am

Perfectly good older generators are taken out and being replaced all the time. Most have seen minimal usage in their lifetime.
I'm very content w/ finding and buying the old propane/ natural gas models that has had the engine already rebuilt sometime earlier.
From the 1950's are what I have now...got them w/ auto transfer switches too.
Also like the liquid-cooled w/ 1800 rpm engine and w/ a full sized muffler...just a low purr can be heard. :)
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Propane generator efficiency: Am I calculating it correctly?

PostBy: lsayre On: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:43 am

I wonder how diesel generator efficiency and cost of operation compare with LPG. Also, how do they compare for noise?
lsayre
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (if I ever get it fixed)