Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: lephturn On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:41 am

OK here is my dilemma. Keystoker has made their KA-4 again and is slightly more expensive than the LL wl110. MY concern about the LL is the low mass it holds vs: the 34gal that the keystoker holds and my heat load swings. That is why I am asking here. I have 2 children that LOVE their hot water. I have a 42gal indirect HWH that Will be zoned and my home ( 3 Zones ) has a heat load of 72,000 btu/h. I am concerned in the mornings 5:30 when heat and hot water needs ramp up that I would need more mass storage than frankly both of my choices that I need to make. A little comfort in opinions is welcome before dropping the coinage. I will be running it year round.

Thank You

4300 for the LL
4700 for the Keystoker
lephturn
 
Stove/Furnace Make: still deciding

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:46 am

I think you alreay know ;) ,you just want reassurance...don't have regrets...get the higher water capacity you know you'll need. 8-)
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: SMITTY On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:49 am

That $400 price difference & top-notch customer service would sway me in the other direction though .... ;)

FYI ... Not saying Keystoker has bad customer service - I honestly have no idea.
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Visit Lehigh Anthracite

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: Rob R. On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:03 pm

Do you require dealer service?
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Coal Size/Type: Rice/buck
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:03 pm

SMITTY wrote:That $400 price difference & top-notch customer service would sway me in the other direction though .... ;)

FYI ... Not saying Keystoker has bad customer service - I honestly have no idea.



Joy of money saved fades fast when needing more water capacity would bring much hot joy.

And don't forget DHW needs can take a big toll...every day many times.

Sorry, but nobodies customer service can fix a customers problem of insuffient size water capacity in an installed boiler on a sub-zero blustry night. :roll:
Last edited by McGiever on Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: SMITTY On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:12 pm

True ... but that extra $350 left over after buying a solution to the problem would sure make me feel better. $50 electric hw tank on Craigslist .... :D
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:16 pm

SMITTY wrote:True ... but that extra $350 left over after buying a solution to the problem would sure make me feel better. $50 electric hw tank on Craigslist .... :D

Please explain solution and where can I learn more.?
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: EarthWindandFire On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:19 pm

They are both very good units. You really can't go wrong with either one, apple to apple as they say.

I think the better choice would be the Leisure Line WL-110 because that unit is multi-fuel capable. The boiler is made by Axeman-Anderson and is a vertical firetube design. The WL-110 can also be ordered with the optional 320 lb coal hopper.
EarthWindandFire
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Leisure Line Lil' Heater.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer model 75.
Other Heating: Oil and Natural Gas.

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:34 pm

The op is not asking which is anyone's favorite and states his main concern is between LL's lower boiler mass vs. KS's greater mass.

So, the question is, do you think the LL w/ the lesser mass can hold up when temps get down and dirty? What do you think?
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: McGiever On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:44 pm

Mass in a boiler is storage of heat.
More mass, more storage of heat.
A definite plus for just the senario that the OP described during a cold wintry 5:30 am. household start.
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: whistlenut On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:55 pm

Having the 42 gallon indirect levels the playing field somewhat, and everyone knows I like bigger reserves. I watch all the OWB guys and the large storage tanks...which do work very well,......(cost plenty, too!),......... but back at the ranch, the advise is that the BTU ratings are about the same, and I know you can flip a coin, and be safe either way. Both are excellent companies, so it is not a quality question, more a pricing one, apparently. I know several folks heating with the LL and are extremely happy. I also know folks with K-2s, older k-4's and K-6's. No one looses, it just matters which capacity you think works best for you. Your choice..... :!:
whistlenut
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AA130's,260's, AHS130&260's,EFM900,GJ&VanWert
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Franks Boiler,Itasca415,NYer130,Van Wert
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Yellow Flame
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Alaska-4,Keystoker-2,
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Alaska,Gibraltor,Keystone,Vc Vigilant 2
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Van Wert, NYer's, Ford,Jensen.
Coal Size/Type: Rice,Buck,Pea,Nut&Stove
Other Heating: Oil HWBB

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: EarthWindandFire On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 1:23 pm

You can ADD mass, you can't add or change the boiler after purchase and installation.
EarthWindandFire
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Leisure Line Lil' Heater.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer model 75.
Other Heating: Oil and Natural Gas.

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: Rob R. On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 1:36 pm

Help Me decide Stoker Boiler / Stoker Stove and brand & Mdl

It took a few years, but I see that you followed through with your plan to start with a stove and install a boiler down the road.

Do you live in the same house that you described in the thread I linked above? How did you arrive at the heat load figure of 72,000 btu's per hour?

Next question...will the coal boiler be installed as a stand-alone unit or will it be tied in with the oil boiler?
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Coal Size/Type: Rice/buck
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: lephturn On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 3:54 pm

I like the LL Better than the KS and even LL Matt Atkinson said in his email to me that both are great units, He is just happy I burn Coal which we all agree is the best, cheapest and all American way to heat. I do not need service and I like the backup oil gun( although I hate Beckett Burners) :idea: It will have to do for the once or twice a year I may need it. I have to figure out a way to create thermal mass w/o costing a fortune. As 1 Person said ,I think A commercial HWH with 1 1/4 taps could be used in a primary loop situation but a residential 1" or 3/4" tap would not unless I use 2 of them set up in parallel to have the proper flow. Anybody that has a superstore tank or know where the cheaper ones to be bought are.. Please chime in
lephturn
 
Stove/Furnace Make: still deciding

Re: Keystoker KA-4 or LL wl110 ?? Buying Friday

PostBy: EarthWindandFire On: Tue Nov 05, 2013 4:08 pm

I agree with you about the Beckett burners, personally I like Riello. They are better quality, made in Italy.
EarthWindandFire
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Leisure Line Lil' Heater.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer model 75.
Other Heating: Oil and Natural Gas.

Visit Lehigh Anthracite