Do Baseheaters Burn Better With Stove Coal?

 
User avatar
BPatrick
Member
Posts: 349
Joined: Wed. Jan. 25, 2012 5:29 pm
Location: Cassopolis, MI
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40 Baseheaters
Coal Size/Type: Stove Coal
Other Heating: Herald Oak No. 18

Post by BPatrick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 9:19 am

When you shut the back flap on a baseheater to put it in baseheater mode, does larger stove coal work better or does it matter. I ask because in baseheater mode, doesn't it slow down the burn. Also would larger pieces of coal allow for it to burn hotter while slowing down the burn. It would seem that the back flap for the baseheater would act as the mpd.


 
User avatar
Sting
Member
Posts: 2983
Joined: Mon. Feb. 25, 2008 4:24 pm
Location: Lower Fox Valley = Wisconsin
Other Heating: OBSO Lennox Pulse "Air Scorcher" burning NG

Post by Sting » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 9:39 am

My last use of stove coal - this fall- was bleak at best -

because I loaded the fire box too full

Now I have a bag of grey (not Black) rocks :mad:

 
Craw4
Member
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed. Feb. 13, 2013 1:28 pm
Location: Central NY
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford #4, Champion Oak 116, Splendid Oak 27 & 29, Glenwood Oak 20,40 and 2- Glenwood Oak 30's
Coal Size/Type: Stove and Nut

Post by Craw4 » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 12:32 pm

If the stove is tight it really shouldn't matter, your just lenghtening the path before it exits up the chimney, I do believe stove will burn hotter than chestnut because it does allow more air space between the pieces of coal. When I first started using my Crawford #4 I used chestnut and then switched to stove, only because of the larger size I didn't get hot coal in the ashpan when I shook it down. I really didn't notice a difference in draft between the two in baseburner mode.

Todd

 
User avatar
BPatrick
Member
Posts: 349
Joined: Wed. Jan. 25, 2012 5:29 pm
Location: Cassopolis, MI
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40 Baseheaters
Coal Size/Type: Stove Coal
Other Heating: Herald Oak No. 18

Post by BPatrick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 2:04 pm

Thanks for the reply, how similar is your Crawford 4 to my Crawford 40. I just got it going yesterday and having a hard time getting temps over 400 in the stove. I know I'm using a new type of stove, the other stove in the house is a direct draft Herald No. 18 and I can run it between 350-650 no problem. The Crawford 40 has a really deep pot and I get it going and fill it with Nut Coal and around 450 I set it into base heater mode. The temp steadily drops and wants to run between 350-375. I need it running warming for this big old farmhouse. I've tried adjusting the mpd as the Herad requires a completely closed mpd while this one is 45 degrees at best. When I set it in base heater mode it drops the temp, no matter what the mpd is set at. I figured it slows the burn because of the base heater mode. I've been running this at 400-450 in direct draft mode as I figure it out because it's cold outside and the low temps for two days are great for warm temps but won't cut it for cold days. I'm guessing that larger stove coal will let the pot breath better. The fire pot is 12" wide but 12" deep in the front and 16" deep in the back.

 
franco b
Site Moderator
Posts: 11416
Joined: Wed. Nov. 05, 2008 5:11 pm
Location: Kent CT
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Post by franco b » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 2:23 pm

Where are you measuring the temperature? If at the top of the barrel then naturally the temp. will drop as more flue gas is directed toward the bottom of the stove. That bypass damper to set it into base mode can also be set to a compromise position or half down and half up.

Where is the bypass in the back of the ash chamber set? Unless that is closed then maximum burn can't be established because maximum air is not going through the coal bed. That round fire pot should be capable of burning like a blow torch if wanted. I assume the primary air is open fairly wide.

What stack temps. are you seeing? How many pounds of coal? Should burn nut or stove, both well.

 
User avatar
dcrane
Verified Business Rep.
Posts: 3128
Joined: Sun. Apr. 22, 2012 9:28 am
Location: Easton, Ma.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Post by dcrane » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 3:18 pm

franco b wrote:Where are you measuring the temperature? If at the top of the barrel then naturally the temp. will drop as more flue gas is directed toward the bottom of the stove. That bypass damper to set it into base mode can also be set to a compromise position or half down and half up.

Where is the bypass in the back of the ash chamber set? Unless that is closed then maximum burn can't be established because maximum air is not going through the coal bed. That round fire pot should be capable of burning like a blow torch if wanted. I assume the primary air is open fairly wide.

What stack temps. are you seeing? How many pounds of coal? Should burn nut or stove, both well.
franco's got this down im sure... it makes sense that in basemode that hot flu gas is heating the base (not the stove top), I have not had the privilege of real world experience with base burners yet but I do not believe your going to get more heat from stove coal (i never did anytime ive tried it)... but its super easy to try it for kicks and you should ;)

 
User avatar
wsherrick
Member
Posts: 3744
Joined: Wed. Jun. 18, 2008 6:04 am
Location: High In The Poconos
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Base Heater, Crawford Base Heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford Base Heater, Glenwood, Stanley Argand
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut, Stove Size

Post by wsherrick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 3:35 pm

I just lit my Crawford 40 for the first time yesterday. I am burning a combination of Nut and Stove Coal in it. With a mere 25 pounds of coal and everything set for a slow burn I am getting a steady 400-450 on the barrel. These stoves have a capacity to make huge volumes of heat.
In fact, I have had to run it with the check damper half open. I have checked it for leaks but there are none. These stoves are just massive.
You will learn how to operate it.
Make sure the check damper is closed. Make sure you have no leaks in the top of the stove or back pipe which could be compromising your draft. Check for leaks with a flame or incense stick. Any leak will draw the flame or smoke right into it. It will be obvious.
Also try letting a charge of coal get fully lighted before you fill it up. Let the temperature rise to around 450 on the barrel and THEN set it to base burner mode. There should be NO Drop in temperature. The stack temperature will drop dramatically however.
At a temperature of 450, the stack temperature on my Crawford behaves very much like the smaller No 9 Glenwood. A stack temperature of 250-275 when the stove is in direct draft, will quickly drop to 110-120 on the stove pipe after being set in base burner mode. The temperature on the stove barrel stays the same. This temperature on the stove pipe is measured two feet from the exhaust collar.
One last thing, is the chimney good with a good draft. Base Heaters need a good draft to work correctly.


 
User avatar
dcrane
Verified Business Rep.
Posts: 3128
Joined: Sun. Apr. 22, 2012 9:28 am
Location: Easton, Ma.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Post by dcrane » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 3:41 pm

and their you have it^^^^ :clap:

 
User avatar
Rob R.
Site Moderator
Posts: 17980
Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Location: Chazy, NY
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Jr

Post by Rob R. » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 3:46 pm

What are the dimensions of the firepot?

Edit: Nevermind...someone pointed me to your previous post.

 
Craw4
Member
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed. Feb. 13, 2013 1:28 pm
Location: Central NY
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford #4, Champion Oak 116, Splendid Oak 27 & 29, Glenwood Oak 20,40 and 2- Glenwood Oak 30's
Coal Size/Type: Stove and Nut

Post by Craw4 » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 5:01 pm

The loading door in the 40 is a little bigger and under the top dome on my #4 its flat and there's just the typical round plate that you can remove with a handle where I believe yours is recesed and has a warming grate in it, otherwise same stove. Like William said you must have some leaks or just not as strong a draft because like William my stove is very controllable, I can run it down around 300 or have run it up as high as 650-700 when its been bitter cold and windy, it is a heat monster if you want it to be. I do use stove coal in mine tho, I like it much better in this stove than nut. Like William said make sure your check damper is closed it has quite an effect on your draft up thru your coal.

 
User avatar
BPatrick
Member
Posts: 349
Joined: Wed. Jan. 25, 2012 5:29 pm
Location: Cassopolis, MI
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40 Baseheaters
Coal Size/Type: Stove Coal
Other Heating: Herald Oak No. 18

Post by BPatrick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 5:03 pm

Thanks everyone. Your input is very helpful. First, I believe I have good draft. I lined a chimney with 6" flex liner and there is a double wall 90 degree off the stove and 3' of double wall then a double wall 90 degree heading into the chimney and into the 6" flex liner. Draft seemed good and with an old leaky farmhouse, I cannot see how it wouldn't be good. I'm burning Nut Coal and it has smaller and bigger pieces in it. This stove was completely restored and purchased from Emery at the Stove Hospital. They've been great to work with. William, on your Crawford, does the collar have a seal between the two pieces by the back pipe on the top. There is a hole where the lever can be turned to completely shut, or base heater mode, or open, direct draft mode. When I got my first fire going I noticed I could see light at a couple of points where the two collars mated together for the base heater flap to be opened or closed. Also, the hole for the flap was bigger than it needed to be and where the back pipe (oval) meets the collar that mounts it to the stove, there are two of these, I'm referring to the one on the top, it isn't completely sealed and you can see daylight. Would this be affecting my draw. My other stove has a great draft and isn't even at the largest part of the house and rocks. I got this as to put out heat and longer burn times. I'm not used to having an mpd set at 45 degree angle. I'm wondering if that is part of the problem. I'm shaking down correctly and getting the stove up to around 500 before setting the base heater mode. During the running of this stove in direct draft mode, I'm getting 400 degrees with the ash pan door 1/4 open, open all the way I get 475, it doesn't want to get hotter, if I open the mpd all the way it gets hotter but putting way too much heat up the chimney. I'm not used to struggling with a stove and I'm wondering if the air leaking into the back pipe is part of the problem.

 
User avatar
freetown fred
Member
Posts: 30293
Joined: Thu. Dec. 31, 2009 12:33 pm
Location: Freetown,NY 13803
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut

Post by freetown fred » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 5:06 pm

You betcha it is :)

 
User avatar
wsherrick
Member
Posts: 3744
Joined: Wed. Jun. 18, 2008 6:04 am
Location: High In The Poconos
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood Base Heater, Crawford Base Heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford Base Heater, Glenwood, Stanley Argand
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut, Stove Size

Post by wsherrick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 5:33 pm

Try running it with the ash pan damper open a little more and more and see what happens. The little air leak around the damper handle on the back pipe shouldn't have too much of an effect. The other leaks will however. Do the flame test and find them. Then seal them up.
One other place to look is the base plate that the ash pan sits on. Make sure that there is no air leaking around it into the base heating chamber below. If it is there are several ways to fix it. But let's find out if it leaking there first.
Try leaving the pipe damper open. Nothing is standard on any stove installation. You have to experiment and see what works best.
oh, another question. Do you have a barometric damper on this stove? If you do, get rid of it.
Also, you didn't tell me if you had the check damper open or closed. It must be closed.
I know that the stove is more than okay if Emery restored it, so, we just have to figure out what is going on here.

 
User avatar
BPatrick
Member
Posts: 349
Joined: Wed. Jan. 25, 2012 5:29 pm
Location: Cassopolis, MI
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40 Baseheaters
Coal Size/Type: Stove Coal
Other Heating: Herald Oak No. 18

Post by BPatrick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 5:39 pm

William you know your base heaters. I was talking to Emery at the Stove Hospital and he said maybe the base plate isn't mated to the surface tightly, could of happened during shipping or moving stove, and see if that solves the problem. He also said that the pipes might be leaking too much air and slowing down the draft. I will address what I can when I get home. I will give an update in a few hours when I've had a chance to see whats going on with the stove. Thanks again EVERYONE.

 
chrisbuick
Member
Posts: 216
Joined: Thu. May. 22, 2008 2:24 pm
Location: Acworth, NH
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood No. 6 BH, Crawfords No.2 & 3 BH, Hub Heater 115 Circulator, Crawford Wood 19
Other Heating: Oil

Post by chrisbuick » Thu. Nov. 14, 2013 9:06 pm

Recently I was down at Emery's to bring him my Crawford #3 for restoration.

We had a discussion about Crawfords during which we looked at yours being run for testing in the showroom.

Brandon mentioned that Crawford baseheaters could be sluggish in their operation, never completely developing a good draw.

I discussed it with Emery on the side, and he recommended using stove coal to 'open-up' the burn.

So, they were aware of this problem before it shipped.

Just thought I'd pass this along - Chris


Post Reply

Return to “Antiques, Baseburners, Kitchen Stoves, Restorations & Modern Reproductions”