coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: KRAZEESAM On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:18 am

I just installed a leisure line wl 110 boiler and upgraded to the 320 # hopper to give us more "freedom" from having to "feed the fire" like we constantly had to do with our old wood boiler. The leisure line boiler does a great job heating the house so far, but my problem is
that once the coal feeds straight down (in the hopper) onto the feeder we run out of coal and the fire goes out...even though the hopper its still 3/4 full! Is there an auger or shaker attachment that will keep the coal feeding into to burner? Getting a little frustrated having to run down to shovel coal around in the hopper a couple times a day...kind of defeats the idea of paying extra for a larger hopper. Anyone know where I can get a "fix"?
KRAZEESAM
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisureline
Stove/Furnace Model: WK 110 boiler

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Matthaus On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:39 am

We have seen this issue with some coal, even with our 150# Pioneer hopper that is 45* on three sides. I guess we made the unit too smooth, you need a little vibration, try putting a piece of chewing gum on one of the blades in the combustion fan... Just kidding! :D
But seriously, if you are so inclined you can get various motors here : http://www.surplustraders.net/category/ ... OTORS-0185 That will make enough vibration to rid your hopper of the pesky tunnel. Simply get a small inverter (200 Watt is plenty) power it on the feed motor circuit and the vibrator will run every time the unit feeds coal. Just mount the vibration motor on the back of the hopper and that should shake it enough. Be aware this is a science project and not for those who lack patience, but it will offer hours of entertainment while providing a business opportunity to the one who solves the issue. :)
Matthaus
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110 Dual Fuel, natural gas
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Leisure Line Lil' Heater (rental house)
Coal Size/Type: Rice and Buckwheat Anthracite

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: whistlenut On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:40 am

The 'angle of repose' is not your friend with coal hoppers. I does not matter what you do unless you have an auger that dumps directly in the center of the hopper. Axeman, EFM, GJ, and Van wert all have augers, but it would take a series of auger to make you situation better. Most of us assume the responsibility of checking on the units once a day, and ash and more fuel are two of the things necessary to deal with. You can add an auger, but expect another grand at the low end and many more for a complete automation. A shaker/vibratory unit would cause issues itself due to 'fines migration'. Do not think it has not been tried, and used successfully, just understand that you may end up with more work than it may be worth. You could build a direct funnel type of hopper for total gravity operation, however height requirements may nix that plan. It cannot take more than 2 minutes to cut open a 40 or 50 lb bag and throw it into the hopper, so evaluate your priorities and then make your move. :idea: Many times the 'KISS' philosophy is the logical answer.
whistlenut
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AA130's,260's, AHS130&260's,EFM900,GJ&VanWert
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Franks Boiler,Itasca415,NYer130,Van Wert
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Yellow Flame
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Alaska-4,Keystoker-2,
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Alaska,Gibraltor,Keystone,Vc Vigilant 2
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Van Wert, NYer's, Ford,Jensen.
Coal Size/Type: Rice,Buck,Pea,Nut&Stove
Other Heating: Oil HWBB

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Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Rob R. On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:47 am

Is the coal damp?
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Pacowy On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:59 am

Yes, Rob beat me to it; I was going to ask about whether the coal is damp and does it have a lot of fines/undersized pieces?

And Matt or Dave, if this has come up before, has anybody tried slipplate/graphite paint on the inside of the hopper? I used it when I kept coal in gravity wagons. I can certify that it works after attempting to stand on it and being discharged from the wagon. :oops2: :shh:

Mike
Pacowy
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: H.B. Smith 350 Mills boiler/EFM 85R stoker
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/anthracite

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:07 pm

Pacowy wrote:Yes, Rob beat me to it; I was going to ask about whether the coal is damp and does it have a lot of fines/undersized pieces?

And Matt or Dave, if this has come up before, has anybody tried slipplate/graphite paint on the inside of the hopper? I used it when I kept coal in gravity wagons. I can certify that it works after attempting to stand on it and being discharged from the wagon. :oops2: :shh:

Mike



The issue is the coal sticks to itself and supports itself by binding together.
Flyer5
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Leisure Line Pioneer

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Pacowy On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:00 pm

Flyer5 wrote:The issue is the coal sticks to itself and supports itself by binding together.


Yes, that was why I was asking about the wet coal and the fines/undersized pieces, which seem like they might contribute to that type of binding.

Mike
Pacowy
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: H.B. Smith 350 Mills boiler/EFM 85R stoker
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/anthracite

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: KRAZEESAM On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:21 pm

So would oiled coal work better? I did notice that the bagged coal that I started out with (non oil) was very wet. Like I said, if the hopper feeding is a known problem why spend the extra money for an oversized hopper if it still has to be stirred once or twice a day?
KRAZEESAM
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisureline
Stove/Furnace Model: WK 110 boiler

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: dcrane On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:28 pm

KRAZEESAM wrote:So would oiled coal work better? I did notice that the bagged coal that I started out with (non oil) was very wet. Like I said, if the hopper feeding is a known problem why spend the extra money for an oversized hopper if it still has to be stirred once or twice a day?


I would have done exactly the same as you and got the larger hopper! I want photo's of everything from exterior pics around the unit, pics of inside hopper (empty) or as empty as possible :cry: ), pics looking down top, pics looking in front door at hopper angle/burn grate... maybe Dave can post me up some photo's or PM me them as well. TY
Last edited by dcrane on Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
dcrane
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Pacowy On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:29 pm

I've never used oiled coal so I'll leave that to someone else to answer. If your coal is very wet coming out of the bag my suggestion would be to try getting some of the moisture out before putting it in the hopper. I think there are other threads where people describe their experiences with things like dumping the bags into 5-gallon pails with small drain holes in the bottom a couple of days ahead of time.

Mike
Pacowy
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: H.B. Smith 350 Mills boiler/EFM 85R stoker
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/anthracite

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:00 pm

KRAZEESAM wrote:So would oiled coal work better? I did notice that the bagged coal that I started out with (non oil) was very wet. Like I said, if the hopper feeding is a known problem why spend the extra money for an oversized hopper if it still has to be stirred once or twice a day?


It is not much of an issue with dry coal. Last year I went from Friday to Wed with my t stats down to 50* while on vacation. I fed very well with dry coal. My neighbor said he probably could have gone another day but did not want to chance it. So the large hopper is a benefit when using dryer coal.
Flyer5
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line WL110
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Leisure Line Pioneer

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: Rob R. On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:02 pm

Wet coal can cause feeding issues regardless of the hopper design. Get yourself a container to stage the coal in and allow it to air dry. My brother uses a large plastic tote and transfers the coal to the hopper with a pail.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: kstills On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:11 pm

Odd, I've never had this problem with the 200lb hopper.

Speaking of which, these old hoppers work extremely well, and while it would be tough to let it go, I suppose I could let you have mine in exchange for yours.... ;)
kstills
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: WL 110
Stove/Furnace Make: Leisure Line

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: McGiever On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:42 pm

The ACME Hopper Thumper...

You take a rubber mallet and attach the very end of its wood handle to a pivot or hinge and then attach that pivot near to the upper rim of hopper hanging downward...
next fasten a sturdy length of cord to the mallet just below the rubber head and route the cord to your choice...the left or right side of your Strato Lounger using a number of small pulleys as to allow for ease in pulling cord with little binding to apply a series of jerks and Thump that coal into it's place. :P
McGiever
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: HARMAN MAGNUM
Hand Fed Coal Stove: RADIANT HOME AIR BLAST
Baseburners & Antiques: OUR GLENWOOD 111 BASEBURNER "1908"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE, NUT-STOVE / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek

Re: coal hopper needs an auger/shaker

PostBy: EarthWindandFire On: Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:16 pm

Most of the guys answering this thread have auger type boilers etc which don't experience this problem. As a Leisure Line stove owner, I can attest and sympathize to the frustration with the hopper. Matt had the best reply, a small device attached to the bin may indeed be the answer.

During the coldest part of winter, I stuff the bin at 7:00 am and RUSH home at 5:30 pm before the stove runs out of fuel. Several times I was almost too late, the surface tension of the rice coal causes it to bind and leave 40 lbs of rice stuck against the bin - useless.

A stove or boiler in the basement could benefit from a tall narrow bin, not a wide deep bin as installed.
EarthWindandFire
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Leisure Line Lil' Heater.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer model 75.
Other Heating: Oil and Natural Gas.

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