Restoring my new to me 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: franco b On: Tue May 20, 2014 5:32 pm

2.5 cords of good hardwood could weigh as much as 10,000 pounds, plus there is the 1000 pounds of bio bricks. To equal that i think you will need at least 3 tons of coal.
franco b
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: dcrane On: Wed May 21, 2014 6:34 am

franco b wrote:2.5 cords of good hardwood could weigh as much as 10,000 pounds, plus there is the 1000 pounds of bio bricks. To equal that i think you will need at least 3 tons of coal.


Im not sure the house size/insulation but it seems to me almost anyone would burn at least 2 ton if they burn 24/7 (which they should if your a coal burner, it becomes a pretty simple part of your whole lifestyle which is why the bunch of us coal heads are here together). A very important thing to watch before you purchase an entire load for the year is the brand/mine/batch of coal your buying (cheaper is NOT necessarily better) and burning good quality coal VS a crappie batch is like NIGHT VS DAY! (another reason we are all here together on this forum because we discover the "good mines", the "good deals" VS the *censored*! LOL)

I know last year blaschak was pretty damb good in your neck of the woods and coalvet had a handle on a well priced vendor. Im also sure Franco can lead you to some good suppliers in Conn. (just be aware that its important to buy coal that is known to be of good quality!)
dcrane
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Wed May 21, 2014 7:50 am

The person I have in mind sells Blasack in 40 lb. bags 375 a pallet at 2400 lbs. a pallet of nut size.
I am not looking to heat house over 68 to 70 max on first floor and high 50's to low 60's second floor as all bedrooms and I don't sleep well in a warm room.

House 1874 1200 sq. ft. of heated living area 2/3 first floor 1 third bedrooms second floor.
Windows single pane wood but in good condition and 3M window film and thermal drapes in winter opened by where I am and where the sun is but closed at night.

As far as heating goes I am a frugal guy and no problem wearing thermal under wear or lined Levi's. Last few years even when burning wood all day it goes like this.

Starting in the morning crank it at 400 to 500 for a few hours then damp down when I go out to the shop and it coasts down to 350 for the entire day.
At 4 pm toss in some wood and crank it up for a few hours and bring the house up to 68-70 until 9 pm then damp down for the night.

I realize from reading here that coal is slow to react and my plan with coal is hold off as long as I can before burning coal preferably until a weekend when not in the shop during the day and just try to keep it going at 400 stove top constantly before getting creative. I would think how fast things change and how easy it is will be subject to my installation chimney etc. learning to use the stack damper and air controls. I have a stove top thermometer stack insert type thermometer and draft gauge.

I have read there are a few ways to start a coal fire and some like charcoal and some like wood. Is this stove partial to one way or another?
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Fri Sep 12, 2014 10:26 pm

Ok it is getting closer to ground zero for me to get the 404 ready and the wood stove out. Tomorrow is the planned day to remove the woodstove and want to install the 404 the following one though should not need it for probably 2 months better to be ready than not. I have a friend that owes me a favor and came by to see what they were getting into and suggested to put a tab at the top and bottom of the hinge boss to capture it and use a bolt rather than weld in a pin but to use new tabs everywhere and quit trying to drill the original ones just right.

Does this seem like a good idea?

Second item. The fact that I might want to burn a little bit of wood at the beginning and end of the heating season would adding a secondary air inlet tube and or a baffle make any sense?. Or do I suck it up and burn the wood as a coal starter over several years and buy more coal with money that does not currently exist?

All ideas welcome but time to get going on this.
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: michaelanthony On: Fri Sep 12, 2014 10:49 pm

ddahlgren wrote:..............

Second item. The fact that I might want to burn a little bit of wood at the beginning and end of the heating season would adding a secondary air inlet tube and or a baffle make any sense?. Or do I suck it up and burn the wood as a coal starter over several years and buy more coal with money that does not currently exist?

All ideas welcome but time to get going on this.


If the glass panels in the front are air tight, could you replace a couple with a smaller piece to allow for over fire air while you burn wood? Possibly fabricate a couple metal ones with sliding or dial type adjustable air inlets. my 2 cents.
michaelanthony
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Vigilant 2310, gold marc box, vogelzang pot belly coat rack
Coal Size/Type: Pea, and a little nut
Other Heating: Very cold FHA oil furnace

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: coalvet On: Sat Sep 13, 2014 7:24 am

The 404 already has secondary air holes around the fire pot ledge. It burns wood just fine the way it is!
coalvet
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane Model 404
Coal Size/Type: Nut
Other Heating: NG Boiler

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Sat Sep 13, 2014 9:56 am

coalvet wrote:The 404 already has secondary air holes around the fire pot ledge. It burns wood just fine the way it is!


How clean does it burn wood? Not looking for perfect on wood as not designed for it but to run maybe an hour or two to take the chill off in spring and fall. I just don't want any creosote to deal with.

I see you have a 404 what do you feel is the high to low range as far as being able to run it in lbs. per day?
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: coalvet On: Sat Sep 13, 2014 3:52 pm

If you throttle the stove way down you will get some creosote, just keep a normal stove temp(325-400 degrees) and you should be fine. With coal expect between 25 to 40 lbs per day.
coalvet
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane Model 404
Coal Size/Type: Nut
Other Heating: NG Boiler

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Sat Sep 13, 2014 4:27 pm

coalvet wrote:If you throttle the stove way down you will get some creosote, just keep a normal stove temp(325-400 degrees) and you should be fine. With coal expect between 25 to 40 lbs per day.


If I waste a little wood I am ok with that and debating if I want to order a cord for 2015-2016 and give it more time to season than the claimed 'seasoned wood that is not.

Going by your coal use estimate my range of heat delivery is between 10k btu/hr and just under 20k btu/hr pushing it to 40 or a bit more per day. Going by memory you are not that far from me and know nothing about your house. It might not matter if just using temps and house construction. I have a 1874 house that is pretty loose and hard to seal. with 3M window film and drawn drapes at night and open to gain solar I burn about 2 1/2 cords of wood in a pretty good stove along with around 800 to 1000 lbs bio/eco bricks and did fine. I am trying to figure out to what that translates to with coal to see if I buy more wood or more coal and when to light ( want average temps0 to stay warm easily and not over heat house and waste coal. What are your patterns as to when to light and how much load in btu to cover?
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: coalvet On: Sun Sep 14, 2014 7:31 am

I have a very easy to heat 1100 sqft. house. Usually I start coal around the first of Dec. Based on the description of your house you will be running the Crane a lot hotter than I probably will so plan on 2 to 3 ton of coal at least. I burn wood at the beginning of the heating season and at the end so I only use about a ton of coal per year.
coalvet
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane Model 404
Coal Size/Type: Nut
Other Heating: NG Boiler

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Sun Sep 14, 2014 8:04 am

I am thinking of picking up another half ton locally to the just shy of 2 1/2 I have on hand. I am thinking I will have to load 3 times a day to keep it hot enough to do the job though ok with 68 to 70 and if 65 at night ok with that too. I had to run the woodstove pretty hard during the colder months to be honest as the btu per hour makes more sense to me. I am guessing the stove temps will have to be similar as the stoves the same approximate size. That means 500 to 550 during the coldest parts of winter and 400 in the milder ones.
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:24 pm

I see charcoal is on sale right now and don't have the stove back together yet. Will 1 13 lb bag fill a 404 up enough to get a coal fire started? If yes was going to bet 6 bags as only 3.50 a bag at the grocery store and hoping it won't take more trys than that to lean how to use the stove.
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: michaelanthony On: Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:32 pm

ddahlgren wrote:I see charcoal is on sale right now and don't have the stove back together yet. Will 1 13 lb bag fill a 404 up enough to get a coal fire started? If yes was going to bet 6 bags as only 3.50 a bag at the grocery store and hoping it won't take more trys than that to lean how to use the stove.


My stoves are similar in coal bed size and I use 3 or 4 lbs of "matchlite" spread across the grates and viola!
michaelanthony
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Vigilant 2310, gold marc box, vogelzang pot belly coat rack
Coal Size/Type: Pea, and a little nut
Other Heating: Very cold FHA oil furnace

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: ddahlgren On: Thu Sep 25, 2014 2:20 pm

So 4 bags plenty of chances then from what you are saying. That is about all that will fit in a grocery cart anyway.
ddahlgren
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404

Re: Restoring my new to me 404

PostBy: michaelanthony On: Thu Sep 25, 2014 4:00 pm

ddahlgren wrote:So 4 bags plenty of chances then from what you are saying. That is about all that will fit in a grocery cart anyway.


If you're waiting for the cold weather to start her up you will have plenty for next season as well, that 404 won't go out unless you want her to. I think I bought 2 bags last season for 2 stoves and only shut down for a cleaning.
michaelanthony
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Vigilant 2310, gold marc box, vogelzang pot belly coat rack
Coal Size/Type: Pea, and a little nut
Other Heating: Very cold FHA oil furnace