Problems with kaa-2 temps.

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: oliver power On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:54 pm

EarthWindandFire wrote:I've read this thread with keen interest because my house is the same size as the OP. It's clear that with significant heat loss, the Kaa-2 is not large enough for even a small home if not well-insulated.

So, what does the OP do for next year?

Should he sell the Kaa-2 and buy the larger Kaa-4 or better yet, the KA-6. This board has taught me that size matters, and you can never have enough btu's. I would rather complain about unburned coal in the ash pan from an idling boiler than be in a situation where the house is cold because the 5 or 6 thousand dollar boiler I bought is too small.

Just posting an opinion.....
Going bigger, and bigger in boiler size does not even make sense. Like I said, 80% of heat loss is through attic. He has NO insulation in his attic. By restricting his flow going up stairs, his room temps jump to 72*. If he insulates his attic, That Kaa-2 will EASILY heat his little 900 square foot house. And do it on a fraction of the coal he now uses. The Kaa-2 keeps my 1700 square foot (average insulation) house at 73*. And that's below zero, up on a windy hill. If he does the work himself, what's it going to cost? $400.00, maybe $500.00 in insulation. It's a one time deal..........
oliver power
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: KEYSTOKER Kaa-2
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93 & 30-95, Vigilant (pre-Vigilant-II)
Baseburners & Antiques: MANY (Mostly when burning wood)
Stove/Furnace Make: HITZER / KEYSTOKER
Stove/Furnace Model: 50-93 & 30-95 , Kaa-2

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:27 pm

kstills,After 15 + yrs of being warm in our house heated with wood at 72*-74*,there is no way i am wearing a hoodie in the house to keep warm.Insulate,yes,if installed heating unit is too small for the few frigid days that come our way,i would chose to supplement with electric heaters to maintain the level of warmth i have chosen to maintain my cold weather sanity. It's cold outside,no reason to be cold inside too. So the electric costs an extra $100.00 for the winter,that is far cheaper than to swap boilers just for those 5-15 day/nites per winter that the boiler comes up short.Burn coal,stay warm.
windyhill4.2
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1960 EFM520 installed in truck box
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: Carbon12 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:32 pm

Didn't he say there is no attic insulation and that adding any was impossible because of the type of roof he has???
Carbon12
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KA-6
Coal Size/Type: Rice/Anthracite
Other Heating: Heat Pump/Forced Hot Air Oil Furnace

Visit Lehigh Anthracite

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: waldo lemieux On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:44 pm

Carbon12 wrote:Didn't he say there is no attic insulation and that adding any was impossible because of the type of roof he has???


Thats simply not true. Difficult? maybe ,but not impossible....
waldo lemieux
 
Stove/Furnace Make: efm
Stove/Furnace Model: s-20

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:53 pm

waldo lemieux wrote:
Carbon12 wrote:Didn't he say there is no attic insulation and that adding any was impossible because of the type of roof he has???


Thats simply not true. Difficult? maybe ,but not impossible....

You can always tear the ceiling down, insulate & install new ceiling,not that terribly expensive on that small house.There are other ways to get the job done too,my example just shows that it is not impossible & doesn't have to be very expensive,like replacing the boiler would be,And it would cut fuel use too which wouldn't happen by just installing a bigger boiler.
windyhill4.2
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1960 EFM520 installed in truck box
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: Carbon12 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:56 pm

I read back and found that he said there is no attic.
Carbon12
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KA-6
Coal Size/Type: Rice/Anthracite
Other Heating: Heat Pump/Forced Hot Air Oil Furnace

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: Pacowy On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:11 pm

windyhill4.2 wrote:And it would cut fuel use too which wouldn't happen by just installing a bigger boiler.


All else equal bigger boilers tend to have larger heat exchange surfaces and may be capable of producing a given quantity of usable btu's with less coal than a smaller boiler would require.

Mike
Pacowy
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: H.B. Smith 350 Mills boiler/EFM 85R stoker
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/anthracite

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: EarthWindandFire On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:15 pm

He may live in a New England style Cape like myself. These type of houses have no attic and lack any reasonable means to add insulation without gutting the entire second floor. Women and children don't like having the walls and ceilings ripped out very much, it makes them cry and nag you to death.
EarthWindandFire
 
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Leisure Line Lil' Heater.
Other Heating: Oil Furnace and Kerosene Heaters.

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:26 pm

No attic, then pull the ceiling & insulate the rafters,but i think he just doesn't understand the attic term. Attic's are not all designed to walk around up there,some you have to crawl,but most all buildings have an air space considered an attic. Pacowy,i wasn't inferring that a bigger boiler would use more fuel,but that if left uninsulated will use more fuel as it will be able to pump all the heat needed,still clear as mud ?? that's my best explanation,sorry. Most women & children & me do not like being cold in the house either. :idea: Tear the roof off & insulate it that way,roof probably needs updated anyway. :)
windyhill4.2
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1960 EFM520 installed in truck box
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: farrell2k On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:59 pm

EarthWindandFire wrote:I've read this thread with keen interest because my house is the same size as the OP. It's clear that with significant heat loss, the Kaa-2 is not large enough for even a small home if not well-insulated.

So, what does the OP do for next year?

Should he sell the Kaa-2 and buy the larger Kaa-4 or better yet, the KA-6. This board has taught me that size matters, and you can never have enough btu's. I would rather complain about unburned coal in the ash pan from an idling boiler than be in a situation where the house is cold because the 5 or 6 thousand dollar boiler I bought is too small.

Just posting an opinion.....


Insulate, that's what :) I had an old oil boiler in there that was some 40k btu bigger, and never had issues with that. The money it costs to have the place properly insulated is money well spent. Having someone blow in cellulose from the outside should not be more than a few grand. I pay on average $135/mo to heat and do hot water for this house at 70 for 90% of the winter, 3x less than oil. It is only the single digit temps and below that make the kaa2 struggle.

and yes, I live in one of those houses without an attic as well. even worse, i have an aluminium roof.
farrell2k
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Kaa2
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: KA2

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:06 pm

farrell2k,an aluminum roof ? no attic or top crawl space at all ?? what kind of house is this anyway ??
windyhill4.2
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1960 EFM520 installed in truck box
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: farrell2k On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:08 pm

windyhill4.2 wrote:No attic, then pull the ceiling & insulate the rafters,but i think he just doesn't understand the attic term. Attic's are not all designed to walk around up there,some you have to crawl,but most all buildings have an air space considered an attic. Pacowy,i wasn't inferring that a bigger boiler would use more fuel,but that if left uninsulated will use more fuel as it will be able to pump all the heat needed,still clear as mud ?? that's my best explanation,sorry. Most women & children & me do not like being cold in the house either. :idea: Tear the roof off & insulate it that way,roof probably needs updated anyway. :)


No attic. All I'd have to do is rent a blower from home depot, cut a few holes in the ceiling and blow it between the rafters. that's not a hard job, but a messy one. A job for the summer months.
farrell2k
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Kaa2
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: KA2

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: farrell2k On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:09 pm

windyhill4.2 wrote:farrell2k,an aluminum roof ? no attic or top crawl space at all ?? what kind of house is this anyway ??


An old miners house. Thankfully it is studed!
farrell2k
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Kaa2
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: KA2

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: KLook On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:34 pm

You really need that roof to breath some, blowing in anything is not a good idea until you get some opinions about your kind of structure. I built houses for 27 years and can offer some suggestions and so can many other in here. Just give us some info and maybe some pictures to go by. There is a wealth of info in the members here, even if we don't always agree. ;)

Kevin
KLook
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Harman VF 3000
Coal Size/Type: rice, bagged, Blaschak
Stove/Furnace Make: Harman (Back In Maine)
Stove/Furnace Model: VF 3000

Re: Problems with kaa-2 temps.

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:37 pm

Don't wait for the HOT summer months to do it ,you will sweat your self into a real mess :) KLook,what are you talking about ? even IF we don't always agree ?? ;)
windyhill4.2
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1960 EFM520 installed in truck box
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both

Visit Lehigh Anthracite