Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: SMITTY On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:36 pm

Got a John Deere G110, 54" 3-blade deck with a PowerFlo bagger, & a Kohler CV730S-0020 v-twin engine. Decided to go with a new engine rather than rebuild - don't have the time or space, and don't need the aggravation of carting the block to the machine shop an hour drive round trip.

After lots of research, it looks like the Briggs & Stratton 44Q777-3137-G5 seems to be the one that fits. I need a 1" x 3-5/32" shaft (aka 1" x 80mm ... or 25.375mm x 80mm) with a .25" (6mm) keyway, drilled and tapped 7/16 -20, 1.5" deep. PTO face is 10" with four .36" (9mm) through holes.

I would have preferred a Honda or Kawasaki, but nothing matched up as closely as the Briggs. Another Kohler is out of the question - 180 hours on this one and it's burning oil. :mad: Besides, they're all stupid expensive.

Found a Briggs 44Q777-3137-G5 for decent money - under $700 shipped, brand new. On the fence ..... should I pull the trigger, or keep dumping $4 a quart oil in this thing every time I mow? These tractors are for sale used from $2,500 - $3,500 with MANY more hours than I've got, so a new engine would certainly be cheaper than finding another tractor. These are fairly rare to start with (only made '04 & '05), so finding a good parts one is next to impossible.

I would really like a zero turn, as I really have no use for a tractor - my Polaris ATV is my workhorse. If anyone wants to trade (I know ... but had to ask!) for one that needs a little work, shoot me a PM.

Also let me know if that Briggs engine is a POS! ;) Not too much info on it out there on reliability.
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: Rob R. On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:11 pm

Before you order a new engine I think you should diagnose the source of the oil consumption.

Based on the plugs, does it look like it is consuming oil in both cylinders or only one?

Those engines are known for having a blown head gasket that causes oil consumption...and usually it is in one cylinder. They can also have problems with the breather that causes pressure to build in the crankcase.

Figure out what the problem is.
Rob R.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: 009to090 On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:20 pm

Yeah Smitty, I would look into rebuilding the Kohler.
Check your cyl and rings first, to see if they are ok. Parts should be very easy to come by.

I have a CH23S mounted on my Kubota.
I do have a hydro-lifter on it that crapped out, but the cyl is good. :idea:
I am getting ready to tear into it now.
009to090
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520 HighBoy
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: DVC-500 x 2
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Rice


Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: SMITTY On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:16 pm

Well I'll be damned!! You were right Rob - one plug blacker than *censored*, other plug pure white! NICE!! :punk: Should be alot cheaper than a new engine, that's for sure. I owe you a pile of beers between this and the boiler install. :lol:

I think your motor Chris is very similar to mine ... unless it's another one I'm thinking of .... Is the CH an opposed twin? For some reason I'm thinking of the old Kohlers that used to go in Craftsman tractors back in the 80's ....

SO sick of all my *censored* breaking lately that I almost jumped the gun and bought that Briggs without even pulling the plugs. I've gotta relax ... :|
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:43 pm

Kohler command are actually a pretty good engine,as Rob stated they do have a problem with blown head gaskets,most often the right cylinder.The B/S engine you were looking to buy new is not quite as good as the command. I would guess you have had this engine backfire on shutdown,that is a common thing with any OHV small engine . The proper way to shut these OHV engines off is at full throttle,the reason for this is the engine is spinning fast,you turn the key off which shuts the fuel solenoid off preventing gas to be drawn into the engine,but because you had the throttle wide open the engine keeps spinning & exhausts the unburnt gases out of the engine & out of the muffler.The wide open shut down will stop the shut down backfiring ,it does work but it is hard to convince us mechanics that full throttle shut downs are proper. I now practice this method on all OHV engines & no longer have them backfire. Very good possibility that 1 blown head gasket is the oil burning issue.That would be an easier & cheaper fix than to replace the engine,good luck. CV = Command vertical crank , CH = Command horizontal crank.
windyhill4.2
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Other Heating: Oaktree OWB 600K

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: SMITTY On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:09 pm

Thanks for the info. Forgot about the vertical engines! I just learned that throttle trick recently - I used to let it pop when I shut it down, because I'd have a laugh with the neighbors over it. Let it pop one too many times, I guess.

On hot days I can tell it's all carboned up in there. When you first fire it up on a hot day, I get a loud detonation KNOCK as it fires up - that's more than likely what did in the gasket. Shitty fuel, carbon ... or both. Shitty fuel is a given around here. I'll have to check the flywheel key too, just in case.

I have to admit, I was pretty pissed off burning that much oil in an engine with 180 hours on it. At least I won't be pulling the engine, thank God. Like I don't have enough crap to do ... :D

Gonna pull the beast out and do some more diag. on it before I start blindly buying parts. Already found one of my headlamps welded to the exhaust. :roll: Friggin thing is falling apart on me. Only 9 years old too. :x
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:15 pm

If you can pressurize the cylinder at top dead center with the valve cover off you should be able to see/hear the air leak. Forgot to mention that Commands like a 10w30 QUALITY oil to keep the hydraulic lifters working top notch .
windyhill4.2
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Other Heating: Oaktree OWB 600K

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: SMITTY On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:43 pm

Been running Amsoil Formula 4-stroke 10W-30/30 in it for past couple years. In the beginning (right after break-in) I was running Honda HP-4 10w-40 bike oil .... then I ran some 20w-50 one season ... then ran 5w-30 for about 30 hours, just because I wanted to get rid of it ... and a few other oils in between. Nothing but synthetics since break-in though. I was just using whatever I had on hand to save a trip to the store (and $$$).

Yeah gonna get her out of there sometime when the weather gets a little better and do a compression/leakdown. Pretty sure it's the head gasket judging by the sudden high oil consumption, but never hurts to check. Don't think I've had the shroud off in 9 years that I can remember, so blowing out the fins will be in order too.
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:11 pm

Can't beat Amsoil 4-Stroke,good choice.I took a Snap-on blow nozzle,removed the end ,installed a 12" piece of brake line & curved it just right,it gets used on every engine i service,every year i do about 100 tractors plus other equipment,i've figured out where to blow air in to clean fins without removing the shroud.When you get your engine fixed up & don't do the :blowup: anymore it should last many,many more hours.
windyhill4.2
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Other Heating: Oaktree OWB 600K

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: SMITTY On: Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:32 pm

I use a cheapo angled nozzle - gets in there pretty good. Very rarely do I have to remove every shroud for cleaning ... unless a family of mice got in there. That happens alot.

Thanks for the tips. 8-)
SMITTY
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - custom built by Jim Dorsey
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (not currently in use)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: Rick 386 On: Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:24 pm

Just stumbled upon this thread......

You mean to tell me that my sister in law has been doing it right all long by just shutting off the riding mower at full throttle ??? The thing that makes me cringe every friggin time she does it ????


Please tell me I'm wrong !!!!!


Yep old habits are hard to resist. I have been idling down all motors at least 1-2 minutes ever since my grandpop told me to do so.



Rick
Rick 386
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AA 260 heating both sides of twin farmhouse
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Hyfire II w/ coaltrol in garage
Coal Size/Type: Pea in AA 260, Rice in LL Hyfire II
Other Heating: Gas fired infared at work

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Sun Mar 02, 2014 11:54 pm

She is right,guess where that leaves you ? I had even argued with one customer till he showed me his manual,I figured it was printed wrong so i called my parts dist. & talked to a Kohler tech. OHV engines with electric fuel shut off solenoid must be shut off at full throttle & the reasoning is that when you turn the key off the fuel solenoid stops gas from going thru the carb. & the engine spinning fast will exhaust all unburnt gases b4 it stops thus preventing the backfire ! This mechanic (me) found out it works !! :shock: now to re-educate all the customers i taught wrong :oops: no more of this :blowup:
windyhill4.2
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Other Heating: Oaktree OWB 600K

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: Rick 386 On: Mon Mar 03, 2014 6:27 pm

OK but is this only for the engines with the electric shut off solenoid ??

So maybe I'm still right ????




Rick
Rick 386
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: AA 260 heating both sides of twin farmhouse
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Hyfire II w/ coaltrol in garage
Coal Size/Type: Pea in AA 260, Rice in LL Hyfire II
Other Heating: Gas fired infared at work

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: windyhill4.2 On: Mon Mar 03, 2014 6:49 pm

Most all engines are OHV today,I believe all tractor engines have a fuel solenoid regardless of brand ,BUT, electronic fuel injection on the more expensive tractors is totally different,those should be idled down & those when shut off usually have a shut off timer. Just reread your question ,it finally sank in. Full throttle shutdown is for OHV fuel solenoid equipped engines . The older,"flat head" valves in block should be idled down for 15-30 +seconds ,depending on how hard they were working .You might still be right :) if hers is not an OHV & minus fuel solenoid .
windyhill4.2
 
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Crane 404 with variable blower
Other Heating: Oaktree OWB 600K

Re: Need a new v-twin mower engine- Briggs 44Q777-3137 any good?

PostBy: coaledsweat On: Mon Mar 03, 2014 7:27 pm

With the crap gas we have now, I shut the fuel off and let it die after it eats the last drop then shut the key off.
coaledsweat
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea