Immigration

Re: Immigration

PostBy: samhill On: Sat Aug 02, 2014 4:34 pm

There was another Bush before Clinton that also went the wrong way, I guess I'm not so blind & forgetful that I can't recall who did what, or is it some other reason?
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Sat Aug 02, 2014 7:14 pm

samhill wrote:There was another Bush before Clinton that also went the wrong way, I guess I'm not so blind & forgetful that I can't recall who did what, or is it some other reason?



That was only 1 term. And economically he just kept the reaganomics rolling. He lost because of the 1st Iraq. He should have been allowed to finish there and then.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: samhill On: Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:06 pm

Flyer, who didn't allow Bush 1 to finish? Reaganomics semi-worked because then we had high inflation but he actually increased unemployment & taxes were lowered with one hand & raised with the other. It ended up as always with the wealthy getting the gold & the poor getting the shaft except he didn't really cut SS or other low income as much as the middle. I think they called it bracket creep where if you made over a certain amount it threw you into a higher bracket & he did away with a whole lot of deductions for all but lowest classes. As I said times & conditions were different then.
I'm fairly sure this has all been brought up before & it doesn't prove anything about immigration except that Reagan did give citizenship to somewhere around 3 million, so if you figure in a birth rate for a couple generations you can only guess at how many legals that adds up to today. Naturally many have inter married but in any event it has to have increased greatly & it was for no reason except they were here.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: wsherrick On: Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:23 pm

Here is an added twist to this whole thing. I heard this on the way home yesterday. I've often wondered how somebody from Crappelorez Mexico can find their way to Spring Valley, NY. How does somebody who can't even read their own language end up in some little American town I never even heard of until I came here? There has to be some sort of organization, some syndicate that has been doing this for decades. I've often wondered who other than the Democrats, who want and desire yet another permanent underclass to glean votes from; is behind all of this stuff.
As far as what is postulated here. I don't know what to say yet about it.

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Re: Immigration

PostBy: Flyer5 On: Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:16 pm

samhill wrote:Flyer, who didn't allow Bush 1 to finish? Reaganomics semi-worked because then we had high inflation but he actually increased unemployment & taxes were lowered with one hand & raised with the other. It ended up as always with the wealthy getting the gold & the poor getting the shaft except he didn't really cut SS or other low income as much as the middle. I think they called it bracket creep where if you made over a certain amount it threw you into a higher bracket & he did away with a whole lot of deductions for all but lowest classes. As I said times & conditions were different then.
I'm fairly sure this has all been brought up before & it doesn't prove anything about immigration except that Reagan did give citizenship to somewhere around 3 million, so if you figure in a birth rate for a couple generations you can only guess at how many legals that adds up to today. Naturally many have inter married but in any event it has to have increased greatly & it was for no reason except they were here.



He did give amnesty and in exchange the democrats were supposed to close the border for good. The democrats did not keep their word. I know shocking. Also along with the higher interest rates for loans you had incentive to save you actually earned a good rate in a savings account and bonds. Our dollar was worth 1.25 Canadian. I do not believe inflation was high interest rates were. I am not sure what we should do as far as the illegals here now , but I do know we should be keeping the border closed and not allow anymore to get in. At least stop the bleeding first then worry about the pain later.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: jpete On: Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:47 pm

Flyer5 wrote:I do not believe inflation was high interest rates were.


Well, that's pretty much how it goes. Inflation runs rampant when interest rates are low, as we have now.

And when interest rates go up, inflation goes down.

If we didn't have a centrally planned economy, you might have a chance of seeing low interest rates and actual DEflation, but that's not going to happen any time soon.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: lsayre On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 6:53 am

wsherrick, that Michael Savage video says a lot! Thanks for linking it!!!
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: samhill On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 7:00 am

First line under economics, both inflation & interest were high, if I remember there was a long span of that even Nixon tried Wage & Price controls to try & fight inflation but business would have none of the price control part.
http://www.reagan.utexas.edu/archives/r ... ketch.html
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: lsayre On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:03 am

Inflation is the product of a monetary system in which (by design) the quantity of currency itself must always increase. Rising prices are merely a longer term consequence of inflation, and are not in and of themselves inflation. Rising prices are effectively a potential "symptom" of the disease called currency inflation.

To fight inflation one must cut off its head. The central bank (Federal Reserve) contrived fiat monetary system that demands it (I.E. inflation) must be eliminated.

This was last done in 1836 when President Andrew Jackson killed (totally eliminated) the central bank of his day. It reared its ugly head again in 1913 with the implementation of the current Federal Reserve system (which was really only freed to work its unlimited magic of currency inflation when firstly silver was removed from coins in 1964 and secondly the last vestiges of the gold standard were eliminated in 1971). Roughly 90% of the Dollar's purchasing power has vanished since the era of 1964-1971. That is why a vehicle that cost roughly $2,700 then costs roughly $27,000 today, and a home which cost roughly $18,000 back then costs roughly $180,000 today. And gasoline that cost $34.9 cents back then costs $3.49 now. Etc...

Arguably, throughout the period of 1836 through 1913 the United States saw the greatest economic growth spurt in the history of mankind.

And this all ties to immigration when one realizes that a currency that must inflate demands a population that must inflate (in conjunction with an indigenous population that is not having children).
Last edited by lsayre on Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: samhill On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:09 am

Isayre, I think that's a case of apples & oranges, you can't really compare a time of needed growth for everything in this country to a time where little is produced domestically & we entice business to leave.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: lsayre On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:14 am

samhill wrote:Isayre, I think that's a case of apples & oranges, you can't really compare a time of needed growth for everything in this country to a time where little is produced domestically & we entice business to leave.


Did I mention that along with the introduction of the Federal Reserve system in 1913 came corporate income taxation and individual income taxation. The three work hand in hand.

Samhill, if we did not inflate away the value (purchasing power) of the Dollar, and simultaneously tax ourselves into oblivion, would the companies have left?

And would our country be as great as it is today if the rudimentary central bank of 1836 was allowed to continue and grow to have the power of the current Federal Reserve, and if as a consequence income taxation (corporate and personal) was implemented nearly 80 years earlier?

And what if social welfare was initiated 80 years earlier also. Would all of these factors when summed together have brought us to our economic knees 80 years earlier?
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: samhill On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:35 am

All I'm sure of is somewhere along the line the laws were changed to benefit the migration of businesses to headquarter or entirely move overseas & it continues today. Instead of tax incentives for expansion & development, hiring & such they are now given for leaving. Very few if any large one's ever pay the "high tax" if any & many even get our tax money in subsidies even if they aren't American businesses, how does that make any sense? Until those laws are changed nothing will change. When income tax came in many fees & tariffs were eliminated or reduced to favor business.
Seeing as how this is still an immigration thread I think this may be another thing many will dispute.
Both Reagan & Bush the First were totally in favor of open Southern borders & allowing them in legally.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: lsayre On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:49 am

I was not steering us off topic. The monetary/taxation system of today has crushed the hopes and dreams of the indigenous population, and as a direct consequence they are not having children. Given this, and given that the population must inflate in an economy where currency must inflate, we must have immigration. And for immigration to occur, there must be a carrot dangled in front of the potential immigrants. And if the carrot of honest and decent jobs is diminished by a government sponsored economic (monetary/taxation) system that is driving jobs off-shore, then the likes of welfare and Obamacare must become the carrot. And when these incentives are driving immigration, you get a different breed of immigrants than when jobs are the incentive to immigrate.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: jpete On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:02 am

Jiminy Crickets Larry! Now you've really struck at the heart of the matter and Sam isn't prepared to go down that rabbit hole! :D

It's merely "evil business" owners trying to screw everyone. :roll:

Sam(and a few others) don't seem to understand that the immigration thing is a last gasp at keeping the Ponzi scheme running. At some point, the flood of immigrants will stop because there just won't be any point anymore. And then the house of cards comes down. Maybe it'll be 50 years, maybe 100. Maybe we shouldn't care because most of us here will be dead when it happens.

Unfortunately, my kids might be here. I just hope I can educate them well enough to weather the storm.
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Re: Immigration

PostBy: samhill On: Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:10 am

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Myths_and_ ... ted_States
I don't know about the laws state to state which control welfare but the health care thing is from decades ago where no one can be refused care. I think it was originally for emergences only to start & may have morphed into more as everything seems to but I think I recall reading where they is language against illegals under Obamacare. That too could have changed.
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