Hearth Pad for Baseburner

 
Centmont
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Post by Centmont » Sat. Jul. 19, 2014 9:19 pm

I found this site somewhat by accident...and now it is an expensive accident. I simply had no idea there were such elegant things out there as some of these stoves, even though we heated our early home with an old cylinder stove.

Biting the bullet I bought a restored Favorite 261 (couldn't help myself) and am now designing its living space. I believe I have the wall protection figured out...the floor on the other hand eludes me. This stove has legs ca. 9.5in high...I can make the case that a baseburner should be hotter on the bottom because of the recirculated flu gases....and I can make the opposite case for the same reason. Those who know....how much heat is produced and transferred to the floor? This house has a joist and beam floor, not concrete. I don't want to heat it up. How much floor protection do I need? I not only have to meet code...but I don't want my house on fire either. Thanks in advance. Ralph in Montana.


 
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lowfog01
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Post by lowfog01 » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 3:07 am

Centmont wrote:I found this site somewhat by accident...and now it is an expensive accident. I simply had no idea there were such elegant things out there as some of these stoves, even though we heated our early home with an old cylinder stove.

Biting the bullet I bought a restored Favorite 261 (couldn't help myself) and am now designing its living space. I believe I have the wall protection figured out...the floor on the other hand eludes me. This stove has legs ca. 9.5in high...I can make the case that a baseburner should be hotter on the bottom because of the recirculated flu gases....and I can make the opposite case for the same reason. Those who know....how much heat is produced and transferred to the floor? This house has a joist and beam floor, not concrete. I don't want to heat it up. How much floor protection do I need? I not only have to meet code...but I don't want my house on fire either. Thanks in advance. Ralph in Montana.
Hi Ralph,

Welcome to the club! I have joist and beam floors also and what we did was lay a piece of plywood on the hardwood floor and build the hearth on that. The plywood protects the floor but is technically not permanent. You and ten of your closest friends could pick it up and move it if you so desired. It has a perimeter of bricks two layers high and that is filled with concrete topped with bricks for a finished look. It meets code and the inspector passed it without comment. Obviously, you could use any stone material and meet code. We chose bricks because we had a bunch sitting in the yard and being straight lined it was easy to do. It's worked well for us, good luck, Lisa

 
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Sunny Boy
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Post by Sunny Boy » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 6:29 am

Welcome centmont.

Places like stove shops, Home Depot, and Lowes sell hearth pads made of fire proof materials. A good one runs about $400.00 to $500.00, depending on the design that you want.

Paul

 
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Post by KingCoal » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 8:48 am

WOW, congratulations for following the opportunity and impulse to grab such a wonderful stove !!

you mention the length of the legs, i'm sure the designers made them just right. the more important issue in my mind is what is the distance from the underside of the base chamber ( lowest horizontal surface under the stove ) to the floor ? again I think the designers had that in account too.

remember that these stoves were produced in a period when they very commonly were installed over bare floors. perhaps not the best of arrangements but we'll never know if that was ever a real contributing factor in cases of fires.

hopefully member EarlH will soon find your thread and add more of his experiences with the Favorite #261.

till then you might want to view some of his threads here, Favorite Baseburner #261 and here Favorite 261 Baseburner

you can also click on his name to open his public profile and find all his threads and comments.

 
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michaelanthony
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Post by michaelanthony » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 9:50 am

Welcome Ralph, of course pictures of that there stove of yours may inspire a more productive response.
I made a pad of "Dur-rock", "Hardy board", or called "Cement board", and tiled over it and trimmed the 3 sides protruding from the front of the fireplace with 1inch pine. I have seen old photo's containing Base Burners and one I recall the stove was sitting on a metal pan barely larger than the footprint of the stove, and rugs or wood flooring below, the pan appeared reflective as well so I'm not sure how warm it actually gets below the stove. So weather you purchase or build a hearth pad a metal pan below the stove may work. Good luck and stick around the real fun starts in a couple OR few months!
Mike.

 
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dlj
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Post by dlj » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 9:51 am

Centmont wrote:how much heat is produced and transferred to the floor? This house has a joist and beam floor, not concrete. I don't want to heat it up. How much floor protection do I need? I not only have to meet code...but I don't want my house on fire either. Thanks in advance. Ralph in Montana.
Ralph in Montana,

The heat does indeed come out of the bottom of the stove, but not huge amounts. I've run my stove in many old houses, most wood post and beam with either hardwood or wide pine floors. There used to be the old sheet metal bases that went under them, that's what I used for years. I have no idea what ever happened to my old one... I now have my stove sitting on standard 1/4" thick tiles on top of a hard wood floor. There is no problem. I have a space of about 4' X 5' under the stove with tiles. I'd like more (probably 5' X 6') but more doesn't fit my living space. I like setting all my tools, coal hod etc. on top of the tile region when in use. The 4' X 5' does work, but it's tight - for me anyway...

I think the more important question is if there is any code out your way that addresses this. Best to be code compliant....

dj

 
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Post by franco b » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 11:07 am

The people at Vermont Castings were very surprised when they found scorch marks on the floor when shifting stoves in their show room. They had the usual brick or blue stone type hearth.

My preference is a sheet of metal 4x4 covered by 1/2 inch cement board followed by tile. The metal is very good at conducting any heat that gets through sideways to dissipate it. I don't think it will meet a strict fire code though.

With the stove running hold your hand on whatever hearth surface you decide on. If too warm you can always make an additional heat shield under the stove legs with a piece of metal spaced 1 inch up from the hearth and painted with heat resistant paint.


 
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Post by Centmont » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 11:45 am

Thanks much for the warm welcome (appropriate for a stove website?) and the advice. I probably will go with a commercial UL listed pad just to appease the inspectors. I will also take the suggestion for making another heat shield 1 " above the tile or stone pad directly under the stove. The wall is built with steel studs, covered with heat-rated sheetrock and I would just like to paint that. Will use a metal heat shield 1" off the wall, with, perhaps a smaller heat-shield in the back of the stove...all in hopes of moving in from the 36" to 12" code. This beast is 28"X28"... plus 12" for the back, and 18" on the front....The padcomes out into the room quite a bit, but then I though about putting it in the middle anyway. Overkill I hope, but I would hate to get that much into a stove and be told I can't use it.

These stoves are an elegant part of our history...everything about them fascinates me including their histories. If I were younger, I'd drive around the country buying and restoring them and I have great respect for those of you that do. I enjoy this site and have made it part of my morning scan. All the best... Ralph

 
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dlj
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Post by dlj » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 1:33 pm

franco b wrote:The people at Vermont Castings were very surprised when they found scorch marks on the floor when shifting stoves in their show room. They had the usual brick or blue stone type hearth.

My preference is a sheet of metal 4x4 covered by 1/2 inch cement board followed by tile. The metal is very good at conducting any heat that gets through sideways to dissipate it. I don't think it will meet a strict fire code though.

With the stove running hold your hand on whatever hearth surface you decide on. If too warm you can always make an additional heat shield under the stove legs with a piece of metal spaced 1 inch up from the hearth and painted with heat resistant paint.
Yea, my Vermont Castings gets hotter on it's feet than my Glenwood. Even though the heat pumps out of the bottom of the Glenwood in baseburner mode, the feet don't get hot. The tiles can be nice and warm, but not scorching... The feet on my Vermont get a lot hotter - I guess it's because they are actually connected to the fire pot while the legs of the base heater are not. They connect to the ash compartment which connects to the fire pot. The gas circulation path is also not in direct contact with the feet. The feet are a separate casting from the base so another step removed from heat transfer. Like I said, I used to have one of the old sheet metal hearths folk are talking about and have never had any heat marks on any floor I've ever had the Glenwood on...

dj

 
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Post by coalnewbie » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 2:20 pm

David this is most encouraging as under the Hitzer things got HOT.

 
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Post by wsherrick » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 3:00 pm

Hello, and welcome. You will find many of us who have discovered or should I say re discovered the science and beautiful functionality of base burners. You own one of the highest expressions of the art. You will also discover that these things aren't just toys or pretty pieces of antiquity. They are serious heaters.
Now I have a question.
Do have a supply of the proper coal for this stove out there? These stoves are meant for Anthracite Coal as their only fuel. Burning something other than Anthracite will ruin them because they are scientifically designed for combustion properties of Anthracite.

 
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Post by Centmont » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 6:29 pm

In the interest in brevity, I didn't write the entire story. The house where the stove will go is being built in Payson, AZ. I will have to drive through Wyoming to get there and there is anthracite in a couple of places in Wyoming (shipped out from the east). There is also anthracite in northern Kansas (of all things) and I regularly do business in southern Nebraska...another possibility. Given the fact that this will not be my primary heat source, I can easily haul enough from either place with a small trailer. That part of the research I have done...I'm sure there are many other mistakes, however, I am still going to make. Feel free to question, it will be good for me.

William, I have enjoyed your videos. Ralph

 
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wsherrick
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Post by wsherrick » Sun. Jul. 20, 2014 11:28 pm

Thanks for watching the videos. I'm truly gratified that you liked them.
It's good that you can get real Anthracite. Everything else is simply getting the stove put in.
I know you said that the stove will not be your primary heat source. These things have a way of becoming primary after experiencing the satisfaction that these objects invariably bring, the personal relationship that you will develop with it and the feeling of mastery which comes with directly controlling your environment and so on. All of that plus saving money on your utility bills simply makes turning a dial on the wall quite a bore. The base burner will become a member of the family. You will find a reason to use it even though you have other sources of heat.
You will see
We would also love to see the stove all hooked up with a fire in it. Another base burner fulfilling its designed purpose makes us all happy here.

 
Centmont
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Post by Centmont » Mon. Jul. 21, 2014 9:48 am

Elegant and encouraging post William. Thanks! I believe that I will be using it more than anticipated...just means a larger coal trailer, or more trips through Wyoming. It is being worked on now and will be installed in October.... photos will follow. At this point I'm most worried about codes in Arizona prohibiting use of early "woodstoves". Good thing this is a coal stove. R

 
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EarlH
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Post by EarlH » Fri. Jul. 25, 2014 5:30 pm

Wow, that thing may put out a lot more heat than you'll need in Arizona! Of course that will depend on how big your house is and how cold it gets in the part where you'll live. The stove you have is just like what I heated my house with last winter and the second half of the previous winter. I put a fire in it last November and let it go out at the end of March. It really did a good job heating the place. But it wasn't exactly toasty warm on the second floor when it was 25 below zero out. My stove is in the basement though and I'm really happy with it. This last winter was exceptional though and hopefully, this next winter will be a little more mild.
As far as the pad underneath is concerned, it does get warm under the stove, but not scorching hot like a regular oak type stove will do. I suppose you could burn it that hard, but you really shouldn't have to. You will want something under the stove, but you don't need to go crazy thinking the bottom of that stove is going to set a stick of wood on fire that you lay under it. When it was really cold out, the cats would lay under it with their front legs right under it and when I heated with a Round Oak stove 15 years ago I had a cat that would face away from that thing and creep closer a little at a time until his fur would smolder and stink up the place! I've never had this that hot and it heats the house just fine.
I'm very happy with this stove I have. It's really heavy and very well made, and designed. I have some sales stuff on the stove I can copy and send to you if you want. Not a whole lot, but a few things. That magazine will hold quite a bit of coal and I've had this one burn for a couple of days when it's not too cold out before I had to fire it again. And like I said, I had only one fire in it all winter. I still can't get over that, and everything about the stove looks the same as it did last fall before I built a fire in it.
Good luck with old girl. Lots of nice baseburners, but the two I have are the only two I've ever seen a fire in. So I really can't comment on any of the other flavors!


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