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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Thu. Oct. 30, 2014 5:29 pm

Muddy Jeep wrote: Lightning wrote:
How do you know you lost draft?? Manometer reading??

Yes. My reading went from .03 to zero in a matter of seconds.
And it remained zero for how long? Even after the load door was shut?


 
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Muddy Jeep
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Post by Muddy Jeep » Thu. Oct. 30, 2014 7:14 pm

rberq wrote:Does the Hot Blast call for a 6-inch or 8-inch flue?
It calls for a 6" flue. I would have gotten the 6" stainless liner, however I was worried after reading many people not being able to get a 6" down their chimney do to shifted clay liners ect. Glad I went with the 5.5" because I even struggled getting it down in spots where it would get hung up on an edge or something. From what I researched It seems to be a pretty common option for appliances that have a 6" flue. I also failed to mention but it is an interior chimney.
freetown fred wrote:MJ, I'm hoping you added those two bags slowly, & didn't just dump them all in one at a time??? Chimney sounds fine.
Yes I do add it in slowly. I'm using a spade shovel right now to add it in. I add about two shovels at a time every few min trying to make sure I leave an open flame somewhere.
Lightning wrote:And it remained zero for how long? Even after the load door was shut?
Until the fire was up an running....about a half hour. I had the same problem tonight after loading although this time it took about 40 min. Everytime I open the ash pan door my draft reading goes to zero as well. Does this seem right? I haven't tried michaelanthony's trick of covering the baro with aluminum foil yet. I may try this next time I reload and see what happens.

 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Thu. Oct. 30, 2014 7:38 pm

Ok I understand why now.. you have the probe so close to the appliance that opening any door on the stove will satisfy the negative pressure there. Plus, with the 5.5 inch liner the chimney's volume capacity is also compromised. No big deal. You still have draft. You can prove it with a smoke test. Hold a lit cigarette or a small piece a smoldering card board near the open ash pan door and watch the smoke stream as it's pulled into the stove.

 
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Muddy Jeep
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Post by Muddy Jeep » Fri. Oct. 31, 2014 7:50 pm

Lightning wrote:You can prove it with a smoke test. Hold a lit cigarette or a small piece a smoldering card board near the open ash pan door and watch the smoke stream as it's pulled into the stove.
Great idea. I tried this test this morning and it did stream into the ash pan door. I'm not sure I understand the negative pressure part however. I also did the aluminum foil test over the baro. I guess I was thinking if I stopped the leakage from around the baro with the ash pan door open, then my probe would be able to get a reading. Unfortunately, I still did not get a reading with the aluminum foil over the baro and the ash door open.....but the smoking piece of paper did still get pulled into the stove.

 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Fri. Oct. 31, 2014 8:52 pm

The probe on your manometer measures negative pressure (vacuum) in the flue pipe. The two conditions (closeness of the probe to the appliance and the 5.5 inch liner) cause the negative pressure to be satisfied when the ash or load door is open. This implies that the draft is gone when it's not. Close the door and you should again see a reading on the mano.

Smoke test proved that there is still air flow thru the fuel bed even though the mano read zero. We often think that a manometer measures draft which is kind of misleading. It actually measures pressure. Now I see this more clearly lol..

 
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Post by McGiever » Fri. Oct. 31, 2014 9:20 pm

SS flex liners do get a lot of noise about not lasting very long w/ coal...but,

Although this is inconvient and costly, there is a larger risk present. :o

If corrosion of liner is left unchecked the perforated decaying liner can eventually break and collapse and quite probably fall and pieces will block or restrict the exit of exhaust fumes from the appliance and cause the fumes to then back up into the home's living space w/ deadly Carbon Monoxide. :sick:

So the bigger risk is not the inconvience and costs...but is the eventual Carbon Monoxide.

 
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Muddy Jeep
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Post by Muddy Jeep » Sat. Nov. 01, 2014 9:32 am

Lightning wrote:The probe on your manometer measures negative pressure (vacuum) in the flue pipe. The two conditions (closeness of the probe to the appliance and the 5.5 inch liner) cause the negative pressure to be satisfied when the ash or load door is open. This implies that the draft is gone when it's not. Close the door and you should again see a reading on the mano.
Thanks for the explanation...I think I understand a little better now. As I was reading on this site for a while before I installed my baro, I kept reading that the closer to the appliance the better for a more accurate reading. I will check to see if I get a reading on the mano after I close the door the next time I reload. I failed to do this this morning as I left an open flame visible to ignite the fresh coal. I know that if the fire is going well, then it will read on the manometer once I close the door. However, I'm thinking that if the whole fire was covered and I'm waiting for ignition with the door closed but the spinner open....there was no reading on the manometer until the fire ignited over the coal bed. I will try and check this next time I accidentally cover the whole fire.
McGiever wrote:If corrosion of liner is left unchecked the perforated decaying liner can eventually break and collapse and quite probably fall and pieces will block or restrict the exit of exhaust fumes from the appliance and cause the fumes to then back up into the home's living space w/ deadly Carbon Monoxide.
Thanks for the warning. I will make it a point to inspect it every year. From what I have read you need to clean them with a poly brush vs a standard metal brush at the end of each season and I should get a few years of service out of it. Currently, I have two CO detectors in the house and hopefully I will have three by this weekends end (one for each level of the house). Ideally I would have loved to get a poured chimney liner. However, until I proved to the wife that coal would heat well and do it cost effectively, I tried to keep initial costs down. So far everything is running smoothly and haven't lost a fire yet in four days and house has stayed very comfortable. If this continues, maybe when time comes to swap it out then I can get a better type of liner.


 
rberq
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Post by rberq » Sat. Nov. 01, 2014 10:30 pm

Muddy Jeep wrote:Ideally I would have loved to get a poured chimney liner.
I don't remember the numbers, but my Supaflu cost considerably less than I was quoted for a SS liner. I was surprised.

 
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Post by Muddy Jeep » Thu. Nov. 06, 2014 7:48 pm

Yeah I'm going to have to check the Supaflu out when the time comes. I only spent about $400 to do the SS liner myself. I guess one question I have is, a lot of people use those stainless steel chimneys up the sides of their houses and I'm curious as to how long those last. What is the life expectancy of those vs a liner? If it's made from the same grade of stainless, 316ti, won't it last the same amount of time? I guess the only factor I see that could extend the life of the chimneys over the liners is that the wall thickness could be thicker. I don't know much about either one, I'm just speculating. I don't hear many people say bad things about the stainless chimney pipes, just the liners.

 
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Post by titleist1 » Thu. Nov. 06, 2014 8:29 pm

The SS chimneys are not highly regarded. I have been one of the lucky ones I guess, my SS chimney has been in service for over 20 years and is not rotting away.

The only damage on mine is to the cap locking ring and screen. The screen disintegrated in about 10 years and the locking ring went about 3 years ago. I rigged some 12 gauge copper wire across the chimney to hold the cap in place and it has held ever since.

I burned a lot of wood in the early years and my theory is that a microscopic layer of creosote is protecting the SS! :wacko:

 
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Post by nortcan » Thu. Nov. 06, 2014 8:44 pm

Right, we never hear about a wood burning stove corroding St-St chimney or even a St-St liner.
About loosing the fire , it's also important to have a good shaking to get rid of ash accumulation under the coal bed. Anth ash is able to choke a fire and get you :mad:

 
rberq
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Post by rberq » Thu. Nov. 06, 2014 10:03 pm

titleist1 wrote:The SS chimneys are not highly regarded. I have been one of the lucky ones I guess, my SS chimney has been in service for over 20 years and is not rotting away….The only damage on mine is to the cap locking ring and screen
My SS chimney was used for wood burning for several years, and now about 7 years for coal. It seems to be in pretty good shape still, except the cap completely rusted away. But I don’t know whether it was a good-quality cap to begin with. I really don’t care for SS chimneys on the side of the house because I think they are ugly, and mine would be right in front and highly visible. As it is, it goes through the roof on a one-story part of the house, so it’s a little ugly but not quite as bad. Unfortunately it was the best of several bad options.
Muddy Jeep wrote:Yeah I'm going to have to check the Supaflu out when the time comes. I only spent about $400 to do the SS liner myself.
If I recall, my Supaflu was $1,100 about 10 years ago, so would probably be more now. It was for my oil burner, not my coal stove. I don’t know if a poured liner is something you could do yourself. At only $400, you could just redo the SS liner if it goes bad. Of course by then you will be older and maybe not so excited about climbing ladders and roofs.

 
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Post by Muddy Jeep » Sat. Nov. 08, 2014 8:02 am

rberq wrote:I really don’t care for SS chimneys on the side of the house because I think they are ugly
I would have to agree with you on this one too. They just look out of place on some houses.
rberq wrote:At only $400, you could just redo the SS liner if it goes bad. Of course by then you will be older and maybe not so excited about climbing ladders and roofs.
Yeah, this is what I was thinking originally. Supposedly the liner has a lifetime warranty too, so if it goes bad I should get a free one....we'll see how that will pan out if and when the time comes. I'm already not very excited to get up their and clean it every year after installing it this year. I'm getting ready to turn 30, so yes I am fairly young and agile lol, but my roof is about a 6/12 pitch on a two story house, so its a little steep......needless to say I'm not a fan being up there. Its not the height that bothers me, but trying to balance yourself on that slope, especially after a few hours of being up there . If anything else I guess its a great leg exercise! Hopefully this also is not our forever home. We just bought the house about a one and a half years ago with plans on it being our 10 year home before we build or find something else that better suits our needs. So hopefully, the liner will last long enough where I won't need to worry about it again.

 
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Post by rberq » Sat. Nov. 08, 2014 8:31 am

Muddy Jeep wrote:... hopefully, the liner will last long enough where I won't need to worry about it again.
That's the sort of thing my father said in his 70s, and I have started thinking the same way. :lol:
Just not for the same reason you have given.

 
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Post by warminmn » Sat. Nov. 08, 2014 9:04 am

titleist1 wrote:The SS chimneys are not highly regarded. I have been one of the lucky ones I guess, my SS chimney has been in service for over 20 years and is not rotting away.

The only damage on mine is to the cap locking ring and screen. The screen disintegrated in about 10 years and the locking ring went about 3 years ago. I rigged some 12 gauge copper wire across the chimney to hold the cap in place and it has held ever since.

I burned a lot of wood in the early years and my theory is that a microscopic layer of creosote is protecting the SS! :wacko:
I took pictures of the inside of mine this year and no rust yet, just a thick layer of creosote from wood. I think the creosote really helps, especially as it fills all the joints. The outside of it is showing a little rust color.


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