Cold Air Return. Do I Need It?

 
larryfoster
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Post by larryfoster » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 9:11 am

I guess I was swept away by Ky Speedracer's thread a while back where he was running his furnace up to 700.

Just checked after firing up about 1-1/2 hours ago.
Had a nice fire going; some small flames and good coals.
Moved the secondary air to medium.
Temp was around 300-325


 
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SWPaDon
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Post by SWPaDon » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 9:25 am

larryfoster wrote:I guess I was swept away by Ky Speedracer's thread a while back where he was running his furnace up to 700.

Just checked after firing up about 1-1/2 hours ago.
Had a nice fire going; some small flames and good coals.
Moved the secondary air to medium.
Temp was around 300-325
If that temp heats your house, strive to keep it in that range. That can be accomplished with the primary air (open=more heat, closed=less heat), you are the one in control, and have the ability to control the 'coal monster'. ;)

 
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Ky Speedracer
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Post by Ky Speedracer » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 9:42 am

larryfoster wrote:I guess I was swept away by Ky Speedracer's thread a while back where he was running his furnace up to 700.

Just checked after firing up about 1-1/2 hours ago.
Had a nice fire going; some small flames and good coals.
Moved the secondary air to medium.
Temp was around 300-325
I do that when it's really cold out. I can bring 1800 square feet from 68 up to 80 in a couple of hours if it is zero outside. But, I have a piped in cold air return that allows me to do that.
Don is right that if you can maintain the 300 to 400 degree burn and keep your house warm that's a good deal. The bit I use would soot up that little 6" pipe in a couple of days if I tried to keep my initial burn off down in that range.
I let mine run up to 550 to 650 usually and then let it burn there for an hour or so, then I work that secondary slide control slowly back down to about half.
You will need to practice with yours to see when and where it runs the best.
Don's bit coal seems to have some characteristics similar to anthracite. Mine burns a lot more like wood. You will just have to work through what yours needs to keep you comfy...and soot free.
Remember, most of the soot build up comes from an incomplete burn. The way to mitigate that with out adding modified secondary air controls is to keep the "over the fire" burning nice and hot for the initial burn off. When it warms up outside, I sometimes have to just dump supply air out of my duct back into my basement because it will heat the house up to much during the initial burn.

 
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Post by larryfoster » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 10:20 am

Thanks for your input, Ky Speedracer.
I sometimes have to just dump supply air out of my duct back into my basement
How do you do that? Open basement registers in your ductwork?

I started the morning after loading up with the secondary wide open.

Today, I didn't let the temps run way up by opening the ash door like I usually do.

 
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Post by Ky Speedracer » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 10:24 am

Below is part of a PM conversation with Lightning. I'm showing you this so you don't get to locked in to what everyone says their readings and temps are. Keep in mind, most of what you see on this site, especially folks with our type of stoves are burning anthracite.
Don and I are using bit but it's obvious the characteristics of what he and I burn are quite different. I think that is the norm for bit as I understand it. It does not seem to have a lot of consistency to it. You can get a wide variety of differing qualities out of the same mine.

So, what I'm suggesting is play with the settings on your stove. Burn it one way one day, and another the next. When you get to something you like, tweak it from there.

Just keep in mind that your setup for burning bit coal has some serious limitations due to your small flue size. Don does it and does it very well with the small pipe and a similar stove but you may not be as lucky due to the quality of your coal.

Just keep an eye on that mano gauge so you can see how much soot build up your are developing in your flue pipe...

The first pic below this is the over door temp.
The next is the flue pipe.
The last obviously is the mano. (and yes, you read that right when I said my supply duct temp was 206).
These stoves a pretty tuff. There is no indication of warping or over fire. I don't usually let it get that hot but my draft is crazy so I have to be on my toes... LOL

Sent: Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:09 pm
From: Ky Speedracer
To: Lightning

I know right.
I probably should have been a little more carful tonight with the outside temps so low. It got up to 800 a few minutes ago.
I was watching the flue temp and it was only up to 295. That's not usually to bad. I saw my supply duct temp was at was 206. So I checked the door temp and whoa... 804!

Attachments

door temp.jpg
.JPG | 17.3KB | door temp.jpg
flue temp.jpg
.JPG | 17.1KB | flue temp.jpg
mano.jpg
.JPG | 19.3KB | mano.jpg

 
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Ky Speedracer
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Post by Ky Speedracer » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 10:27 am

larryfoster wrote:Thanks for your input, Ky Speedracer.
I sometimes have to just dump supply air out of my duct back into my basement
How do you do that? Open basement registers in your ductwork?
Kind of, I have an end cap on a supply duct that I hinged and it allows me to just open it up.

 
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Ky Speedracer
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Post by Ky Speedracer » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 10:37 am

I f you believe in Lightning's "stack effect" theory and how it effects draft (and I do by the way), I'm pretty sure they could have shot this pick of Marilyn Monroe in my house... LOL

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marylin.jpg
.JPG | 9.9KB | marylin.jpg


 
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Post by larryfoster » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 11:07 am

Thanks for all that info.

Wow! your mano is crazy!

Before I put the baro in and was running a straight shot for a couple days, I was at .16
Per Don's recommendation, I have it back to .06.

I can get my fire temps to 700+ fairly easily and then back down.
Never measured the stack but it gets a lot hotter now.

My register supply never gets too hot to put my hand on it

 
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Post by freetown fred » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 11:14 am

Thank God, I was getting cross-eyed reading 33 pages of posts! :clap: toothy Glad she's workin better my friend. :)

 
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Post by larryfoster » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 3:05 pm

Buckle up Fred!
We're just getting started
:lol:

 
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Post by joeq » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 5:23 pm

You are a very popular guy Larry. I just found this thread and can't believe the participation in such a short time. I see lots of Chimney advice, but your initial question of cold air seems to have run the gambit. But I'll have to admit, I haven't read all the pages, at the beginning. I'll bet with a couple more days of tuning your furnace, you'll be bored, and move on to bigger and better things. Good luck, and where should all your advisers send the bill? ( :D )

 
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Post by larryfoster » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 6:13 pm

joeq, I don't think I was always popular with everybody.
:roll:
where should all your advisers send the bill?
I was thinking the forum should charge others for all the knowledge that is in this thread.
It, maybe, should be pinned

8-)

 
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Post by SWPaDon » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 6:33 pm

Larry, you mentioned earlier about smoke coming out the door when you poked or added coal.

You can take a clothespin (the spring type) and block your baro shut when loading. This will increase your draft to pull more smoke out the flue. ( don't forget to remove it)

Also, be sure to have the ash pan door shut when loading with coal, that way you are pulling all the air thru the load door.

 
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Post by larryfoster » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 6:47 pm

Also, be sure to have the ash pan door shut when loading with coal, that way you are pulling all the air thru the load door.
That may be the culprit, Don.
I (almost) always have the ash door open.
Thanks, again

Since this thread isn't long enough, a question on the baro.
Will anything need to change on very windy days?

 
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Post by SWPaDon » Wed. Mar. 04, 2015 6:50 pm

larryfoster wrote:
Also, be sure to have the ash pan door shut when loading with coal, that way you are pulling all the air thru the load door.
That may be the culprit, Don.
I (almost) always have the ash door open.
Thanks, again

Since this thread isn't long enough, a question on the baro.
Will anything need to change on very windy days?
The baro should maintain the .06 even on windy days. Just be sure to check the backside of it every week for soot buildup, clean it off with a brush if you see any.


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