Time for the Pros to Chime in PLESE

windyhill4.2 wrote:Better to buy a new unit than to go with an old refurbed unit with unknown life expectancy !!

That sounds funny coming from a guy heating a neighborhood with a 1960 EFM.

More seriously, I don't really buy into the "newer is always better" concept as it applies to coal equipment. IMO some of the older stuff had advantages in materials and features vs. the newer stuff, and can offer excellent value and lengthy, reliable service. We heated our last house with a 1962 EFM 900, and are now in our fifth winter heating our "new" house with an EFM 85R conversion stoker believed to be from the 1950's. I think we're closing in on 200 tons of total burn, and have needed to replace a total of 2 feed auger pipes and a small handful of shear pins.

Mike

Mike! You are way too funny LMAO! By the way, how much coal have you burned so far this season?

I received 23.55 tons of buck from Gale on 11/15. During the cold weather I think I've been burning around 400-450 lb/day. I now have it partly in drums, partly in the bin and partly under a tarp, so it's hard to pinpoint the current inventory. I can give a better cumulative total when I get closer to running out.

Mike

400-450 lbs per/day is ALOT of black Diamonds.

Scottscoaled wrote: I thought I was pretty clear about what would work

I guess I need help with reading comprehension also...the closest thing to an answer in your post I see is....

Scottscoaled wrote: A stoker, a conversion stoker, wouldn't have to be capable of running at full bore to satisfy this boiler. This isn't something new. These things have been around for a long time. It would make the ashes easy to deal with and give you a better efficientsy than your hand fired. Cheaper too.

ok, so a stoker of some unmentioned size will work, but it seems to me to be missing the size stoker that wouldn't need to run at full bore which you already indicated wouldn't be an EFM 700,

Scottscoaled wrote:No,,,,,, I don't think a 700 will fit the bill.

next size up from an EFM 700 maybe?? or was leaving the stoker size out intentional at this point so he does more heat load homework? maybe I need more coffee or my browser isn't displaying the entire post where the stoker size is mentioned.....

Thanks to a forum member who shared some info via a pm,i now have a bit more info on what a ( " conversion stoker" ) is.It would appear that yrs ago when laziness first entered our country,EFM was one of the manufacturers who made stokers to convert the hand fed furnaces & boilers to auger fed automation.So there is a stoker out there that will likely work to slide into this sectional boiler without too much ado.Now I suppose that Scott, will be along to criticize me for sharing the little I have learned (without his help) & will once again try to label me as a novice trying to be an expert. Nowhere in this thread or anywhere else have I tried to claim expert status on boilers or stoves. I have shared what I have learned,most of it from what I have read on this forum. I have tried to steer this thread towards some kind of definitive answer for the OP,many things I posted were in a questioning form to try & bring out some other posters thoughts ,Opinions & experiences.Anyone with a brain the size of a pea can easily see this.The big question that remains unanswered is this.... Why won't Scott explain things to us dummies who surround him on this forum ? How do we learn as much as he supposedly knows if he won't share the info ? Why could he not share info about the EFM 85R conversion stoker with the rest of us ? Would this not also benefit the OP ,who still hasn't had his question properly answered or explained. I knew from studying on here that there were options for converting this unit,i just didn't know the correct answer & was trying to pry it out of someone who has the answer,not for my benefit or glory but to help the OP. If we can't share what we know on this forum & can't expect those that KNOW to give an answer ,then what good is it for anyone to even post a question on here. I also have felt pained & embarrassed for new members who post questions & days go by with no reply,i have tried my best to share what I do know or steer them to where they could get help.pacoalroller, hang in there,there does seem to be some hope for your situation after all,MAYBE someone with some common sense courtesy will explain this conversion stoker idea for all to benefit.

WH, thanks for clearing it up, so the complete clear answer would have been an EFM 85R conversion stoker.

I guess until we learn the secret stoker boiler handshake we'll just get posts like this:

Scottscoaled wrote:I thought I was pretty clear about what would work

& this

Scottscoaled wrote:You have experience with,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 1 residential boiler, and,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1 crane 404. Enough said.

instead of a single post with the words EFM 85R conversion stoker typed out.

EFM made many models of conversion stokers, an 85R is a much larger unit that most people would imagine.

Mike was kind enough to post some pictures of his a while back:

85R

The size of the current base on the unit will be the limiting factor of what can be slid in. A custom base might be an option, but by then you've probably increased the cost of the project enough that a purpose built stoker boiler would be competitive.

Motor Stoker and Van Wert also made some nice conversion stokers.

Rob is correct that you don't want an 85R. A 26" firepot will not fit into a 20" boiler, and if you opened it up the National would not be able to do anything useful with much of the 935k btu/hr of gross boiler input you would produce.

From the dimensions provided a 16A (predecessor of the 700 stoker) seems more like the best conversion unit. It's rated at 26 lb/hr, which I would translate to about 287k btu/hr of gross boiler input. My second choice probably would be a UFR, which carries a similar rating but is spec'd to burn rice (harder to get to top end performance). If the National is rated high enough and if the load to be carried is large enough, 2 of either one of those probably could be squeezed in, subject to check of dimensions and clearances.

With the bases already in place under the boiler, I also wouldn't rule out a conventional stoker, subject to clearances, etc.

Mike

I think the conversion stoker would be the most cost effective solution for the OP. The size option I defer to the expert, Mike, because of his experience with conversion stokers. Maybe I didn't explain my choice for the reluctance to putting a 700 stoker into the original boiler. It was from the experience of trying to fabricate a base for a similar situation. Another situation was trying to fabricate a base to put 2 520 stokers stokers under a boiler. both situations were just too much work involved for the same payback that a conversion stoker would have afforded. I also was able to help design a base for a Kiwanee 500K boiler that I acquired in Michigan and went in on partnership with the Van Wert factory owner. That particular boiler was given a 1500 Van Wert Stoker as a power plant.
I do sell refurbed EFM 520,s, refurbed EFM 700's, 520 and 700 stoker. I would be happy to sell one. I just don't think it is the best solution. I can honestly admit that while I don't know everything, I do have a good deal of real world experience buying, refurbing, selling, and installing used coal boilers. EFM's in particular. There are quite a few guys on this forum who know tons more than I do about coal boilers.

The last thing I would like to see is that Marvelous boiler pounded into pieces and scrapped. It is a true piece of work.

I am very grateful for all the info shared in the last three posts,lots of info that I have not seen or heard b4. I too am awed by the sectional boilers,is it because we see so few ? Were there so few made ? so few survived ?Or are there still many of that style boiler still quietly doing their jobs in basements unnoticed,unrecognized. What era were they made ? typical application ? residential or commercial ? Were they typically used for larger applications or anywhere a boiler was desired ? They certainly are a fascinating design with their ability to grow to a larger size with simple mods.

Believe that there is still a AHS Coal Gun Stoker available for sale used that is rated 500,000 btu/hr.
Has a silo or some large bin and will auger in coal plus auger out ashes.

Been listed on C/L for a time now...might want to "deal" better now.

Rob, that 85R link is an awesome thread to read,i had only seen a few pics & mention of that setup b4 in the boiler pic thread ,Thanks. (It was way too short a thread.)

windyhill4.2 wrote:Rob, that 85R link is an awesome thread to read,i had only seen a few pics & mention of that setup b4 in the boiler pic thread ,Thanks. (It was way too short a thread.)

Yes, thanks to Rob for the link to that thread. I must be getting old, or something, because I had forgotten about it.

Mike

Yeah, the word beast doesn't even begin to describe it. Mike opens the door with these big thick welding gloves and the heat from the fire just drives you back. Very awe inspiring.