Ice Dams & Gutters Questions

 
NJJoe
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Post by NJJoe » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 9:43 am

My new house supposedly has the tendency to form ice dams on the eaves of the roof. Current tenant (who came with the property purchase) advised of the formation of impressive stalactites that hang past her windows.

I understand the prevention of ice dams has to do with insulating the floor of the attic so less heat escapes the structure to melt the snow on the roof. Insulating would help out from a heating fuel savings perspective. I just upgraded the heating systems and gave each tenant their own boiler so the natural gas savings would not be mine to appreciate.

There are also no gutters on the roof and I am thinking about getting some installed. The property has a tendency to get some water infiltration through the foundation that appears in the cellar with every major rainstorm.

So what do I do first? I'm concerned the ice dams may damage the roof with each passing season. I'm also concerned that if I install new gutters, the ice dams may collapse them with their weight. I'd like to do at least one of these projects this fall.


 
titleist1
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Post by titleist1 » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 11:05 am

Easy choice for me...I would do the insulation first, see if it resolves the ice dam issue this winter before putting up gutters that may get ripped down by the ice.

The insulation expense will be subtracted from the property income at tax time so its not a total out of pocket hit.

 
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Post by SWPaDon » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 12:00 pm

And while you are insulating, be sure it is open from the eaves to the peak of the roof for airflow.

 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 12:47 pm

Insulate the ceiling and make sure you have proper ventilation happening in the roof system. What type of ventilation is in place? Gable vents? Peak vents? Soffits?

 
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Post by waldo lemieux » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 12:53 pm

NJJoe wrote: I just upgraded the heating systems and gave each tenant their own boiler so the natural gas savings would not be mine to appreciate.
While the heat savings may not be yours , the cost of the years of ice dam neglect certainly will be :!:

 
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Post by NJJoe » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 12:55 pm

Lightning wrote:Insulate the ceiling and make sure you have proper ventilation happening in the roof system. What type of ventilation is in place? Gable vents? Peak vents? Soffits?
I'll take some pics when I can but there is a ridge vent at the peak of the roof. There are soffit vents that I can see from the outside. I'll have to get into the attic, get to the eaves of the roof and make sure the soffits are not blocked.

The house has 2 gables. One gable has a window installed that is accessible from the attic. The other gable for some reason has had the window removed, a sheet of plywood or some sort of barrier with a gable vent installed.

I imagine the window would stay closed during the winter but the gable vent is what is probably ruining the ventilation of the flow. Possibly for now, I'll see if I can see the airflow moving past it with some weather sealing/plastic etc... or find some way to block the flow of air through the vent. In my research, I've found that one should not mix gable vents along with soffit & ridge venting. Opinions?

 
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Post by NJJoe » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 12:57 pm

waldo lemieux wrote:
NJJoe wrote: I just upgraded the heating systems and gave each tenant their own boiler so the natural gas savings would not be mine to appreciate.
While the heat savings may not be yours , the cost of the years of ice dam neglect certainly will be :!:
Absolutely. I was including that fact so I could provide enough information that would help decide which repair to prioritize. Most recommendations would value the attic floor insulation and point to the fact that $$ would be saved. In my case there seem to be other reasons why attic floor insulation would be beneficial, in this case a savings on utilities is not.


 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 12:58 pm

I don't know lol. Seems like the more, the better but maybe that's not the case.

 
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michaelanthony
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Post by michaelanthony » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 2:04 pm

Lightning wrote:Insulate the ceiling and make sure you have proper ventilation happening in the roof system. What type of ventilation is in place? Gable vents? Peak vents? Soffits?
Agree^^^^......many times "blown in" insulation and other types will block the soffit vent air flow. Thin styrofoam baffles should be installed in the rafter cavity and any air leaks around light fixtures in the ceiling below must be stopped. Condensation is happening due to warm air meeting cold air so check all fixtures and electrical outlet boxes.
roof vent.JPG
.JPG | 47.3KB | roof vent.JPG

 
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Post by coalder » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 4:09 pm

My son just went through this in Watertown, NY. Not enough ventilation; And the BIGGEST thing was bathroom exhaust fan just being vented into attic. Since then he put huge gable vents along with soffit vents, and vented exhaust fan through siding. Exhaust fans to attic are real killers.
Jim

 
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Post by waldo lemieux » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 6:01 pm

NJJoe wrote: In my case there seem to be other reasons why attic floor insulation would be beneficial, in this case a savings on utilities is not.
Joe,

I just finished a duplex. I heated both sides last year to 60 degrees . It cost me 850 for both sides not each side. when I was asked how much the heat was and I showed them my utility bills , both sides rented immediately and for 200$ more than the going rate for a similarly sized unit. :idea: even though a prospective may not have utility savings as a top priority it certainly can be a "sway" factor. Dont dismiss it out of hand.........

 
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Post by lzaharis » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 7:33 pm

I am investing in an IROBOT gutter cleaner as the problems with my gutters seem to be due to the crap that accumulates in them. The other issue is the gutter guys never show up when you need them andeven before then the ice is already in the gutters.

I would invest in the Irobot gutter cleaner with the spare batter as its about $400 plus shipping then decide if after you have cleaned the gutters the last time whether you need more work- I am doing thew IROBOT thing because it would cost me another 1400 to put leaf guards on my gutters_they have to remove the Alaska rain gutters to do that so I am just going to climb on a ladder several times in the fall to be sure the gutters are clear with the I robot and a hot water hose. The tracked robot will travel fifty feet from your starting position to clean the gutters so if you have an insice corner with 100 feet of gitter you can work from there.

 
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Post by ccebik » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 10:10 pm

New gutters will solve both of your problems as long as they are kept clean. They will also help prevent termites, bats, ants, mold etc..

 
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Post by windyhill4.2 » Thu. Aug. 20, 2015 10:19 pm

ccebik wrote:New gutters will solve both of your problems as long as they are kept clean. They will also help prevent termites, bats, ants, mold etc..
Sorry to disagree ,but melting snow off the roof re-freezes in the spouting ,runs over the spouting & results in big icicles hanging from the spouting ,been there,............ still there.


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