Did I Make a Mistake on a Hitzer 30-95

BunkerdCaddis · Post by **BunkerdCaddis** » Tue. Sep. 08, 2015 7:18 pm

KingCoal wrote: oo,oo another "showtime" thread.

same drill, you guys save seats and drinks and i'll get the snacks.

I'll just drag the cooler over from the other one

Rob R. wrote:Stick to the topic.

Oooh Gibbs slap...

Post by **jremington** » Tue. Sep. 08, 2015 7:31 pm

You guys are a tough crew here, lol. Fred, I thought you said this was a nice group of people? You didn't tell me this was a shark tank......

Regarding the Comfort Max and the 92 efficiency, aren't these tests done by independent labs? I'm new to this. If there's something I don't know feel free to enlighten me. I do know it's a popular stove. We've sold quite a few since we opened.

As for being a salesman, I'm not. I was a contractor for thirty years, and started looking into Anthracite and stoves a couple years ago. Wood has gone real high here and we felt it might be the right time to try and get coal going again. It hasn't been burned in large scale here in 40 years or more. Basically the stoves sell themselves. And I think we are selling them for less than the manufacturers are charging in their own stores to get them out there again. We aren't out to make a killing on stoves. If we could get a thousand of them out there and supply them with coal for years to come we'd be happy.

Post by **Lightning** » Tue. Sep. 08, 2015 7:59 pm

jremington wrote:You guys are a tough crew here, lol. Fred, I thought you said this was a nice group of people? You didn't tell me this was a shark tank......

NO, Fred's right.. This is a nice group of people.
There are a few innocent rabble rousers

Thanks for taking my ribbing lightly, I really don't mean any harm.

And with that, we should stick with the topic as the moderator suggested..

rberq · Post by **rberq** » Tue. Sep. 08, 2015 8:18 pm

jremington wrote:If there's something I don't know feel free to enlighten me.

Lord knows I tried.

jremington wrote:You didn't tell me this was a shark tank......

Like Johnny Cash said, “Get tough or die”. (Folsom Prison Blues, The Boy Named Sue.)

jremington wrote: We aren't out to make a killing on stoves. If we could get a thousand of them out there and supply them with coal for years to come we'd be happy.

Sounds like a smart business plan. Take grouches like me with a grain of salt, keep in touch on the forum, and when I’m ready for my next stove, who knows, you might be the guy to ship it to me.

rberq · Post by **rberq** » Tue. Sep. 08, 2015 8:22 pm

Rob R. wrote:Stick to the topic.

Original topic is exhausted, the OP got good answers and now is hunkered down wondering what happened. We have progressed to the free association phase, as Mr. Freud would want us to.

bob15 · Post by **bob15** » Tue. Sep. 08, 2015 9:08 pm

rberq wrote:
Rob R. wrote:Stick to the topic.
Original topic is exhausted, the OP got good answers and now is hunkered down wondering what happened. We have progressed to the free association phase, as Mr. Freud would want us to.

This topic even at this point is still good. More info the better, and my second choice behind the Hitzer was the DS 1500 and we have actually touched on that topic in that past page or so. Getting more input on the DSM is a good thing.....they are cheaper than the Hizer and heavier.

And I'm on other forums that really go off on tangents. This site isn't so bad and stays pretty much stays in the same stadium.

Pacowy · Post by **Pacowy** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 12:18 am

Before we get too far from the earlier discussion, there is an issue I'm hoping some of the members can clarify for an old girlie-man stoker user. In the stoker world, many/most stokers can idle very slowly, so there is not a big downside to having abundant capacity. In other threads, though, hand-fired users have claimed that hand-fired stoves tend to throw more continuous radiant heat than do stokers, to the point that "windowstats" are sometimes used in lieu of thermostats (or rheostats) to control house temperatures. Here, despite the fact that the total area being heated was said to be 1300 sf (spread over 2 floors), hand-fired users seem to be advocating stoves that would blow away the incumbent wood stove, and be capable of heating a substantially larger area.

My ulterior motive here is that I have a Hitzer 30-95 in the garage that I expect to list for sale soon, and I'm trying to figure out the type of situation where that stove - and not some bigger one - would put a smile on the face of the person who bought it. Put in the OP's original terms, in what circumstances would a 30-95 be likely to produce reasonable performance, and not be viewed as a "mistake"?

Mike

SWPaDon · Post by **SWPaDon** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 1:04 am

Pacowy wrote:Before we get too far from the earlier discussion, there is an issue I'm hoping some of the members can clarify for an old girlie-man stoker user. In the stoker world, many/most stokers can idle very slowly, so there is not a big downside to having abundant capacity. In other threads, though, hand-fired users have claimed that hand-fired stoves tend to throw more continuous radiant heat than do stokers, to the point that "windowstats" are sometimes used in lieu of thermostats (or rheostats) to control house temperatures. Here, despite the fact that the total area being heated was said to be 1300 sf (spread over 2 floors), hand-fired users seem to be advocating stoves that would blow away the incumbent wood stove., and be capable of heating a substantially larger area.

My ulterior motive here is that I have a Hitzer 30-95 in the garage that I expect to list for sale soon, and I'm trying to figure out the type of situation where that stove - and not some bigger one - would put a smile on the face of the person who bought it. Put in the OP's original terms, in what circumstances would a 30-95 be likely to produce reasonable performance, and not be viewed as a "mistake"?

Mike

Personally, I think the 30-95 is suited for a smaller area than 1300 sq.ft.. I'm not saying it can't be done, but in my mind, it would require 6 inch walls and 6 inch insulation, new triple pane windows.....basically a very tight house(with combustion air available for the stove).

Not to confuse things, but every house is different. The air flows different in each one, and that alone will dictate the BTU's needed to heat said space. Not to mention that the difference between new construction, and the OP's old house is totally different..........and even the location of the house dictated how it was built(back in the day).

My house is a perfect example, it was built so that the air from the furnace will travel very easily from the basement, thru the first floor, up to the second floor............and all with the staircases being used as a cold air return. Makes for drafts in certain areas of the house, but I get good heat everywhere.

And to answer your initial question after all of that.............Don't tell anyone what you think it will heat, unless you are very familiar with all types of housing construction and the airflow needed to heat said home(this will save you grief in the long run). Just advertise it as it is, and let the customer decide what he needs.

Hope my rambling helped a little,
Don

ddahlgren · Post by **ddahlgren** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 4:33 am

KingCoal wrote:keep in mind that your 65,000 BTU wood stove was never putting out that much heat either and it never maintained it's heat output in anywhere near as constant a fashion as the coal stoves you are looking at will.

considering that you have probably been getting by on a good deal less than 35,000 BTUH you will probably be running in the lower third of the ability of the stoves you've been looking at.

that's a very good reserve, and you will have decent fuel economy at the same time.

steve

All the talk about heat vs. pounds burned got me curious enough to play with current costs. Right now with oil 2.05 a gallon it is cheaper than coal in CT at least SE CT and delivered cost on both. If you have an oil system you never use I am willing to bet if you go to use it you plug filters and nozzles endlessly as the oil forms algae when very old. They make things to help and have to do that every few months until finally gone. Right now the winner is wood in cost/btu by far with it's own set of downsides. Had the price of oil been under 2.40 it is just as cheap with oil as coal. I am going to keep my eyes on oil prices if down top off the tanks and burn that. If less money and much less work I fail to see the downside. Coal is expensive in CT right now.

freetown fred · Post by **freetown fred** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 4:42 am

Indeed the market is weird DD. I'll probably top off my kero. tank at some point here but will stick with coal. Thanx for the post!

rberq · Post by **rberq** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 8:19 am

Pacowy wrote: despite the fact that the total area being heated was said to be 1300 sf (spread over 2 floors), hand-fired users seem to be advocating stoves that would blow away the incumbent wood stove, and be capable of heating a substantially larger area.

I agree that a 50-93 sounds like overkill for 1300 sf. However, the OP said his 65K BTU wood stove does not even maintain adequate heat in the room where it is installed. Therefore, he either needs a bigger stove or more house-tightening and insulation. The "right" way is probably insulation, but that could be considerably more costly short term.

The fact his wood stove won't keep the immediate room warm is probably GOOD, because it means the heat is "escaping" to other areas of the house where it is needed. In other words, good heat circulation, rather than overheating one room while the others are cold.

Pacowy · Post by **Pacowy** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 8:20 am

SWPaDon wrote:Personally, I think the 30-95 is suited for a smaller area than 1300 sq.ft.. I'm not saying it can't be done, but in my mind, it would require 6 inch walls and 6 inch insulation, new triple pane windows.....basically a very tight house(with combustion air available for the stove).

Not to confuse things, but every house is different. The air flows different in each one, and that alone will dictate the BTU's needed to heat said space. Not to mention that the difference between new construction, and the OP's old house is totally different..........and even the location of the house dictated how it was built(back in the day).

My house is a perfect example, it was built so that the air from the furnace will travel very easily from the basement, thru the first floor, up to the second floor............and all with the staircases being used as a cold air return. Makes for drafts in certain areas of the house, but I get good heat everywhere.

And to answer your initial question after all of that.............Don't tell anyone what you think it will heat, unless you are very familiar with all types of housing construction and the airflow needed to heat said home(this will save you grief in the long run). Just advertise it as it is, and let the customer decide what he needs.

Hope my rambling helped a little,
Don

Thanks, Don.

Mike

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 8:38 am

I'll throw in another vote for a large coal stove verses one that may be too small. It's not like having too big a wood stove.

Unlike a big wood stove, where they don't burn as clean and efficiently when idled down, the coal stove can be idled way down, yet still maintains a steady, clean burning fire. When idled back, it'll just run that much longer on a load of coal.

Paul

BunkerdCaddis · Post by **BunkerdCaddis** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 9:01 am

Pacowy wrote: My ulterior motive here is that I have a Hitzer 30-95 in the garage that I expect to list for sale soon, and I'm trying to figure out the type of situation where that stove - and not some bigger one - would put a smile on the face...

Mike

Mike I've been trying to organize my thoughts on a concept in response to your question but I'll probably end up rambling, but the idea of "staged heating" w/ hand fired stoves is what I'm thinking. We moved into our house 4 years ago and I knew from the start the hydronic system needed rezoning. After the hard winter 2 years ago I also knew I needed another fuel source. Money was tight from the amount of oil we had to burn that winter and about all I could afford was the short triple wall chimney we put in the sun room for a wood stove/ coal stove. We had a small box coal heater on hand so I installed that and after the learning curve my success was so great I've gone full blown coal crazy. The draw back to the small stove and where it is of course is getting heat to remote areas of the house Umm what to do... need a better heat distribution system ... ahh yes boiler, so I bought a WC-90 to put in and that's where I am now. Where does the small stove fit in? well by my calcs the boiler should be big enough but we all hedge our bets and in those spells of cold weather I can shed the center mass of the house right to the little stove, have all the joy of sitting around a cozy coal fire on a cold night and my bathrooms and bedrooms will still be nice and comfortable. In a house w/ just hand fired stoves 2 smaller stoves could be staged in different areas and accomplish the same thing. sorry for the ramble...

bob15 · Post by **bob15** » Wed. Sep. 09, 2015 9:18 am

Here are a couple other thoughts with regards to my house.

The cellar temp in the winter will go to 40°F. This happens even with a solid door and insulation between the basement and the Bilco hatchway door. The floor joist's have insulation between them in the basement, but the cold in the cellar makes the 1st floor cool/can-be cold. This can hurt heating the house.

Exterior walls are insulated, though in 1972. Could they be better insulated? Probably. But that would require stripping the aluminum siding off and re-siding. That isn't going to happen.....too expensive for possible little to no real gain. Low E glass windows, installed 9 years ago.

When burning the stove on the bitter cold spells (high temp in low teens), I must keep the stove door cracked to get the hotter draft in the stove. the catch with running a stove like that is that you won't get a complete burn of the wood. Instead of all ashes, you will also get charcoal as well. I was told at the one stove place that when you get a stove near it's max output, you can also get similar results (incomplete burn).

bob