Pictures of your stove

Oo-v-oO · By: **Oo-v-oO** On: Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:18 am

Nice work!

That PLC sure is small. Do you do industrial controls? I'm most familar with Automation Direct stuff but I've heard of Crouzet.

The closest I've done to our hand-fired Ashley is to wire up a temperature controller reading a type J thermocouple on the back of the stove. The output from the temp controller runs through an external time delay relay to control the air circulation fan on the back of the stove as well as a couple of fans that blow air upstairs through a register.

Looks like a very well thought out system you have. :thumbleft:

davemich · By: **davemich** On: Mon Jan 15, 2007 7:56 am

Welcome Bill...great job on the stove and the thermostat. I am amazed at all of the folks on this site that are so ingenious! Maybe its that I'm so much of a yellow pages guy!! Keep warm! Dave

coaledsweat · By: **coaledsweat** On: Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:42 am

Automation Direct is a very big player.

That is nice, I was wondering when I'd see a PLC set up on one of these.

Highlander · By: **Highlander** On: Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:43 am

Thanks to all that responded.

The PLC is a Crouzet Millenium 2, the second generation of this line. I work for an electrical distributer and Crouzet is one of our lines. I design and program automation controls systems as a applications engineer.

There are a couple of neat things about this unit. First, it has a built in 4 line baclit LCD that can be used for simple operator interface. It also has the ability to dedicate some of its DC inputs to monitor an analog signal, albeit with only 8 bits of resolution. The relay outputs are fairly substantial handling 8 amps each.

If it has a down side, it would be the programming language. It uses a graphical format with small symbols for all the common functions. You place them on the page and draw lines representing wires inbetween all the inputs and outputs. For small programs its fine, but when they get larger it gets kind of messy, but it wasn't hard to learn, and the simulation mode works well for debugging purposes.

I am familiar with Automation direct, did a lot of work with there 405 series in a previous job, they are good controllers too. This unit was from an engineering evaluaiton kit we had, thats where the row of switches and potentiometer came from.

Cap · By: **Cap** On: Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:13 pm

Hello List--

I posted my old Harman Mark III here last year. But it has since moved on to a new home and I have installed the mighty Harman SF-250 Hand Fired Free Standing stove. This is Harman's largest hand fired unit.

I installed the optional heat accumulator so I could pipe the hot air into the main living area from out of the basement. This was a HUGE improvement over the Mark III & Harman's other smaller hand fired models as they offer no such option.

I installed a 6" 304 TI liner to improve draft. I designed and installed a 304 .75" x .065" stainless steel water coil in order to heat the domestic water tank. There is a Grundfos circulation pump on the coil for improved water heating efficiency.

Lastly, I installed Ashcroft industrial style thermometers in several places. I have a 400-1200F sensing firebox temps ( not very effective as fresh coal on top will lower firebox temp but continue to pump out warm air. But I have seen this temp settle down at a toasty 750F 8hrs into a burn. ).
I have a 50-550F on the stack, 50-300F on the heat accumulator, 0-200F with 12" probe inserted into water tank.

I guess I enjoy *operating* my stove, and warm my home as an after thought? Not really, but it's fun.

coaledsweat · By: **coaledsweat** On: Tue Jan 16, 2007 10:11 pm

That is a very nice install.

I love the big gauges, I could still read them when I forget my glasses.

coalkirk · By: **coalkirk** On: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:07 pm

It was 15 here this morning. Boiler at 140, tempered water to heat exchanger 95, return water from heater exchanger 90, warm house...priceless!

LsFarm · By: **LsFarm** On: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:20 pm

Coalkirk, what air temperatures do you get from 90* water in your heat exchanger? KTM rider and I have been bouncing around the ideal of a clothes dryer using a water-to-air heat exhanger. I think we would want at least 120-140* air.

Thanks, Greg L

Cap, I am so jealous of that scrap and waste bin you can scrounge through for all your instruments, piping and valves...

Nice install!!

Greg L

coaledsweat · By: **coaledsweat** On: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:25 pm

You want about 155F.

LsFarm · By: **LsFarm** On: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:25 pm

Coaledsweat, do you mean 155* for drying clothes?? Wow, that's pretty hot, I lasered my dryer's inside drum and came up with the 120-140* it varied depending on the dryer's settings and if the clothes were dry or not.

Lets see, 155* will probably require 180* water, so maybe we could get by with 120* air temp from 140* water, and just run the dryer longer to get the same amount of drying??

KTM has three kids, and a fairly high electric bill. I'm just currious.

thanks for the input, Greg L

coalkirk · By: **coalkirk** On: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:06 pm

Greg,

With 95 degree water to my heat exchanger (90 return) the air temp out of the air handler is 81 degrees. I'm heating 3 levels through a well designed duct system (lots of returns) and I keep the circulator fan running constantly. The 81 degrees doesn't sound very warm but it's constant. My return air is at 70 degrees.
I control my house temp mostly by adjusting the tempering valve to the heat exchanger. If I were alittle more savvy with controls, I could put a motorized control on my mixing valve that would connect to a thermostat and make the adjustment automatically.
If it is cold and windy, I have to bump the water temp up accordingly.

coaledsweat · By: **coaledsweat** On: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:16 pm

When I had steam dryers 155F was about as much as we could squeeze out of a double coil (two coils back to back @110# of steam) you would get about 155F. we run the gas jobs to 450-475F. The drum doesn't catch up to the air temp.
Actually you don't need heat to dry clothes, the reason you heat the air is hot air will hold more water and it shortens the drying time. The steam dryers would do a load in about 20-25 minutes, the gas is done in 5-7 minutes.

EDIT: Oops, sorry it's been 10 years since I've had a steam dryer here. The #155 is the rise over ambient temperature. In other words if the room air is 70F, the first coil would bring the air up to 170F or so and the second would add another 50F to total about 210F.

Berlin · By: **Berlin** On: Thu Jan 18, 2007 3:52 am

my stove paint looks crappy from the flash, it is pretty basic, but looks a bit better in person. these pics were taken soon after a reload with fresh coal.

Mound City · By: **Mound City** On: Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:28 am

Hi Berlin,

That's a fantastic looking bitum burning stove! Thanks for posting the pics as I can now visualize how your stove should look when it's built.

Did you load the coal through the top door or front?

Berlin · By: **Berlin** On: Thu Jan 18, 2007 5:58 am

front door is just for viewing the fire through the glass, i load through the top only. you may want to use something other than rebar for the handles and/or cover the ends with wood to improve the looks a bit, i just haven't got around to it on mine. btw, thanks, you'll have to get one built