Controling Heat Output; 16" Firepot Baseheater

Sunny Boy wrote:
+1.

With a chimney that drifts that well, just block off the chimney flue around the stove pipe by packing fiberglass insulation around the pipe and you should be fine.

I'd still recommend one of these, no matter what coal stove you do get. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B009PAN3C8/ref=biss_dp_t_asn

Paul

I won't argue that, but his fireplace tells the tale. If he can light that in the summer, without choking themselves out of the house.............run with it!
And keep the caps on the chimney...........................not only do I suggest that, but I also suggest that if they ever need replaced, measure everything now and duplicate it exactly in the future!

It took me 4 or 5 tries to get my chimney cap to the right height to get it to draw correctly during the downdrafts I get with Easterly winds. Someone either got really lucky with your flue, or did a hell of a lot of experimentation to get it to draft the way it is.

Respectfully disagree with Paul and Don.

1. On a really cold day that chimney will cold soak.
2. When the already "cool" gasses of a BB come out of the stovepipe and enter that large of a flue they are going to expand and cool off even more, condense somewhat and decrease draft.
3. Odds are his strict code inspector will actually read his install instructions (If he installs a UL listed stove) and never let a flue with that large of a cross sectional area pass.
4. The correct size flue (6in) all the way to the top will result in overall superior opreating results, period.

If it were me....Id drop down rigid AL29 SS pipe, fill the space around it with vermiculite, and put a three foot decorative terra cotta extension with a cap.

But that's just me

scalabro wrote:Respectfully disagree with Paul and Don.

1. On a really cold day that chimney will cold soak.
2. When the already "cool" gasses of a BB come out of the stovepipe and enter that large of a flue they are going to expand and cool off even more, condense somewhat and decrease draft.
3. Odds are his strict code inspector will actually read his install instructions (If he installs a UL listed stove) and never let a flue with that large of a cross sectional area pass.
4. The correct size flue (6in) all the way to the top will result in overall superior opreating results, period.

If it were me....Id drop down rigid AL29 SS pipe, fill the space around it with vermiculite, and put a three foot decorative terra cotta extension with a cap.

But that's just me

i personally am in full agreement with this solution. a time consuming and probably more expensive alternative being a poured refractory liner of 6" dia.

$ .02

The only drawback to a poured or terra cotta system is that they are permanent. Chris or other owners down the road may simply prefer a fireplace. The AL29 option gives you both options

Sounds like good advice.

Respectfully,
If that's what Chris needs for really cold weather, then my unlined brick chimney, which has even more of it's length exposed to the outside, with far less thermal mass to insulate the flue..... shouldn't work either with just the little bit of flue gas heat volume from my range.

My range has less than half the firebed heat volume capacity of a G6 and more heat extraction surface area by the time the flue gases get to the chimney.... a chimney that is more than 300% greater in cross section than a 6 inch stove pipe. Typically running stack skin temps of 105F to 120F at night and around 150F during the day when I'm not cooking/baking.

So, if oversized, unlined masonry, outside chimneys won't draw well in very cold weather, why does mine need a check damper open to slow it down at night on anything colder than 40 F outside ? And why does it continue to draw fine at barely above 100F stack temps only a few feet above the stove collar and .005 mano all night long with check damper open ?

And that's while fighting the stack affect of three stories of old, uninsulated, leaky, Victorian house.

Paul

I personally would never entertain the thought of changing the chimney, unless it was forced by an inspector, or the baseburner didn't work at all. The latter I don't think will happen.

Sunny Boy wrote:Sounds like good advice.

Respectfully,
If that's what Chris needs for really cold weather, then my unlined brick chimney, which has even more of it's length exposed to the outside, with far less thermal mass to insulate the flue..... shouldn't work either with just the little bit of flue gas heat volume from my range.

My range has less than half the firebed heat volume capacity of a G6 and more heat extraction surface area by the time the flue gases get to the chimney.... a chimney that is more than 300% greater in cross section than a 6 inch stove pipe. Typically running stack skin temps of 105F to 120F at night and around 150F during the day when I'm not cooking/baking.

So, if oversized, unlined masonry, outside chimneys won't draw well in very cold weather, why does mine need a check damper open to slow it down at night on anything colder than 40 F outside ? And why does it continue to draw fine at barely above 100F stack temps only a few feet above the stove collar and .005 mano all night long with check damper open ?

And that's while fighting the stack affect of three stories of old, uninsulated, leaky, Victorian house.

Paul

on the basis of this account I retract my comment and promote getting and firing the desired stove under current conditions and if found to need adjustments do them as they come up.

i do still wonder why makers are putting advise in their install guides not to increase flue dia. by more than x% of the stove exit collar ? I always thought it was one of those functional "principles".

It is KC.

Paul, what is the cross sectional area of your flue that the range runs on?

If it's large, even though you say you get good results, a six inch insulated flue will deliver overall better performance and efficiency. It's impossible not to

I agree, IF the inspector allows him to run a pipe a few feet into the flue and it works, run with it.

The downside is the aggravation of having to do it over

Scott,

90 square inches inside the chimney, top to bottom. Built for a coal range and a coal hot water heater in the basement, but only the coal range is using it. The basement thimble is capped off.

Why would I need it to work better when it draws fine up into the low 80F range of outdoor temps ? And in below zero temps, I have to run with primaries barely open and MPD fully closed just to get it below .04 mano and not have the top plates glowing red.

In other words, I often need to use the check damper because the draft is too good.

If I had my #6, with it's much greater firebed heat volume plumbed into this chimney,...... I'd have to keep the cat out of the kitchen !

Paul

Well....you could run the range and bake an apple pie on July fourth when it's 100* F outside

Lets standby and see what his code guy does.....

Sunny Boy, we had the basic same chimney in the farm house on my in -laws farm ,it worked with venting wood smoke piped into the fireplace.

Dave,

The old saying that, "The old timers knew a thing or two. " gets proven time and again by the antique stoves we use. And for those of us with houses from that time period, how and to what they installed them, too.

We forget that the old timers had fewer labor saving devices than we have today. They had a lot of hard work to do and didn't want to work any harder or longer than they had to. And they were rather frugal. They knew a lot about how best to heat with stoves and build chimneys because that technology was used in every building and had been for centuries of finding out what worked and what didn't.

For all our knowledge and advancements, we've forgotten much of what was common knowledge to our ancestors.

Paul

good point and I may have something to add to that idea when I get home to survey the results of my latest stove setting experiment, that has been running unattended since 6:30 am.

it will be either:

1) great success and satisfaction

2) draft reversal and CO detectors screaming at the dead cat.

3) the smoldering ruins of my former home.

we'll see..................................................................

KingCoal wrote:good point and I may have something to add to that idea when I get home to survey the results of my latest stove setting experiment, that has been running unattended since 6:30 am.

it will be either:

1) great success and satisfaction

2) draft reversal and CO detectors screaming at the dead cat.

3) the smoldering ruins of my former home.

we'll see..................................................................

If you were starting to build a stove from scratch I'd be worried, Steve.

However, your adding old, well tested technology to a tried and proven performer of a stove, the combination of which you've already tested. And your using a known chimney. I'd be far less worried knowing that.

Paul

A Glenwood No. 6 is just perfect for this application. You are having the normal pre stove jitters. I know it's a big commitment and there are a million apprehensions.
That's what the kind and knowledgeable staff here at NEPA is here for. And yes, to answer your question. You can control any base heater to just simmer along indefinitely. Mine has been running at about 200 on the barrel constantly for a week. Only a few shovel fulls a day are necessary to keep it running. I have it in base burner mode with the chimney damper shut at 3/4 and the check damper open about an 1/8th of an inch or so.
Now the next few days are going to be cool, I will just open it up, add some coal, shake it down really good and reset the dampers.
That's it.
So do your homework and don't worry. You are on the correct path to coal burning nirvana.