50-93 With No Hopper

BlackBetty06 wrote:OK dang I just had an interesting phone conversation with The lady at Hitzer. Hopefully no one gets a chapped ass over this. I called and told them how I am running my stove. she said I essentially am running a top load 354. I asked about the hopper acting as a baffle she said the hopper is there to provide storage for extra coal. I said I have a manual pipe damper that I'm running almost completely closed. she said we recommend everyone of our stoves having a manual pipe damper installed. I said am I losing a lot of efficiency with the hopper removed she said no since you have the damper installed. This is the conversation I had with Hitzer and the questions I asked. if any of you guys are bored tomorrow that have 50-93 or 30-95 stoves you can call up and present the same question and see if we get the same answer .

Hitzer- 260-589-8536

Everything you've been told is not wrong, except the part of the hopper not acting as a baffle. YES, the hopper is coal storage. However, it IS also acting as a baffle. The exhaust has to go around the hopper before it exits the exhaust. That's what baffles do. They make the exhaust take a longer path, and not go directly out the exhaust.

In a way, the manual pipe damper is acting as a baffle as well. The gasses have to go around it. The hopper baffle scrubs more BTU's, as the gasses have a longer path to flow.

I'll agree with that but it may not be as big of a baffle as we all think. I've been looking at the thing while it sits on my hearth and it has a pretty good slope on it that slopes from the back to the front leaving plenty of room at the flue outlet. I was under the impression also that it was a baffle but the lady I spoke to says otherwise.....

Sooooo BB, ya finally had somebody tell ya what ya wanted to hear. I think OP made a good point about the hopper. My personal comments were about the hopper distributing the coal equally. PS--HITZER don't need to have their time wasted by other 50-93 owners calling & asking the same questions you did. ( not that I think any of us would) Hell, I believe ya Point being, ya turned your 50-93 into another HITZER model & that's cool if you're happy with the results..

I Didn't make the call for someone to tell me that everything is going to be ok lol. I was on a drive and was thinking about what I'm doing and figured it was a good way to pass some time. Who better to ask than the people that build the thing. Just sharing what I was told with the questions I asked. I'm neither happy nor upset with the hopper. It is what it is. Nothing ventured nothing gained is my motto

Gian4

BlackBetty06 wrote:I'll agree with that but it may not be as big of a baffle as we all think. I've been looking at the thing while it sits on my hearth and it has a pretty good slope on it that slopes from the back to the front leaving plenty of room at the flue outlet. I was under the impression also that it was a baffle but the lady I spoke to says otherwise.....

Notice I said the hopper was "Acting" as a baffle. I never said it is a baffle. Let me word this differently. If the hopper was in place, you wouldn't need the manual damper. The heat is concentrated out front of the hopper, below the finned heat exchanger. The exhaust has to go "Around the hopper" in order to exit the stove. An actual baffle does the same thing. It makes the gasses travel a further path before exiting the stove..

Im glad its working for you Betty. Maybe its a 50-92.5 hitzer

Let the dancing blue ladies tell you the story. If they head straight up the chimney the MPD isnt a good baffle. If they dance like the drunk girls in California then the MPD works good as a baffle. Thats my scientific way to tell

But like Fred said, its cool if your happy with the results.

BlackBetty06 wrote:Dave the newer model 50-93 like my stove has a removable hopper design. It slides in on a little "rail" and is held in with a bolt and washed. Previous models like FF has DO NOT have a removable hopper. To remove it would require a cutting torch and grinder.

I wonder how my 50-93 will perform minus the hopper? I wonder if it is in the way like Oliver has stated?

Sounds like my 503 hopper .. allows bit to the burned (via removal of the hopper) ...

[quote="warminmn"]Running your 50-93 this way does have one advantage over the other large Hitzer and that is the top load so you don't have to open the front door and shovel it in, or maybe that doesnt work well dumping from the top?

From prior post in thread ^^^^

Hmmmm never thought of that aspect ... I suppose my Hitzer 503 could operate the same way......anyone run their 503 like this?

May start a new thread relating to the 503 operation using anthracite w/o the hopper to avoid hijacking this one ... I'll link the new thread in this one after I make it...

Hitzer 503 Oper8Tors -- Run W/Antracite and W/O Hopper?

^^^ Here it is .. new thread about 503 operation

warminmn wrote:Im glad its working for you Betty. Maybe its a 50-92.5 hitzer

Let the dancing blue ladies tell you the story. If they head straight up the chimney the MPD isnt a good baffle. If they dance like the drunk girls in California then the MPD works good as a baffle. Thats my scientific way to tell

But like Fred said, its cool if your happy with the results.

I'll put it this way. When I first reload and have full air going and everything is agitated from a fresh shake, the blue ladies look like college girls running to the frat house. After a good 45 min to an hour, they look like the drunk girls in California lol!

Oliver, makes perfect sense what you are saying.

Update: burned without a hopper for week. Then re installed the hopper and burned for a week. Tried other suggestions such as poking from inside the hopper, pushing more coal out the bottom of the hopper etc. Same coal usage. Same draft readings. Stack temps within 20-30 degrees of each other. Sides of the firebox WITH the hopper installed would ash up on me and go out almost every day. Id have to rake all the ashes down, let fresh coal get over there, and then wait a few hours till the sides re ignited and started producing heat again. My hopper level NEVER has gone down on its own in the two years ive owned the stove. I know the theory is that as the coal burns to ash, it settles and fresh coal comes down to replace it. This has never happened for me. The only way it drops is to shake the grates. Maybe being vented into a 12x12 chimney has an affect on it somehow. Maybe its the stockton coal. Heck I don't know. Pulled the hopper back out two days ago. Dumped an additional bucket of coal on the fire. Nice even heat since. Who knows I did make my own baffle of sorts with three pieces of 3/8" plate steel. Works pretty good. Flames go straight up. Top of stove runs a little hotter than when the hopper is in. Currently stove body is between 390-415 measured with my IR gun. Stack temp is 125. MPD almost completely closed. Draft -.04" Stove takes an extra 5 minutes for the coal to light up since its not pre heated. I still feed it from the top so my actual tending times are faster than with the hopper since I don't have to poke, rake, prod, etc.... These are my final results. Im anxious to hook it up to my smaller chimney in the next year or two and see how much of a difference there is/ isnt in stove tending and behavior.

BlackBetty06 wrote:Update: burned without a hopper for week. Then re installed the hopper and burned for a week. Tried other suggestions such as poking from inside the hopper, pushing more coal out the bottom of the hopper etc. Same coal usage. Same draft readings. Stack temps within 20-30 degrees of each other. Sides of the firebox WITH the hopper installed would ash up on me and go out almost every day. Id have to rake all the ashes down, let fresh coal get over there, and then wait a few hours till the sides re ignited and started producing heat again. My hopper level NEVER has gone down on its own in the two years ive owned the stove. I know the theory is that as the coal burns to ash, it settles and fresh coal comes down to replace it. This has never happened for me. The only way it drops is to shake the grates. Maybe being vented into a 12x12 chimney has an affect on it somehow. Maybe its the stockton coal. Heck I don't know. Pulled the hopper back out two days ago. Dumped an additional bucket of coal on the fire. Nice even heat since. Who knows I did make my own baffle of sorts with three pieces of 3/8" plate steel. Works pretty good. Flames go straight up. Top of stove runs a little hotter than when the hopper is in. Currently stove body is between 390-415 measured with my IR gun. Stack temp is 125. MPD almost completely closed. Draft -.04" Stove takes an extra 5 minutes for the coal to light up since its not pre heated. I still feed it from the top so my actual tending times are faster than with the hopper since I don't have to poke, rake, prod, etc.... These are my final results. Im anxious to hook it up to my smaller chimney in the next year or two and see how much of a difference there is/ isnt in stove tending and behavior.

Sounds like you've got a handle on things. So, are you happy with the stove?

With all due respect; never really figured any advantage to a hopper style unit, other than an expeditious tending. Hell, ya seem to sacrifice coal burning area due to hopper, the hopper also impedes proper poking & raking of the coal bed & unless you are stressfully employed, what's the point??? I actually enjoy experimenting with my hand fed boiler. Been 4 years now & still tinkering. & enjoying every minute of it!! Personally, to give me a hopper unit, would be the likens of depriving me of personal entertainment. Oh well, each to their own liken.
Jim

Of course ya like it Jim, you're a tinkerer!

Yes OP I am happy with the stove. Construction is high quality. The bi metallic and manual draft is nice. The top feed is quite handy. I don't know but the hopper just seems to be a bit of a nuisance. Maybe I'm not running the old girl right. I do know it's heating my house just fine. Had I known I probably would have just bought the 354. However then I couldn't top load

Also for you Hitzer fans and or owners, do any of you know what the baffle inside the 354 looks like