Wings Best Holes at Ash Drawer
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- New Member
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- Joined: Fri. Jan. 27, 2017 8:51 pm
- Location: Maine
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Wing's Best 116x-Herald Oak 14-P&B Big Seven
- Other Heating: Wood
I recently picked up a Wing's Best 116x that needed a little work, but is in decent shape. I have a few questions before I put it back together and fire it up. the first question is, what are the two small holes that go through the side of the ash drawer? I can't imagine they are for air, so would there have been possibly a wire shelf for the shaker handle to rest on? I will probably use them for that anyway. Also, I see a lot of stoves with refractory cement in the fire pot as this one did. I have removed it to completely inspect the condition, with the intention of replacing it. I have 2 other stoves, one with cement, and one without. The one without seemed to do a better job heating and burning continuously while the one with cement has a habit of dying after three days from sudden ash death. Since these stoves were not designed for refractory cement, is it just an insurance
policy? And the last question is, inside there seems to be missing parts, like a "gas ring" above the fire pot, and something that attached to the frame around the smoke exhaust hole. Any ideas? Thanks
policy? And the last question is, inside there seems to be missing parts, like a "gas ring" above the fire pot, and something that attached to the frame around the smoke exhaust hole. Any ideas? Thanks
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- Location: Chester, NY
- Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Invader 2
- Baseburners & Antiques: Wings Best, Glenwood #8(x2) Herald 116x
- Coal Size/Type: Rice,
- Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22
Welcome to the board my friend and as as a fellow WB owner I would like to add my congrats, nice stove indeed. I am having a little trouble envisioning the issues. The gas ring thing I understand and we can direct you to a source for those parts but I, at least, need some pics. Can you send us some?
Conventional wisdom here is yes, do use refractory cement, things will just last longer and it is not so tough to apply. Having said that I do have Red Cross Garnet #48 that has been used for 100 years+ continuously apparently and I do not use this lining and it appears fine. In bitchen weather it runs real hard here so I like you I wonder a little. On balance I would tend to say use it.
Conventional wisdom here is yes, do use refractory cement, things will just last longer and it is not so tough to apply. Having said that I do have Red Cross Garnet #48 that has been used for 100 years+ continuously apparently and I do not use this lining and it appears fine. In bitchen weather it runs real hard here so I like you I wonder a little. On balance I would tend to say use it.
- Sunny Boy
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Welcome LB.
YES ! Pictures could help ...............
................... and even if we can't help, we still love seeing pictures of coal stoves.
I would add that having a refractory liner in a stove like yours will help it maintain a fire better whenever it's dampered down for lower heat output during the warmer weather of the "shoulder months" - those months at the beginning and end of the heating season.
Paul
YES ! Pictures could help ...............
................... and even if we can't help, we still love seeing pictures of coal stoves.
I would add that having a refractory liner in a stove like yours will help it maintain a fire better whenever it's dampered down for lower heat output during the warmer weather of the "shoulder months" - those months at the beginning and end of the heating season.
Paul
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hi, the holes in the side are from the oil tubes that were installed when it was converted to kero. probably in the mid 40s there should be a hole in the bottom as well that held the burner in place. good Idea for the shaker handle... Wilson
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What did they do have some sort of wick burner?wilsons woodstoves wrote:hi, the holes in the side are from the oil tubes that were installed when it was converted to kero. probably in the mid 40s there should be a hole in the bottom as well that held the burner in place. good Idea for the shaker handle... Wilson
- dlj
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- Location: Monroe, NY
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Vermont Castings Resolute
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The question of refractory cement has only been lightly debated here. There are proponents of using it. I'm not sure there are avid proponents to not use it. The refractory clearly protects the cast iron fire pot. In other combustion technologies, there is a significant benefit to using a refractory insulator in the combustion chamber. However, in these naturally aspirated stoves it's not so clear, at least to me. I ran my Glenwood for many years without a refractory liner. When I took it to get restored a number of years ago, Emery told me he'd never seen a fire pot in better shape than mine. That was after a solid 75 years of use. When he restored the stove, he put a refractory liner in it, which it still has today. I've always felt it ran better before the liner was put in, although the difference is only subtle. I feel it gave better heat before, especially on the high end of running. I'm eventually going to remove the liner from my stove but I want to get some "numbers" on it's performance now to compare with it's performance after removal, but, I have many things to do and little time so... it's been on the far back burner... The stove runs just fine as is... The restoration job that Emery did was fantastic!lbaker wrote: Also, I see a lot of stoves with refractory cement in the fire pot as this one did. I have removed it to completely inspect the condition, with the intention of replacing it. I have 2 other stoves, one with cement, and one without. The one without seemed to do a better job heating and burning continuously while the one with cement has a habit of dying after three days from sudden ash death. Since these stoves were not designed for refractory cement, is it just an insurance
policy? And the last question is, inside there seems to be missing parts, like a "gas ring" above the fire pot, and something that attached to the frame around the smoke exhaust hole. Any ideas? Thanks
I also think that the older stoves may have used different thicknesses/cast iron formulas for the fire pots. The Glenwood for example, was originally sold both with and without a refractory liner. Mine was one of those that was sold without the liner. I've never had the opportunity to closely examine the Glenwood #6 that was known to have had the refractory liner at original manufacture and compare it to my firepot. I think it would be interesting to see if there was a difference in the casting. The question of metal composition has also been an interesting one for me. There are a range of grey iron formulas and some are very resistant to heat in the fire region. My Vermont castings stove was built originally as a coal stove and the composition of the cast iron used in that stove is not the same as the cast iron formula that was used in the Vermont models sold for wood burning.
So I guess this is a long way of saying, if you want to take the refractory liner out, go for it. The stove will likely run just fine without...
dj
- Sunny Boy
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- Location: Central NY
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
- Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
- Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Dave
My # 6 had the original Glenwood molded fire clay bricks in it when I bought it from Wilson. Other than light rust between the bricks and pot, the pot is in good shape.
I can mic the pot thickness as far down as about two inches from the top edge. Is that what your looking for ?
Paul
My # 6 had the original Glenwood molded fire clay bricks in it when I bought it from Wilson. Other than light rust between the bricks and pot, the pot is in good shape.
I can mic the pot thickness as far down as about two inches from the top edge. Is that what your looking for ?
Paul
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- Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
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- Baseburners & Antiques: Wings Best, Glenwood #8(x2) Herald 116x
- Coal Size/Type: Rice,
- Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22
Perhaps Trump will make this a hanging offense. Or better yet, locked in a cell in Gitmo with Madonna and Rosie.hi, the holes in the side are from the oil tubes that were installed when it was converted to kero. probably in the mid 40s there should be a hole in the bottom as well that held the burner in place.
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no, no, just kill me now !!coalnewbie wrote:Perhaps Trump will make this a hanging offense. Or better yet, locked in a cell in Gitmo with Madonna and Rosie.hi, the holes in the side are from the oil tubes that were installed when it was converted to kero. probably in the mid 40s there should be a hole in the bottom as well that held the burner in place.
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That's a bit off the wall for me..coalnewbie wrote:Perhaps Trump will make this a hanging offense. Or better yet, locked in a cell in Gitmo with Madonna and Rosie.hi, the holes in the side are from the oil tubes that were installed when it was converted to kero. probably in the mid 40s there should be a hole in the bottom as well that held the burner in place.
- wsherrick
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Excellent. If the offender is put in a cell with those two he will save us the bother of hanging him since he will surely hang himself.coalnewbie wrote:Perhaps Trump will make this a hanging offense. Or better yet, locked in a cell in Gitmo with Madonna and Rosie.hi, the holes in the side are from the oil tubes that were installed when it was converted to kero. probably in the mid 40s there should be a hole in the bottom as well that held the burner in place.
- wsherrick
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- Coal Size/Type: Chestnut, Stove Size
I would strongly recommend the liner.
I have seen many, many fire pots that were ruined due to overheating. The liner protects against accidental abuse and once the fire is up to speed it increases combustion efficiency.
The choice is yours, however.
I would say how the stove is used would make a difference. If it was used only lightly a liner might be left out of it. If it is used constantly as most of the people here use their stoves then I would insist on a liner.
The main concern is that you insure all of the seams are absolutely sealed and the doors fit tight all around. The ash pit door is especially important.
And I want to congratulate you on an excellent, excellent stove find. These are among the most efficient, well designed stoves ever made. They like the other stoves of this type are also very easy to use and maintain.
I have seen many, many fire pots that were ruined due to overheating. The liner protects against accidental abuse and once the fire is up to speed it increases combustion efficiency.
The choice is yours, however.
I would say how the stove is used would make a difference. If it was used only lightly a liner might be left out of it. If it is used constantly as most of the people here use their stoves then I would insist on a liner.
The main concern is that you insure all of the seams are absolutely sealed and the doors fit tight all around. The ash pit door is especially important.
And I want to congratulate you on an excellent, excellent stove find. These are among the most efficient, well designed stoves ever made. They like the other stoves of this type are also very easy to use and maintain.
- Sunny Boy
- Member
- Posts: 25547
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
- Location: Central NY
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
- Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
- Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
BTW, those holes will have to be plugged, or they will very likely affect how controllable the stove is.
Washers and a bolt and nut can work until you decide on a more permanent fix.
Paul
Washers and a bolt and nut can work until you decide on a more permanent fix.
Paul
- joeq
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Another welcome to the club LB. It appears by your profile, you're not new to this coal burning arena. Would be nice to see your stoves, once you figure out the posting game. Good luck.
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- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Wing's Best 116x-Herald Oak 14-P&B Big Seven
- Other Heating: Wood
Thanks for all the information. I was at "Bryant's Coal Stoves" today (Thorndike, Maine) and had a couple minor cracks welded up. The idea of the holes being for kero. also seems to be their thought as well. This fire pot in the Wing's Best is 3/8" thick, thinner than the P&B Big Seven which is very stout. So I will put refractory cement in it. Has anyone used "fire putty" which is good to 2k deg? It's premixed and is hammered in place.